eqo31

This summer, I booked a J rewards ticket for China Southern on 006 stock. It felt weird that I couldn't assign a seat, so I called CZ - and they told me I wouldn't be allowed to board because I had no valid reservation. Apparently, the CZ PNR was cancelled while the ticket was good.

Long story short, I called Delta to fix this, and I'd get a seat. But every 24 hours, the CZ PNR would magically get cancelled again - while everything on the Delta side looked fine. The telltale sign was the seat map would suddenly changed to "Seat map can't be viewed for this flight".

After fixing this 3 times, I gave up and decided to just deal with it at the airport. Sure enough, the CZ agent at the outbound station said my itin was messed up, took control of the ticket, issued a new PNR, and sent me on my way.

On my return, the CZ agent told me my ticket was used, I had no PNR, and refused to let me board. They called into CZ "headquarters", but since it was an award ticket, the ticket had no price on it. They held firm. I was going to be stuck in the middle of no where.

After an hour on the phone with Delta in front of the CZ Air agent, they started to be more sympathetic - but ultimately, they couldn't override the system that refused to print me a boarding pass. About 35 minutes before the flight, they somehow found the unused segment on my award ticket, issued a PNR, and sent me on my way. This was a harrowing experience as this award was nested inbetween other intl trips. 5 more minutes and I would have just paid cash for my award seat.

---
A month later, I booked a through trip this time. Flight r/t itin was DL operated -> CZ operated -> MU operated -> DL operated. Everything worked. Seat map worked, seat map didn't change. I attributed my saga above as a fluke with award tickets.

---
Fast forward to yesterday. Emboldened by the fact that booking a ticket seems to actually work, I booked the exact same (DL->CZ->MU->DL) itin for later this year. For some reason, the seat map shows the seats I picked as now occupied. However, as not assigned to me. This has gotten me worried all over again. Two identical trips, one month apart, completely different behavior.

---
Does anyone here regularly fly DL + CZ Do you run into these problems too? All of these bookings were directly via DL.com

Bowgie

I don't have an answer for you, but please report back how this turns out. Delta is relying more and more on its Chinese partner airlines, and I fear this situation will become more common.

jmertic

Yes, exact problems but on a revenue, 006 stock ticket. 3 times cancelled within 24 hours of booking. Then mysterious cancelled after flying the first DL leg ( found out by chance by wandering to CZ desk at JFK to get my next boarding pass ). And then still DL had to fix the return so it didn't auto cancel.

So yes, it's a problem...

danielonn

What is sounds like is that China Southern did not properly ticket your reservation. When a ticket is purchased but not used it remains "Open" and when its been used it shows "Closed" as you can see under your Delta Ticket receipt. Perhaps there is a problem with the reservation computers at China Southern.

What I would do is call China Southern and see what their computers say and then Delta to see if the Ticket numbers match and also if the Award ticket was processed correctly.

Please keep us informed. It seems there must be a glitch somewhere.

safigan

Haven't flown CZ, but I've had similar problems with 2 other carriers.

In one case I already had a different award flight booked with overlapping dates "just in case" so DL kept canceling the award I really wanted.

In the other case, I changed the destination city on the outbound. Couldn't get a seat assignment. Apparently the agent who did the change really screwed things up, but I didn't find out until after I arrived at the airport and even the GA couldn't assign a seat. They had to completely cancel the ticket and reissue it.

flyerCO

Just booked an award with CZ online. No problems at all. Called DL asked for CZ record locator went to their website and selected seats.

Did you book by phone or online? I think part of the issue is that CZ sometimes shows phantom inventory. The website catches this and stops the process. I'm not sure a phone agent will notice.

PupManS

Folks, this one isn't over yet.

I booked an award (180k miles) JFK-DPS with CZ on the outbound leg for Mrs. PupManS back on June 18. At the time I called CZ with the PNR and they said it was ok.

This weekend I called about a seat assignment.

