How would you get to SYD/MEL?

Old May 3, 2017, 8:56 am
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How would you get to SYD/MEL?

Every few years I go to Australia to get some beach time, climb the bridge in Sydney and then settle in for a week of Aussie Open tennis in Melbourne. Just got the green light to take 2+ weeks off work to do it next year.

I did it in '04 and for 100K World Perks miles I did MSN>EWR>KUL>DXB>SYD on the outbound and MEL>KUL>LAX>MSP>MSN on the return, obviously mostly with MH. It was in true first on 3-class 747/777 planes, although just a recliner seat. Dom Perignon, satay, the cabins almost all to myself. It was amazing!

I did it in '10 for 150K World Perks doing MSN<>MSP<>LAX<>SYD in NW First/Delta Business. It was fine, good but not great.

Well, I priced it out now and my preferred dates are 750K Sky Miles in D1 with some less appealing dates being 575K. Gulp. I now get devaluation.

I had a friend who went last year and I think did a miles routing in J on China Eastern and then a paid ticket from there to Oz, but the long TPAC portions were up front. That's OK to me but I have no interest in doing much on an urban layover.

Instead, I found SEA/LAX<>DPS (Bali) on a myriad of routings involving Delta, China Eastern and KE for 160K in D1. I would then do a multi-night stay over there and skip Gold Coast/Beaches in Australia and then just do Sydney and Melbourne. I could then buy a J ticket for $1900 on Virgin Australia for a DPS<>SYD direct flight and earn 9K MQM's. So that's what I'm leaning towards.

Do others have experience on these route and ways to get to Australia up front without spending 750K Sky Miles?

Let's say I have a $2K budget and want a premium cabin (better than C+, but a true Premium Economy would be OK), with a side goal of maybe earning some MQM's. Are these my best options, and which is best? Or is there something better out there for me?

1. LAX/SEA<>DSP in Biz for 160K, multi-night beach trip stopover and then Virgin Australia to Sydney in J for $1900 USD and 9K MQM
2. Buy a LAX<>SYD trip in coach and know that I'm going to be Diamond and pray that my GUC clears each way? Also $1900 but then 20K+ MQM but no stop in Bali. I could live in C+ or an Exit Row but my fear is having a bad neighbor for 15 hours.
3. China Eastern Premium Economy for $1900 at 75% MQM so I'm guessing with the routing it will be close to 20K MQM as well

I'm pretty flexible but given the 160K award tickets now to Bali, that's the route towards which I'm leaning. Any feedback appreciated.

Last edited by bergamini; May 3, 2017 at 9:19 am
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Old May 3, 2017, 9:16 am
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Originally Posted by bergamini
Every few years I go to Australia to get some beach time, climb the bridge in Sydney and then settle in for a week of Aussie Open tennis in Melbourne. Just got the green light to take 2+ weeks off work to do it next year.

I did it in '04 and for 100K World Perks miles I did MSN>EWR>KUL>DXB>SYD on the outbound and MEL>KUL>LAX>MSP>MSN on the return, obviously mostly with KL. It was in true first on 3-class 747/777 planes, although just a recliner seat. Dom Perignon, satay, the cabins almost all to myself. It was amazing!

I did it in '10 for 150K World Perks doing MSN<>MSP<>LAX<>SYD in NW First/Delta Business. It was fine, good but not great.

Well, I priced it out now and my preferred dates are 750K Sky Miles in D1 with some less appealing dates being 575K. Gulp. I now get devaluation.

I had a friend who went last year and I think did a miles routing in J on China Eastern and then a paid ticket from there to Oz, but the long TPAC portions were up front. That's OK to me but I have no interest in doing much on an urban layover.

Instead, I found SEA/LAX<>DSP (Bali) on a myriad of routings involving Delta, China Eastern and KE for 160K in D1. I would then do a multi-night stay over there and skip Gold Coast/Beaches in Australia and then just do Sydney and Melbourne. I could then buy a J ticket for $1900 on Virgin Australia for a DPS<>SYD direct flight and earn 9K MQM's. So that's what I'm leaning towards.

