Is it really that bad?
 

I think it was 2011/2012, Amex was doing some kind of promotion where i got 30% more miles transferring to delta. Booked two first class tickets pdx to ams, i remember it being like 90k per ticket. When on the website today, wanted to try to go to ams in Dec before Christmas. Looks like i can get two tickets for 400k miles or so, are they kidding, tried to play with their calendar, is delta really that bad now? I have around 300k miles with them, is there anywhere i can go?

Business awards during the holidays will be hard, although I was just looking at LHR-PDX round trip for myself in December and found plenty of Level 1 Award pricing (70,000 each way) left.

If you want to be sure of getting Level 1 D1 awards, book when the schedule opens. I was looking at PDX-LHR tickets for my parents in D1 today and there was plenty of availability next May for 2 in D1 at Level 1.

What dates are you looking?

9th, 12th, 14th departing, 17th, 19th, 21st, 22nd returning, all have seats at 140,000 R/T in J.

Currently 140,000 appears to be the lowest.

If only they had a published award chart.

The Level 1 awards are not difficult to ascertain.

Not true. On some routes, sure, it may be possible, but on others practically never. It is highly dependent on the route. On HNL-ATL A330 LMK how many days over the next 331 days you can find the normal price J (sorry, "F") award.

Seems that you've been very selecting reading (or not reading) FT. Everyone is constantly reporting that the connecting flights are often the hardest to get at the normal level.

Searching 330 days one by one and finding very few, and often no, availability at the normal price is "not difficult"? The FT readership is not as dumb as you think to believe what you say. :rolleyes:

Yeah, if you aren't flexible on dates, it is quite difficult.

I am lucky that I am almost always flexible on my dates when I travel, but I feel for the people that have to use their hard earned miles for very specific travel dates. Even with my flexibility, it can get extremely difficult to find saver award space.

archive.org shows that low-level awards to Europe in J where 100K RT in 2011/2012. The increase (from 90K) actually took place back in 2008. Coach awards went from 50K to 60K at the same time. As others have indicated it is basically 140K RT these days. DL has been running monthly 48 hour flash sales for the last year or so (typically announced mid-month) and those have included a couple D1 awards sales to Europe (one for 99K RT and the other for 110K RT). But don't expect the sales to cover peak travel periods. Ultimately, as an MS'er, I'd say you're better off focusing your spend on other programs.

Yes, key is to be flexible, as in +/-5 months...most domestic routes I check (connecting flights like HNL-ATL, HNL-LAX) are either N/A from T-1 to T-331 days out entirely (HNL-ATL), or at best are available only a few days per quarter. And of course when one segment of the flights are available, most likely the other flights are N/A. To get a total O&D trip together, if you have to fly DL, is very difficult, to say the least. More like it requires a lot of luck. Loss of AS has been a major blow for sure, as it used to be that AS was the only at least sometimes available domestic connecting flights.

Then again, AA flight availability is just as bad if not even worse...so it's not just DL.

Agreed. I just resign to paying for the final connecting flight to get me to ATL on my own, and if I can get it included on the award then I am pleasantly surprised.

That said, I find United the easiest to accomplish this one. Chicago, Houston, Wash DC, and/or Newark all do pretty well on saver to Atlanta with some slight flexibility.

...this is a work in progress
 

Didn't say book, said the award levels can be ascertained in reply to award chart complaint. Maybe tone down the DL hate, and follow own advice to read.

Last year it was pretty easy to find D1 RTs to Europe in the summer for 105,000 miles during the flash sale.

This. We get it. DL awards have gotten more expensive and low-level awards are harder to find. Doesn't need to be repeated like a broken record in every single award thread. AND, those who don't frequent the forum also miss the context that folks are often only searching the routes that matter to them. Tightening up TPAC inventory doesn't necessarily mean doing so to the same degree TATL or domestic.

The one upside to all of this is that ironically PWM is now sometimes cheaper than an actual award ticket, and you collect MQM as you pass go (if those matter to you). OP shouldn't overlook that option if he/she has or is willing to get a DL Amex.

Two years in a row I've been able to find RT low availability to EU leaving right after xmas and returning Jan 1-3. We purchased in October and November for December/January travel. Key is being flexible on dates. We had to get creative with the return last year, but found LHR-PHL available and added a $100 PHL-ATL on the back side.

We've also had no problems finding cheap flights during flash sales. Went to Italy for 105k last summer, direct from ATL, leaving Thursday returning Saturday.

Europe isn't bad if you are flexible.

Was actually just looking for those exact dates (well, sort of - 12/26ish to 1/12ish). Deciding between Europe or Asia. 2 seats in J.

Can get to ZRH or GVA for 140k each.
Can get to NRT and try the A350 suites for 265k each.

The extra 250k RDM is nothing to sneeze at, but we have the RDM sitting around and it's a shiny new product so...seriously considering New Years in Japan...

You might want to check hotel prices before deciding. Tokyo can be expensive around NYE weekend, with Christmas less so. However, some hotels don't really start taking reservations until three or four months in advance of arrival, so it can be a bit hard to interpret the availability you might find now.

