Delta Compensation Definitive Thread

Old Sep 14, 2008, 4:53 pm
  #151  
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Originally Posted by StayingHomeIsBetter
Correct... ALL issues cannot be avoided.

But... ANY issue can be made less likely to occur through an appropriate preventive maintenance and quality assurance program.

I agree with the posters who assert that the delay was not caused by extraordinary circumstances.
And if DL was following the recommended maintenance of Boeing, the engine manufacturer, the avionics manufacturer, etc., I suggest they did all they reasonably could do - as called for by the experts in those systems.

We'll need to see some cases be tested before implementation of the law is clear.
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Old Sep 16, 2008, 2:39 pm
  #152  
 
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Thumbs down Delta offers 10,000 points...no mention of E Reg 261/2004.

Originally Posted by motytrah
In this case DL in in Violation of EU Regulations. Specifically European Commission Regulation 261/2004.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europea...ation_261/2004

Based on what the OP stated, DL Owes every passenger on that flight 600 Euros, Hotel, Transport, meals, and a Phone call. Looks like they only covered hotel, and transport and meals.
Delta sent me the following email response:

Thank you for your e-mail describing the inconvenience you and your partner experienced due to flight irregularities. Passenger?s time is valuable, and operating on schedule is equally important to us. However, when a mechanical problem is found, we must restore the aircraft to company and federal airworthiness standards. Safety is the number one consideration in the operation of our flights. We regret the inconvenience you both experienced.

While we would like to offer special consideration in cases such as yours, we are unable to honor the many requests that we receive from others in similar situations. We follow a consistent policy to ensure that Delta is fair to everyone who travels with us. Accordingly, we mustrespectfully decline your request for a refund of Sky Miles which you had redeemed for the reservation.

As a goodwill gesture, we have credited you and Mr. XXX SkyMiles account with 10,000 bonus miles each. They may be applied toward the travel awards of your choice, and the adjustments will be noted on future account statements. You may also view your account balance online at delta.com. Again, thank you for writing. We appreciate your selection of Delta and will always welcome the opportunity to be of service.

Sincerely, Sam P. Shawns
ManagerCustomer Care

I since have filed the form and sent an email regarding complaince with European Commission Regulation 261/2004.
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Old Sep 16, 2008, 2:50 pm
  #153  
 
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Originally Posted by GeorgeK


Delta sent me the following email response:

[snip]

While we would like to offer special consideration in cases such as yours, we are unable to honor the many requests that we receive from others in similar situations. We follow a consistent policy to ensure that Delta is fair to everyone who travels with us. Accordingly, we mustrespectfully decline your request for a refund of Sky Miles which you had redeemed for the reservation.

[snip]

Sincerely, Sam P. Shawns
ManagerCustomer Care

I since have filed the form and sent an email regarding complaince with European Commission Regulation 261/2004.
Technically they are correct. There is nothing in the EU regs that mandates the refund of miles. It will be interesting to see how they respond to the EU 261 filing.
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Old Sep 16, 2008, 3:38 pm
  #154  
 
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I just had a similar problem on BA - and they argue (correctly, apparently) that the EU compensation claim of 600 euros does NOT apply to a mechanical failure that leads to a cancellation.

BA does say, however, that they will reimburse out-of-pocket expenses if receipts are provided.

I am still waiting to find out where to send such a claim
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Old Sep 16, 2008, 6:24 pm
  #155  
 
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Originally Posted by nyjoe4
I just had a similar problem on BA - and they argue (correctly, apparently) that the EU compensation claim of 600 euros does NOT apply to a mechanical failure that leads to a cancellation.

BA does say, however, that they will reimburse out-of-pocket expenses if receipts are provided.

I am still waiting to find out where to send such a claim

Guys, try this site EUClaim.co.uk they take 25% of the refund. Saves you the time and hassle...
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Old Sep 19, 2008, 7:27 am
  #156  
 
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Unhappy DL rejects EU 261 Claim...

Originally Posted by motytrah
It will be interesting to see how they respond to the EU 261 filing.
I rec'd the following from Delta regarding my claim under EU 261:

Your request refers to a European Union (EU) regulation that applies to Delta flights departing from an EU member country. Under certain circumstances, passengers affected by a cancellation may qualify for reimbursement or compensation.