Do others have experience on these route and ways to get to Australia up front without spending 750K Sky Miles?

Let's say I have a $2K budget and want a premium cabin (better than C+, but a true Premium Economy would be OK), with a side goal of maybe earning some MQM's. Are these my best options, and which is best? Or is there something better out there for me?

1. LAX/SEA<>DSP in Biz for 160K, multi-night beach trip stopover and then Virgin Australia to Sydney in J for $1900 USD and 9K MQM
2. Buy a LAX<>SYD trip in coach and know that I'm going to be Diamond and pray that my GUC clears each way? Also $1900 but then 20K+ MQM but no stop in Bali. I could live in C+ or an Exit Row but my fear is having a bad neighbor for 15 hours.
3. China Eastern Premium Economy for $1900 at 75% MQM so I'm guessing with the routing it will be close to 20K MQM as well

I'm pretty flexible but given the 160K award tickets now to Bali, that's the route towards which I'm leaning. Any feedback appreciated.
first, you may want to check your airport codes - DSP should be DPS, and I'm not sure KUL (Kuala Lumpur) is served by KLM as a stopover between Newark and Dubai


One other option for you to consider is Xiamen Air. Their 787 flights are excellent, if inconveniently timed; if an overnight in XMN doesn't bother you, you may be able to find the whole trip for $2600, all in business class...

Also, VA uses 737s from DPS to Australia most of the time. There is no world in which their regional narrowbody product is worth $1900 (or even really $1000; it's about as good as a LAX-HNL flight on a US legacy.). I'd look into using miles for that segment as well and maybe settling for coach on the shorter sector.
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Old May 3, 2017, 9:20 am
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If you keep searching and are flexible perhaps you'll get lucky and find a "low" award which I believe is now 220k round trip in J. I am doing BOS-LAX-SYD and return, and was able to snag a 220k award about 300/310 days out. Every day I had to do a search and finally the unicorn showed up! Good luck.
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Old May 3, 2017, 9:30 am
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Fixed the codes. I was thinking KUL and so MH became KL...oops!

Xiamen is pricing out at $3600 right now. I wouldn't rule it out but that 16 hour layover is gross on the outbound. However, if I could price it by segments I wouldn't rule out doing DPS>SYD on the outbound for $800 on Virgin (it's the cheaper portion) and using 80K to get to Bali in D1 and then paying $1800 on Xiamen to get that well-timed flight on the way back. Now that's something I could live with and would net a ton of MQM's.

I could get Garuda on an A330 direct DPS<>SYD for $2400 and 75% MQM's. Or 140K RT in Business, so 140+160 = 300K for the trip in business, which is indeed more palatable than 750K.

Touch choices.
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Old May 3, 2017, 9:44 am
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Are you a Delta Platinum or Diamond? If you can book and cancel awards it will help a great deal. Last year I was able to fly BOS-LAX-MEL and SYD-LAX-JFK with a one way car rental back to near PVD where I live. It ended up being 70k per person United on the Outbound and 80k Skymiles per person back.

The key though was finding 80k one ways on Delta thru PVG which I did not want to do. As a Diamond I could then look for better options. Ended up finding a better option on the return on AA. Then there was a schedule change on AA and that provided flexibility again and finally within two weeks of the trip the perfect outbound opened up at the low level on United and a few days later VA opens up the perfect return. Just had to cancel the fully refundable DL flights thru PVG and the refundable with the schedule change on AA.

I know that 80k is gone but if you are able to make free changes on Delta it helps a great deal and you can start with something even if not great. And then change it as things open. Of course you need miles on United and AA too with my approach and you couldn't do this on peak travel days.

Good luck.