If you've never been in Asia around this time of year, it can be a bit strange. At least in big cities, you'll find extensive beautiful decorations that can disappear promptly by dawn on the 26th. Christmas Day might not be a national holiday, for instance in Japan IIRC. If you're accustomed to colder climates, Christmas and New Year's in the tropics can seem weird.

Love these descriptive and concise thread titles!

Good call. Might be better suited for the Destinations boards, but for a 2 week trip, could we potentially do a few days in Tokyo and then spend more time elsewhere in Japan? Would prefer that over Europe simply because we've been to Europe a ton lately (yes, yes...first world problems and all). Extended family is from SE Asia, so December in the tropics isn't news. But...is Japan really even the "tropics"? I'm used to Singapore/Malaysia...an 8 hour flight south of there.

The dates are firm. We will staying home with family for Christmas as we're gaining a new nephew right around Thanksgiving, but we've been itching for a vacation for a while so trying to get out right after the holidays. I would be worried if someone told me many things will be closed during the Christmas/New Year's week. We're not going especially for the holiday, so if it's just business as usual, that's actually a plus for us.

As Mrs. Lee is telling me to go ahead and book this, it looks like I will be headed to DL.com shortly. Can always redeposit if we figure out the trip won't be what we want it to be (favorite part of being a PM for me).

Anyone have any success routing to Australia via Asia? I just tried to get a JFK - TPE - SYD Both segments opened but they couldn't price as 1 award. I have thought I heard others saying that JFK to PVG to SYD was still doable
?

Not in over at least a year.

I successfully did DTW-PVG-AKL/MEL-PVG-DTW last year (the return ended up being SYD-LAX-DTW thanks to a schedule change). However, this was before the switch to make routings via Asia additive. Since then, I haven't found anything via Asia that isn't over 400k RDM. :(

You need to be aware lots of places shut down (especially restaurants) for the first 4 days of the new year. Also, it can be chilly and windy then. It snowed when I was there the middle of December.

This will give you some idea of what might be closed (scroll down for the chart)

That's true if one looks on O&D routes and searches a wide timeframe. Still not easy, and have to check several routes to ensure checking on one that has actual normal availability. But sure, that is somewhat easier than actually booking it.

Thanks for the link! Actually ended up finding the same one when googling. :)

Ended up booking the trip just to have it. We'll do some research over the next few weeks and decide whether or not to keep it (plus I'm assuming we'll get a schedule change or five between now and then).

I had a moment on the seat map screen where I was going to search for an A350 Best Seats thread, and then I realized that was probably a pointless exercise right now. :P

I'll be curious to hear reviews on the D1 suites once the A350s are active. My initial impression is that the D1 Suite is nothing impressive - that it's basically the 767 D1 suite with a flimsy "door" on it that DL is branding a suite. The actual seat doesn't even look that great - while the suite has a decent amount of space, the pictures make the seat look small - barely wider than an economy seat. As I said, I'll wait for reviews to come in before really beginning to judge but right now, my impression is that it doesn't appear to be worth paying any kind of premium for.

However, Switzerland is one of the most expensive places in the world, and Zurich one of the most expensive cities IME. I've never been to Japan, however.

I find Switzerland to generally be more expensive than Japan, especially for consumables. I don't have experience around the holidays, however.

And you should go to Japan!! :)

Switzerland is "cheap" for us as we stay with friends. But while we haven't ever been there in the winter, we have been there several times whereas Mrs. Lee has never been to Asia.

Me too. Though even if it ends up not being the greatest, I'll probably still try it out just to have the experience, especially since the NRT-ATL nonstop is the same price currently.

FWIW, I'm one of the few that really doesn't mind the 767 D1 seats. And if you trust DL.com specs, they have the A350 seat listed at 22" wide, vs. 20.5" on the beloved 744, and 21" on the 767/777/330. Bed length appears to be smaller (76"-81" range - I wonder which ones are the short ones), but I'm not that tall so it's not an issue for me.

...

But I really didn't mean to hijack this thread with me booking a trip. So back OT: Yeah! DL redemption rates suck! Rage! :P

Someone did start a thread in preparation anyway though:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/delta...ta-s-a350.html

:D

Brilliant!

No, of course Japan isn't the tropics, although it Tokyo can have daytime temperatures in the fifties in November and December (or not). I interpreted what you posted as saying that you were maybe looking at other parts of Asia and not necessarily just Japan.

Last year Seoul had some snow a couple days after Christmas, but it didn't last long.

Ahh...gotcha. And you are correct - at the time we were maybe looking at NRT as just a gateway, but between that post and the subsequent one decided we would just go ahead and do a "real" visit to Japan.

Mrs. Lee and I have several friends who constantly make fun of us for how we make our travel decisions (and how quickly/impulsively we often do) - FT literally saw this in realtime over the span of a couple hours yesterday.

And again, why waived redeposit fees are my favorite part of being a PM. Really helps remove the risk from those types of decisions. :)