Detailed information about Delta?s obligations in this regard is available on our Web site at http://www.delta.com/traveling_check...ayed_canceled/

While we regret your experience, we must respectfully decline your request for European Union-regulated compensation because the flight wascanceled due to aircraft safety concerns. The regulation provides that compensation is not due when a flight is canceled due to circumstances such as this.

Again, thank you for writing. We recognize this was not the response you expected to receive and trust you will understand our position. We value your business and hope you will continue to choose Delta.

Sincerely, Allen Warner
ManagerCustomer Care


Now what? The value of the 10,000 miles doesn't even cover the extra day parking at Hartsfield or the dog sitter let alone the value of lost wages/vacation day I had to take at my own expense.

Does anyone have any names or email addresses at Delta where I can escalate this for further review?

Last edited by GeorgeK; Sep 19, 2008 at 7:29 am Reason: fsda
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Old Sep 19, 2008, 9:47 am
  #157  
 
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Wirelessly posted (Opera/9.51 Beta (Microsoft Windows; PPC; Opera Mobi/1718; U; en))

Sue them in small claims court. There seems to be some success there.

I wonder why they didn't try to re-route you on AF or KL.
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Old Sep 19, 2008, 9:51 am
  #158  
 
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The case law (or EU equivelent) is on your side:
* AG Rsselsheim 3 C 717/06: even if a technical defect may be unusual, it doesnt constitute extraordinary cirmucstances as it belongs to the air carriers sphere of responsibility.

* AG Kln 118 C 595/05: a technical problem can constitute extraordinary circumstances; however, the air carrier has to produce evidence that the defect was unexpected and unavoidable. A proof of regular maintenance will not suffice.
Opinion of Advocate General Sharpston
Case C‑396/06 Kramme v SAS Scandinavian Airlines


* In order to rely on Article 5(3) following the withdrawal of an aircraft from operation because of technical problems, both that withdrawal and the unavailability of a replacement aircraft must be caused by circumstances which:

could not have been avoided even if all reasonable measures had been taken; such measures comprise, as regards the withdrawal from operation, proper and timely compliance with the schedule of maintenance and checks on the aircraft and, once signs of the technical problem appear, every reasonable step in the circumstances to resolve it without withdrawing the aircraft from operation; as regards the unavailability of a replacement aircraft, they comprise adequate provision for replacements in the light of past experience;

are extraordinary in the normal sense of the word; as regards the withdrawal from operation, such circumstances may include technical problems which are neither of a kind typically occurring from time to time on all aircraft and/or a particular aircraft type nor of a kind known to have affected the aircraft in question before; as regards the unavailability of a replacement aircraft, they comprise circumstances unforeseeable by a carrier making adequate provision for replacements in the light of past experience.

My feeling is DL is using the fact that's it's very hard for an American to take them to court over an EU rule to totally skirt the rule.

The three options would to write a letter citing the cases and ask DL to explain why they don't think they need to comply. Send your case over to one of the EU collection companies that specializes in this (Usually by taking a percentage). File a formal complaint with the Spanish authorities about it.

I'm not a lawyer, that wasn't legal advice.
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Old Sep 19, 2008, 2:05 pm
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Originally Posted by GeorgeK
Just to provide a little more info on this....We arrived at the airport at 10:30 am and our flight was scheduled to depart at 1:10 pm. At 1:30 they told us it would be delayed until 2:15. Around 2:00 the captain announced at the gate that they had to find the equipment which would test one of the panel indicators that they were receiving and that the test itself would take about an hour. Then they gave us a lunch food voucher equal to 9 Euros. At approx 3:30 they cancelled the flight and told us that they would be providing buses and hotels as there were no other flights departing from BCN back to the US that day.

We then all had to go down to baggage claim and retrieve our luggage and then we were escorted to the buses. So basically we were at the airport for over 6+ hours. Boarding the buses was a fiasco as there was not one person from Delta nor the bus drivers willing to help load the luggage in the bus storage bins located underneath the bus. My partner and I had a lot of luggage as we were coming off of a 12 day vacation/cruise but we managed. What surprised me though was the old people and how no one from Delta or the bus company helped these people. Fellow passangers were helpding with the loading of the luggage of the seniors, including a nun. This was repeated at the hotel and again the following morning both boarding the bus at the hotel and unloading at the airport.

By the time, we got checked into the hotel it was 6:00 pm and it being Spain the restaurant wasn't schedule to open until 8:00 pm, which of course it really opened at 8:30 pm and DL did provide a good dinner buffer and then breakfast again in the morning.

