Goodbye NRT-PVG, hello ATL-PVG

Old Jul 19, 17, 7:25 am
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Goodbye NRT-PVG, hello ATL-PVG

Delta is going to make another go of ATL-PVG, and based on the current level of US-China frequencies available, and Delta's previous comments, it's going to do it by finally ending NRT-PVG. The flight is scheduled to begin next summer on a 77L.

Competitive times, too.

http://news.delta.com/delta-expand-t...atlanta-flight
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Old Jul 19, 17, 8:02 am
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Delta to reinstate Atlanta - Shanghai in July 2018

http://news.delta.com/delta-expand-t...atlanta-flight

Delta Air Lines is expanding in Asia with new service between Hartsfield-Jackson Atlanta International Airport and Shanghai Pudong International Airport starting in July 2018.

The new Atlanta flight will be Delta’s fourth U.S. gateway to Shanghai, complementing existing service from Detroit, Seattle and Los Angeles. The flight will provide convenient one-stop access to more than 150 destinations in the U.S. and Latin America from Shanghai. In addition, the flight will also provide access to more than 50 destinations in China with codeshare partner China Eastern.

“Strong demand for Delta service across the Pacific and to China nonstop from the U.S. as well as our China Eastern partnership make this route compelling for both business and leisure travelers,” said Ed Bastian, Delta’s Chief Executive Officer. “We look forward to connecting Delta’s hometown and China Eastern’s home with this route, while offering our customers innovative products, thoughtful in-flight service and leading operational reliability.”

Delta’s proposed service will operate on the following schedule (subject to government approval):



Flight

Departs

Arrives

DL 185

Atlanta at 3 p.m.

Shanghai at 6:50 p.m. (next day)

DL 186

Shanghai at 11:40 a.m.

Atlanta at 2:55 p.m.



Delta’s onboard experience to and from Shanghai will be on the 291-seat Boeing 777-200LR aircraft featuring 37 lie-flat seats with direct aisle access in Delta One, 36 seats in Delta Comfort+ and 218 seats in the Main Cabin, which features an industry-leading nine-abreast seating layout, among the widest in international economy seating. Every seat has Wi-Fi, a personal, in-flight seatback entertainment screen as well as power ports. Complimentary meals, including locally sourced Chinese meals, and beverages will also be provided in all cabins. Additionally, in the Delta One cabin, customers will enjoy Westin Heavenly In-Flight Bedding, noise-canceling LSTN headphones, TUMI amenity kits featuring Kiehl’s Since 1851 premium skincare and in-flight loungewear.

The Delta One suite and Delta Premium Select will progressively roll out on Delta’s Boeing 777 fleet beginning in late 2018.

Last edited by Canarsie; Jul 19, 17 at 10:17 pm Reason: No need to quote the article in its entirety.
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Old Jul 19, 17, 8:05 am
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Poor NRT, the little engine that could for so very long. Will DL even be there in 3-5 years?

I'm not really concerned about ATL/PVG I think it will do just fine...although I am slightly surprised, I guess I should say more disappointed than surprised, that it didn't go to MSP. I know the Mall of America (MoA) is desperate for anyone to add a direct flight from MSP to China.
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Old Jul 19, 17, 8:18 am
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I took DL 18/19 twice in BE (at the time) when it was operated by the 777-200ER the first time around and loved the flight. You dont need the LR to do this flight but I suppose thats what is available.
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Old Jul 19, 17, 8:18 am
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Originally Posted by kop84 View Post
I know the Mall of America (MoA) is desperate for anyone to add a direct flight from MSP to China.
Money talks. Unlike airport incentives restricted in duration and amount by FAA regs, a private organization like MoA can subsidize a flight as richly and as long as it wants.

Fifth freedom rights are really from another era. Smaller aircraft with full TPAC range (think 777-200ER) killed NRT for UA and NW/DL. Death has been very slow in coming.

http://www.nytimes.com/2001/03/30/op...orth-pole.html
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Old Jul 19, 17, 8:37 am
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Originally Posted by 3Cforme View Post
Money talks. Unlike airport incentives restricted in duration and amount by FAA regs, a private organization like MoA can subsidize a flight as richly and as long as it wants.

Fifth freedom rights are really from another era. Smaller aircraft with full TPAC range (think 777-200ER) killed NRT for UA and NW/DL. Death has been very slow in coming.

http://www.nytimes.com/2001/03/30/op...orth-pole.html
Totally agree that most 5th freedom routes are dead or dying.