Last edited by mfFrom35K; May 3, 2017 at 9:46 am Reason: Typo
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Old May 3, 2017, 9:46 am
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I am PM who will be DM by Nov/Dec. I have < 50K miles on UA. I've been loyal to DL
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Old May 3, 2017, 9:49 am
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I hardly ever fly United. I am very loyal to Delta too. But Chase credit cards solve that problem. It might still be possible to collect enough miles via Chase bonuses to open up more options. Same for AA.
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Old May 3, 2017, 10:44 am
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Air Cadana often has $3000+ business class fares from YVR to DPS which you can route through SYD and have a stopover there for extra $100 or even free depending on the fare. Last time I checked it was it around US$3300 all in roundtrip. Those fares are usually pretty flexible in routing and as long as you take AC metal to SYD, ICN, HKG, NRT etc you can have stopover and continue n any OA flight to DPS.

I went to DPS twice on this fares (drove from SEA to YVR, but no big deal) and it was great. I did not route through SYD but considering next time. I am loyal to DL too but I would take AC 787 or 777 traspac in a heartbeat before DL or its Chinese options. AC business class beats DL in almost every aspect, really good product. And you can still connect to GA or KE and collect some Delta miles. GA and KE are also very nice, take GA from SYD to DPS, return via Asia (or the other way around).

Last edited by AntonS; May 3, 2017 at 10:56 am
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Old May 3, 2017, 11:17 am
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Thanks. Something to keep looking at. Right now it's closer to $6K. But if I book and they put me on KE or Garuda can I earn DL miles on that metal? I'm guessing not since it will be Air Canada paper.
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Old May 3, 2017, 11:28 am
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Originally Posted by AntonS
I would take AC 787 or 777 traspac in a heartbeat before DL or its Chinese options.
Note that this only holds for business class. AC high-density Y on the 777 YVR-SYD is a nightmare.
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Old May 3, 2017, 12:46 pm
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I just booked a D1/Biz ticket for 160K doing MSN<>DPS via ATL/ICN with the widebody metal on DL/KE on the outbound and via PEK/SEA with the widebody metal on China Eastern/DL on the return. Mostly good routings.

For $2100, I can get wide body Garuda from DPS>SYD and then MEL>DPS. I earn 75% versus 150% on Virgin Australia but the MEL>DPS direct and lie flat made a big difference. I just need to bite that bullet.
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Old May 3, 2017, 1:20 pm
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Keep an eye on it as it gets close to departure date -- Virgin Australia often releases LAX-Australia business class awards a week or two before departure, and as a PM/DM you would be able to change your award ticket for free, so worth checking. VA would be a more direct routing, and arguably a better product (certainly at least as good of a product).

Of course it may be hard (almost certainly will be hard) to find cheap awards to LAX so close to departure, though. And if you are buying a revenue ticket for part of the journey then you wouldn't be able to get out of that either so I guess it may not work after all.
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Old May 3, 2017, 1:38 pm
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Look for VA award tickets or check the price for purchasing a ticket in their (true) Premium Economy class. Cities in Australia other than SYD might have better award availability.

If you're going to fly DL/SkyTeam on an award ticket and then pay the remainder of the way to Australia, look for places other than DPS unless you just want to visit Bali. Singapore and Guam are the obvious candidates in my mind (but be careful about Guam if you're going through China because Guam counts as USA for TWOV purposes). I once considered a pacific circle fare connecting through Guam on the way to Cairns. Singapore is served by DL from NRT and has a good airport and good LCCs. BKK and HKG might also work, with the DL SEA-HKG flights generally having decent award availability. The DL HND routes *might* also have better DL award availability.

Another idea would be to investigate whether you can save DL miles by getting two award tickets, one USA-Asia RT and a second one for Asia-Australia RT, where the second one by definition would be at "low" using DL miles. Maybe KE through ICN, for example?
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Old May 3, 2017, 4:39 pm
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You guys are right. I want to hold out hope for Virgin so I'll book a miles ticket for the other part. That's my dream routing!
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Old May 5, 2017, 9:45 am
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Thank you for this awesome post and comments!

This is one of the few things I want to do with my skymiles and seems to be the hardest/most frustrating for everyone that seems to try it. Nice to see a few tips and tricks to "game" the system.
@bergamini - would you mind following up in the future to let us know how it all turned out?
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