davetravels

So, what's next to get the ax? . . . .

Rollover?!?!?

MM program?!?!?

RTW awards are already gone.

TheMadBrewer

I resemble that remark

captaink

Again, any US resident with the means to come up with sufficient documentation to convince Delta that they *live* in a foreign country either already has, or should have no trouble meeting the MQD requirement anyway.

My guess is that DL will start auditing address changes randomly, and at a time when a negative finding would be most painful to a would-be "expat" (i.e. after one has flown 90% of the miles needed to requal)

More details here

MCO Flyer

My guess is that there will be a billion PMs after these changes. My travel will get me GM by the end of this year and should be PM by 2019 (I would never get DM even with the waiver) but the $250K spend requirement is absurd. I am totally fine with DL rasing the DM spend waiver as I felt even before Renes post over the summer that DL would eventually raise the CC spend requirements for upper tier status but $250K is just ridiculous. Might as well have no waiver because if you can spend $250K no problem annually on just one CC than surly you can hit the $15K MQD requirement.

KOTAR1988

WHY didn't Delta RAISE the Diamond MQD to at least 25k? Truly, DM's that qualify would be more valuable to Delta and DM's would/should get a better reward/treatment as well as being able to "thin the herd". WHAT am I missing?

ffI

This move guts the value of the rollover
The Rollover MQMs were advertised as a differentiator for DL
In the "down" years you still were valued as a customer
Now what happens to that concept?

You are downgraded to PM at most if you fly 250k a yr on DL in F and have MQD of 30k, the day you stop flying DL, you are just a PM-nobody
So this is to really keep you on the DL treadmill or quit while you are ahead.

dinanm3atl

Part of plan I would wager. 2020 or 2021 enhancement? Death of rollover. Feedback from valued customer. IE you.

dinanm3atl

I think the PR on the bad side will not be good. Just eliminate it. Saying 250K spend just sounds terrible.


This is what I hoped for. A real 'top tier' above standard traveler status. This puts the people they seem to want to keep above current 'sheep in the system'.

Not sure worse. I think many will drop down as no reason to pursue MQMs. Or leave. Also the FCM is working. Numbers of paid, in some form, are up. We just don't see it as once you have status for the most part you get TERRIBLE offers for FCM. However on my wife's no status account I see them all the time...

MSPeconomist

I think having a $250,000 waiver is worse than no waiver at all as the announced version of the new rule will allow extreme MS people with very low MQDs to stay DM, while those with moderate MQDs and moderate to high spend on DL AmEx credit cards (anything under a quarter of a million dollars) will be demoted to PM. To me, this seems unfair and inappropriate in that the most extreme "gamers" will be fine after the change, and in fact are likely to enjoy more DM benefits if DL's statements about thinning the herd prove to be correct, but lots of more profitable customers who fly DL a lot and use DL credit cards appropriately will lose their DM status.

I guess we can only hope that AmEx becomes more aggressive about shutting down MS on the DL affiliated credit cards, although this will hurt those reasonable people who use moderate MS in a sensible way to make up small gaps in spend.

ffI

Honestly, if you can get 220k done in 6 months (fyi, I do it in 4 at most ), you can do another 30k in a month
If you then get your family members a DL-Res card, you can do 60 k more spend there = total 310k every other year and still hit DM.
The point is why would anyone want to?

The cost of 4 cards = 500$ a yr x 2 + 200$ x 2 = 1400$ a yr + 500 for the family member - about 1900$
Cost of 310k spend is about 2c lost cash /$ spent = 6200$
Total cost of DM done Jan 2018 for 2 yrs = 8000 =
4000$ a yr - still not too bad for someone who wants it that bad and does not fly on DL - obviously too much money and too little sense if you do not use the benefits of flying by actually flying much on DL ......

In the past, I calculated the cost of DM as about 6-7k / 2 yrs = so this is another 25% devaluation
Current cost of DM by spend alone is 50+50+60+60+60k MQMs
That is about 280k spend = 5600$ plus cost of cards = 7000$ for 2 yrs
It may have once had some notion of value, but no longer.

This really does not affect the person with MS of 280k
It just adds 30k to the bar - really nothing much (10% extra work in MS)

But it really affects the person using the 40-60k MQMs from DlPl/DlR to hit DM threshold!
So if I were PM
Maybe I can change my ft handle to DLeconomist?


as always YMMV

RealHJ

...and EOS (End of SkyMiles) that DL has been long known to want. I mean we are very close to it becoming SkyPennies, with now almost de facto per-segment pricing, and more and more often lower value than 1cpm, with DL now consistently wanting crazy amounts like 180,000 miles in J for a $210/ $800 cash price flight (on another airline in Y/J on the same route, DL cash pricing being also absurdly high, but that's another topic).

bergamini

Because THEY made a decision driven by profitability and target membership counts by tier and not what number would help your situation the MOST.

ffI

It just adds another 90k more to MS so no big issue. It really affects the family members, who can not get the MQMs gifted to change status to DM, although they will still hit PM with their MQMs.

At an FTU in Chicago 5 yrs ago I gave a talk on DL with fti. After the talk, I met a man living in ATL, who was pushing 30k a month in MS and was not on the podium shouting his secrets to the world.
He is still going to be DM and fly all over on his DL points. To him 220k or 310k is no big difference and keeping his DM status helps at the center of the DL empire.
His kids who he used to gift MQMs every other year are now no longer going to have DM status. So it will certainly thin the herd.

For us at the periphery it is useless to go to DM by MS, (although it can be done as I outlined above).
The only value of DL status PM is free changes
Cost of doing that by MS alone is 50+50+60=160k spend = 3200$ / 2 yrs = 1600$ a year
or about 10 trip cancels.

PHXflier

It looks like I made the right decision a year or two ago when, because of dwindling upgrade percentages for Diamonds, I started to choose my itinerary based on price and convenience rather than on airline. It has worked out well for me, I saved thousands of $ and hours of time, and as long as I am in Comfort Plus (or equivalent), it does not really matter to me whether that is on United, American or Delta. And being million-miler on multiple airlines will have its advantages when I retire; reaching 3 million miles on DL really is not productive, even though that is likely to happen fairly soon. I could go back to flying mostly Delta and continue to make the Diamond spending limit (I have been Diamond since the inception of the program) but I like the freedom of choice and the significant savings better than occasional upgrades. On many Delta flights I take there are hardly any FC seats left a week prior to departure, so it does not really matter whether the Diamond herd is thinned or not; there are just no FC upgrades to be had. So, thank you, Delta, for making me experiment with alternatives and finding one that I like.

Dick Ginkowski

Right now there is little competition -- but there is still some and time will tell how much. The three mega carriers have some competition as well. You have Spirit and Frontier as the unbundled low cost carriers -- Spirit may work in a pinch for business travelers who can snag a big front seat. Southwest wants you to think it's a low cost carrier but it has no real business perks and its fares are often higher than DL (and others). The elephant in the room is AS which has just expanded its network with the Virgin America merger. Why? There is an effort now to revive Midwest Express. If that should get some traction then some arrangement with AS would seem logical, especially as the old YX had good coverage from MKE and MCI to points east. That could give AS a midwest hub and an eastern presence.