Who knows, the article I had read about MSP/China was from a few years ago maybe the enthusiasm has waned since then.
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Old Jul 19, 17, 8:44 am
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Seems like a really great add to the already massive ATL hub. This flight should do well with the schedule and the insane number of connecting opportunities, something MSP would lack.
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Old Jul 19, 17, 8:59 am
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I'm quite surprised its not on one of the 350s... or does it not have the range?
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Old Jul 19, 17, 9:28 am
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Originally Posted by rylan View Post
I'm quite surprised its not on one of the 350s... or does it not have the range?
Sounds like the 350s will be solely based in DTW for the time be. Maybe this route swaps to 350 once DL has more of a critical mass of them?
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Old Jul 19, 17, 9:35 am
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Originally Posted by kop84 View Post
Poor NRT, the little engine that could for so very long. Will DL even be there in 3-5 years?

I'm not really concerned about ATL/PVG I think it will do just fine...although I am slightly surprised, I guess I should say more disappointed than surprised, that it didn't go to MSP. I know the Mall of America (MoA) is desperate for anyone to add a direct flight from MSP to China.
Originally Posted by kop84 View Post
Totally agree that most 5th freedom routes are dead or dying.
Delta's CEO, as recently as a couple months ago, said the airline remains committed to the "island" flights from Tokyo-Narita: Honolulu, Saipan, Palau, and Guam.

I also think Manila will remain because the Filipino-American community is dispersed so much that connecting through Tokyo-Narita accommodates passengers from multiple gateways.

Singapore is always full in business-class.
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Old Jul 19, 17, 9:37 am
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Originally Posted by kop84 View Post
Poor NRT, the little engine that could for so very long. Will DL even be there in 3-5 years?

I'm not really concerned about ATL/PVG I think it will do just fine...although I am slightly surprised, I guess I should say more disappointed than surprised, that it didn't go to MSP. I know the Mall of America (MoA) is desperate for anyone to add a direct flight from MSP to China.
Just look at Yorkdale Mall, near the airport in Toronto. The place is full of Asian tour groups, who fly over and shop, shop, shop. But Toronto is also more of a destination in and of itself than Minneapolis.

Even little old Guam is huge when it comes to Korean and Japanese shoppers. You can fly down from Tokyo in under 4 hours and buy Gucci and Prada for a lot cheaper than in Japan.
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Old Jul 19, 17, 9:38 am
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I did ATL-PVG back when it first operated (thankfully in J).......that is one looooooong flight
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Old Jul 19, 17, 9:40 am
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Call me a conspiracy theorist, but this comes not long after Delta abruptly eliminated its flights to Taiwan. Quoting the press release:

The new Atlanta flight will be Delta’s fourth U.S. gateway to Shanghai, complementing existing service from Detroit, Seattle and Los Angeles. The flight will provide convenient one-stop access to more than 150 destinations in the U.S. and Latin America from Shanghai. In addition, the flight will also provide access to more than 50 destinations in China with codeshare partner China Eastern.

“Strong demand for Delta service across the Pacific and to China nonstop from the U.S. as well as our China Eastern partnership make this route compelling for both business and leisure travelers,” said Ed Bastian, Delta’s Chief Executive Officer. “We look forward to connecting Delta’s hometown and China Eastern’s home with this route, while offering our customers innovative products, thoughtful in-flight service and leading operational reliability.”

http://news.delta.com/delta-expand-t...atlanta-flight
China Eastern is state-owned.

We know for a fact that China's community regime in Peking (Beijing) exerts tremendous pressure on businesses that operate in Taiwan.

Makes you wonder.

I also note this interesting quote in the aforementioned press release:

"This is a huge win for Georgia jobs and businesses. I'm glad to see Delta leading the charge to connect the U.S. business sector to one of the world's largest financial hubs in Shanghai,” said U.S. Sen. David Perdue (R-Ga.).
Shanghai is competing with Singapore's financial services base.

If Delta pulls out of Singapore, you know China's playing its hand.
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Old Jul 19, 17, 9:49 am
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Is there actually something somewhere that says Delta is ending Narita-Shanghai? The press release doesn't say so.

Google Flights shows flights from NRT-PVG through June 2018.
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Old Jul 19, 17, 9:49 am
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This is now the THIRD time DL is trying this route, after it failed terribly the last two times.

First time: Olympics so it was a "partnership plug"
Second time: who knows why? I flew it the second time they tried maybe 6-9 months before they cancelled it and the flight was no joke 10% full. EVERYBODY on board had their own row with plenty of empty rows in coach.

Why in the world do they think ATL-PVG is going to work a third time around? If anything do something like ATL-HKG, they would be the ONLY airline directly connecting HKG to the Southeast US. You can connect to way more of Asia out of HKG then PVG and not have to worry about all the transit visa junk too. I also imagine there is a way higher desire for HKG out of the South East.

Edit: I know why DL is doing it because of China Eastern, and why would China Eastern care about HKG right now since they are a separate principality for the next 30ish years at least.

I for one would love to avoid having to go to the west coast or north east to go to HKG.
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