The next day the buses picked us up at the hotel at 8:30 and we departed BCN at 11:30. Which of course we had to go through the hassle again with the luggage loading an unloading and rechecking in at the airport.

I disagree that just because DL provided bus service, a hotel in suburban Barcelona, and 3 meals is adequate.

Spending the day at the Barcelona airport, loading and unloading our luggage 4 times; losing a day of work (bill rate $150 per hour); incurring add'l personal expenses such as home airport parking, the dog sitter, etc to me does not equal providing a hotel and a few meals. IMHO....600 EUR IMHO for all of this hassle is not unreasonable.

I will keep everyone posted on what DL offers my partner and I.
Your detail here indicates to me that DL did the best they could do in a bad situation.

I was inconvenienced in July but a mx issue followed by weather issues and had to overnight in NYC. Yes, it was inconvenient; yes, I lost a day of my vacation; yes, it was hectic - as the entire airport shut down; and finally, yes, I [only] got 5K miles for it. What I didn't do was go and try to be compensated further for my own personal woes. [This is not to say whether you have or don't have any legal rights in the EU. That is not for me to say.]

Life isn't always predictable or convenient, but you are alive and [I presume] had an enjoyable 12 days prior vacation. I'd be glad of that and move on.
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Old May 17, 2009, 12:58 pm
  #160  
 
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Delta/NW flight delay, missed connection overnite delay - no compensation

I booked a award travel for my wife & my 4 year old from JFK-> DTW -> PIA via NW 1507 & NWA 2537. The flight from JFK to DTW(NWA 1507) got delayed and reached the destination 2 hours late(8:16pm instead of 6:20pm). There was no weather realted delay.
Needless to say, 2 hour late arrival caused a missed connection...and that was the last flight from DTW to PIA...This was yesterday(05/16)

The airline rebooked the flight for next day at 3pm..but didn't offer
1. Any compensation like giving a hotel stay and/or meal vouchers
2. Refused to book on a flight to other nearest airport.

This was my wife's first flight alone...and she was traumatized by the DL/NW agent behavior...who asked for another full fare payment, for rebooking for next available flight to nearest airport..and just plain refused to help my wife with giving a hotel stay. With 4 year old being sleepy and hungry drove him crazy, driving my traumatized wife speechless and she went blank.

Luckily, We had a friend's friend who helped out my wife and son and gave a stay at his home, which is 20mins from the airport at midnight.
Apart from all the struggle & trauma my wife went through, I was wondering, is it right to expect airlines to help with hotel stay/meal vouchers.
She is right now still waiting for her flight(05/17) at the gate at the DTW...and I am hoping/praying her luggage which was checked in yesterday at JFK will arrive along with her flight.

The reason I am asking about compensation/help is that her return flight is from PIA->ATL->HPN next week..and there is almost 2 hr gap...but if the connection gets missed...she will be in same state again(hopefully not)....maybe she will learn and ask for her help and maybe get it.
Knowing whats to expect will help.

Thanks
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Old May 17, 2009, 1:01 pm
  #161  
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What was the exact reason for the delay of the flight that caused the misconnect?
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Old May 17, 2009, 2:50 pm
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The flight started off late just delayed start by 40 mins...they didn't give any reason...and then it was on the tarmac for a long time....probably waiting for its turn to take off....Weather was fine...didn't see any other flights delayed...
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Old May 17, 2009, 2:54 pm
  #163  
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You first need to determine the exact reason for the delay.

If the delay is within Delta's control (mechanical, crew issues, etc) then you have cause to pursue compensation. If the cause is not within Delta's control (weather, ATC, airport issues) then you have no recourse.
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Old May 17, 2009, 3:01 pm
  #164  
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Originally Posted by Spiff
You first need to determine the exact reason for the delay.

If the delay is within Delta's control (mechanical, crew issues, etc) then you have cause to pursue compensation. If the cause is not within Delta's control (weather, ATC, airport issues) then you have no recourse.
Also, just because weather is find at the departure airport, that does not mean that weather is fine at the arrival airport or along the way.
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Old May 17, 2009, 3:07 pm
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Originally Posted by AndyTLe
Also, just because weather is find at the departure airport, that does not mean that weather is fine at the arrival airport or along the way.
Alternatively, delayed inbound (whether weather or other cause) may have caused the flight to miss their takeoff slot and therefore wait for the next one.
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