urww

I was about to book a ticket when I noticed something that really surprised me. For a Monday flight in March SLC-HNL is operated by A330-300 and an entire F class cabin is empty as of now. I know it's still 2 months out, but I can't recall anything like that ever before. Is that ordinary occasion on that route with light load of paid F for a large 333 cabin or what? I'm not familiar with the market, so that's a reason why I'm asking here. As of now for me it looks like almost 100% guarantee that my comp upgrade would clear, but maybe I don't know something and 30 Utahans would come and buy all the seats 1 months out .

MSPeconomist

Have you looked at fare class availability on EF or elsewhere? It's possible that a group (including tickets booked with a cruise) have purchased a bunch of FC seats but haven't yet done seat assignments.

bretthexum

I was just on SLC-HNL a few days ago and it sold out full. Even with a RUC I still missed the upgrade. A lot depends on the time of year I think... right now is prime time.

RealHJ

A330s and 767s to HNL F/J (ATL/MSP/SLC) is always full (nothing to do with time of year, there is far less capacity than demand on these routes, so it's always 100% full). Very difficult to buy unless you buy more than 3 months out. Closer in than 3 months you need to be very flexible with dates as by a month, two months out many dates it's completely full. Anyone trying to use an upgrade cert on these routes to HNL is, frankly, delusional thinking they will ever get anything, as it's practically always fully sold out, many weeks in advance.

minnyfly

Quire rare to see an empty HNL F cabin this close in. However I wouldn't expect to it to stay that way long enough for a comp upgrade.

brazzleman

I used RUC's out of SLC last winter and upgraded twice - got upgraded at the time of booking for one flight and at the gate for the other. So they are possible. That being said, I've never seen an empty seat in first go out empty.

RealHJ

Was with the normal flat seats, or on the domestic first F configuration?
With the latter configuration (SLC-HNL alternates, some days it's standard config 1-2-1 on 767 or A330, other days it's 767 with the horrible 2-2-2 with little leg room and recline where it's impossible to sleep...seems to be no discernible pattern to how the product varies) it's more likely to be full than the domestic F config, but yes, SLC-HNL is where it may be possible, as most will avoid booking that route, given the real risk of downgrade to domestic F config.

hockeyinsider

It would strike me as very unusual to have any winter flights to/from Hawaii with empty seats. However, I've seen empty first-class seats on Delta flights from Hawaii to Seattle and Los Angeles in June and August, respectively. It's sort of like flights to and from the Caribbean. Upgrades, even as a gold or silver, are fairly common during the off-season.

On the other hand, since most passengers on flights to Hawaii are leisure travelers, it wouldn't surprise me if upwards of 75% of passengers book their trip by 60 days out from departure. Hawaii strikes me as such a vacation destination that only a small percentage book travel at the last minute.

Outside of Los Cabos-Atlanta, I have never not had an upgrade or certificate clear to/from Hawaii; St. Thomas; St. Croix; Panama; San Jose, Costa Rica; Punta Cana; Cancun; San Juan, Puerto Rico; and Aruba. Punta Cana and Cancun were both when I had silver status, circa 2012.

kop84

It's probably a grand conspiracy by "Sheena" to make it look inviting for comp upgrades only to steal them for a "non-rev" party.

Or it's just random chance, and DL will either lower the price, or upgrade some people.

urww

Funny enough the cabin stays pretty much empty, 50 days out. For the moment only 1 seat taken. Actually an entire cabin is pretty empty with lots of nice seats in coach available (10AB and so on), so it's not like plenty of status pax are booked on.

Plenty A class availability.


I think it's a bit of a stretch saying something like that. Are you trying to scare out competitors for a comp upg ?

That was a sole reason of my original post. I tend to book tickets to HI 2 or 3 months out and normally see at least some seats filled at that time. It was the very first time when I saw an entire A330 cabin empty just 2 months out for a travel in prime spring break season.

Although I never came across empty seats on HI flights personally I have more or less the similar impression as you. Over the last year I've been to Hawaii (flying to Honolulu from SEA and LAX) 3 times and never missed an upgrade (all in all 5 flights with DL). Only once it went to a gate, other than that I got upgraded 1-4 days in advance.

A little over a year ago, just before my first flight to HI with Delta I actually asked about the best upgrade chances here. The most common voice was: no way, forget it. Then it turned out upgrades are actually not that difficult to snatch at least on HNL routes not equipped with lie flats. So I think some members of flyer talk community here are a bit dramatic .

hockeyinsider

My guess would be 90% of people flying to Hawaii book at least two months before their flight, if not three or six months in advance. Empty seats two weeks out is probably an indicator you'll get upgraded.

MCO Flyer

Not necessarily. I was flying LAX-HNL back in May on a 26J 767 and I booked about 3 weeks out and there where 16/26 seats available, by the time we got to the 5 day window, there where only 6 seats left and no one was UGd at the DM/PM window. By the time departure day came around there where 0 seats available and 15 PAX on the UG list and worst of all, it was downgraded to a 75H and 6 PAX got booted out of F because there where no PAX UG'd for free (according to the GA)

RealHJ

Most of the reason for that being that closer in availability is very poor. Delta is clearly marketing itself as a carrier for infrequent and leisure travelers. Business travelers end up flying AA or UA, with better closer-in availability (esp. on AA on the 2x daily HNL-DTW 767 and sometimes 777 lie-flats), as even if you want to fly DL, it is very, very difficult to often even find availability - at any price, a month or so out.

hockeyinsider

Maybe not 90%, but at least 75% of leisure travelers book their vacations and honeymoons (the two most popular reasons to visit Hawaii) at least 30-60 days ahead of their travel.

RealHJ

Yes, but in the F cabin many if not most travelers are business travelers, at least based on my observations. What you are describing here are pax who are more likely to book basic economy fares (i.e. the type of leisure infrequent travelers that DL tries the hardest to attract, at the expense of frequent business travelers).