SomeGuy

A friend was flying thru ATL today. Her original flight was oversold, so she volunteered. In the end, there were seats available so she took her original flight.

When it was time to board the connection in ATL, her seat was gone. The assumption is that the GA for the original flight somehow messed up the connection. Should she be getting anything for the mistake? If so, would it be VDB compensation, IDB compensation, some meal vouchers and a later flight?

MSPeconomist

Did she have a boarding pass for the second flight and does she still have that boarding pass? She should definitely be rebooked for free on the next flight to her destination. If the flight was oversold and she had a boarding pass, that would seem to be evidence of IDB regardless of the actual history of when/why she was offloaded. Check the C0C as well as the DOT rules. However, mandated IDB is likely to be small depending on how the fare is allocated to the two flights, so she might do better to negotiate for VDB, especially if she can use DL vouchers.

3Cforme

If the GA for the first segment inadvertently messed up the reservation that's a problem with claiming DOT-mandated IDB compensation: a confirmed reservation is required.

IMHO, the better avenue for compensation is 'I am disappointed Delta messed up when I volunteered for a later flight but my seat wasn't needed, and somehow I was bumped of my connecting flight.'

There are reasons - weight and balance of aircraft seating no more than 60 passengers being one - why even being bumped off the second flight would not bring mandated compensation.

https://www.transportation.gov/airco...ts#Overbooking

Often1

Without the exact details of what happened at ATL, it is impossible to say anything with certainty. Nut, if the GA had your friend's origin somehow cancelled the second segment, IDB is off the table.

There is no entitlement to anything else. The rest is all a customer service gesture and not compensation. So, the question becomes how much of an inconvenience was all of this.

readywhenyouare

Why is weight and balance exempted from IDB rules? The airline knows way ahead of time the sort of equipment they are using and the number of passengers they are dealing with. They should very much be punished for their poor planning.

BenA

Safety; the regulators wanted there to be no financial incentive to pack people onboard a 50 seater regional jet busting safe weight and balance numbers. The smaller aircraft are subject more to the whims of weather, making it more difficult to plan for the 100% case. In contrast, mainline aircraft are usually only subject to weight and balance issues as a result of - as you say - poor planning (like flying a classic A321 to Hawaii or out of SLC in the heat of the summer).

In the new world where airlines try to never IDB passengers, it's more or less a moot point anyway; now that the UA incident has incentivized the airlines to only use volunteers at any cost, the financial incentive is back to bust safety margins in favor of volunteering out fewer people.

readywhenyouare

I could understand that for a scenario that happens once in a blue moon. But if a pattern emerges then the airline needs to face severe consequences. Bait and switch is illegal. When you sell a passenger a ticket for a flight on a certain day at a certain time then the airline should be making a good faith effort to honor their end of the agreement. It would be better to make the airline make a scheduled fuel stop than to have the freedom to kick passengers off without compensation.

flyerCO

The crew is then illegal at fuel stop. ATC wont give routing. Etc... All reasons that while it sounds good, it's not practical.

MSPeconomist

The problem with this reasoning is that an airline could just cancel segments whenever a flight is oversold and thus avoid being responsible for either IDB or VDB payments. Earlier in the day the OP had a ticket and reservation; the OP apparently checked in for both segments without any problems and at that time had both boarding passes. It certainly should not be the OP's problem or responsibility that the GA canceled the segment when this shouldn't have happened and moreover the GA failed to notify the OP that something bad had been done to the OP's PNR/ticket, so that the error wasn't discovered until the OP tried to board the second segment.

Spent_All_My_Miles

I had something similar once. A flight was oversold. I offered to volunteer and agreed on a price with the gate agent. I waited at the gate, to see if everyone would show up. About 10-15 minutes before scheduled departure, the gate agent said you can go ahead and board, and as a courtesy she gave a $100 voucher. (I think I had to check a rollerbag because I was the last to board, which might have contributed to getting the $100).

I got on the plane and took my seat. A minute or two later, that gate agent (or a different one also working the gate) came on board and told me I had to get off. I complied, and I got the negotiated amount (in addition to the $100 voucher). It seemed that they were too quick to try to get the plane boarded and on its way, and the passenger showed up in time after after all.

I did not protest, nor I did ask for more compensation, since I figured that, had I done so, the front-line employee would have gotten into trouble, even though it is clear that they were following the mandate from on high to get planes pushed back on a timely basis, even if it means that some of the time, they cause a situation like this. Delta corporate might not like it when this situation happens, but they clearly like it when planes get pushed back on time.

But I wonder, what if I refused? (This was ~3 years ago, pre-Dao).

exwannabe

The clear purpose of the DOT IDB regs is to put pressure on airlines to keep intentional overbooking to a reasonable level. Unlike the EU rules, the DOT rules are NOT designed to set customer service standards for airlines.

A W&B issue can come up at time of departure. It depends on weather and other factors. Thus, airlines may not have intentionally overbooked at all in advance, yet game time conditions changed.

Similarly for unplanned equipment changes. If they have to switch in a smaller jet, then those who draw the short straw are not IDBs.

CarmenOM

I don't understand. Since you had volunteered and ultimately got the negotiated amount plus $100, why would you refuse or expect additional compensation? For the few minutes of time and uncertainty when you boarded? Am I missing something here?

FlyingUnderTheRadar

If the GA screwed up when she was put back on the original flight but not the connecting flight. And in the end she was forced to fly the later connecting flight I would ask for the original VDB as compensation. I think that is fair because Delta used her seat on the original connecting flight and in the end she did get to her final destination as if she had volunteered all the way through.

Often1

I am not "reasoning." Just reading the DOT rule. By its clear language it does not apply.
If you disagree, the avenue is to petition DOT to amend the rule.

OHDL1

It's not exempted for Delta Mainline aircraft....and Delta Connection aircraft with more than 60 seats.
If you're on one of the remaining, luxurious 50 seat aircraft, you can be compensated with a voucher but, no cash.
Normally, if the aircraft is Mainline or Connection with more than 60 seats, I've heard that they will try and pull enough bags and cargo to offset the weight/balance problem.