I was told by CZ that DL had cancelled the PNR on June 19 and there was no valid reservation. On DL website, everything looks fine, and CZ saw the ticket, but no PNR.

Called DL, and after 2 hours of various holds and supervisors, the codeshare desk and the INTL award desk, I'm told there's nothing they can do (after I was accused of cancelling the PNR myself through Delta.com) and CZ will not open up inventory to make it work. CZ was no help since "it's a 006 ticket and not our PNR, and DL cancelled it, not us."

After another 90 minutes they somehow find another outbound leg, turning a 3 hour layover in CAN into 14 hours. Not having better ideas and hoping not to screw up vacation any worse, I took it, and now am trying to get my revenue ticket (which was issued by MU, another set of issues) to match with no luck. Hopefully, CZ does same-day standby and I can switch at the airport. I'm giving up on the phone, unless anyone else has any ideas.

So my advice for ANYONE with a award leg on CZ....call, give the PNR and try to get a seat assignment. Also, if anyone knows the best way to handle this at DL, I'd appreciate it. The last person in SLCRES from the codeshare desk refused to connect me to a supervisor and told me take it or leave it (I realize I'm just a GM, but given no one from DL ever contacted anyone to tell us there was an issue, it seems like they should have at least TRIED to be more accommodating).

After the computer snafu and the summer of mechanicals I've had...it's getting really difficult to justify loyalty.

flyerCO

HUACA is the best thing to do when an agent flat out refuses to fix what was a DL issue. Once they ticketed you they're obligated to fly you on those flights. The fact the agent refused to get a supervisor or the Skymiles desk, or partner desk on the phone should be a clue. The agent doesn't care and only wants to get you off the phone.

PupManS

Oh, I tried that...but it was the partner desk who did this to me...and unfortunately all roads seemed to lead back there and to a note in the PNR.

flyerCO

Looking at the dates I'm betting the following actually happened. You booked the award with DL, DL created the reservation, but didn't wait to get an OK/CONFIRMED message back from CZ and instead ticketed right away. CZ then refused to give the seats to DL. However by that point DL had already screwed up and issued tickets to soon. Thus CZ sent an electronic notice to DL that they refused to confirm you and the DL system cancelled the reservation. It's too late now, but you should have insisted on a supervisor and if denied called back. Once the ticket was issued by DL, they became liable for flying you even if it was done in error.

PupManS

Given I had nothing to lose, gave HUCA a shot and tonight (blessedly) was OTP with Chisholm.

I'm not sure WHAT they did, but they got the original PNR and ticket back and allegedly CZ confirmed it. Will speak to CZ in the AM- wish me luck!

TrojanTraveler

Appalling. Can you imagine discovering this at your departure airport?

PupManS

Update-

Called CZ today for seat assignment and again they're telling me "not a confirmed reservation - you're waitlisted - deal with DL, bye!

Looks like back to the grindstone tonight.

RealHJ

This is not uncommon with Chinese airlines. Over in *A, most airlines are blocking all Air China (CA) awards, due to this very same issue, that CA has the ticket, but they don't create, or auto cancel, their side PNR, so pax can't fly on a confirmed ticket. Only United has it fixed (after I pushed the DoT and their management to do it for several months late last year, by this spring they finally fixed it and are now able to interface with CA properly and hold them accountable) and are able to ticket Air China properly, but Air Canada, Lufthansa, Avianca, etc. in *A are all blocking CA awards entirely, for this very reason.

I know this doesn't help you here in any way, but just FYI it's not abnormal. Seems to be how the Chinese state-owned airlines conduct business. CA also is known to cancel confirmed and ticketed award reservations on full flights with no notice or refund to passenger (you just find out at the airport when you can't check-in) when the flight is full, so that they can sell more seats. Wouldn't know if CZ ever does so, though..

So, this problem you are having with CZ, I've been through the exact same thing on a CA award res made with UA last year. Others continue to have it on AC tickets, etc. AC (Aeroplan) bought their passenger a revenue ticket on the same CA flights that they ticketed the award, but CA wouldn't honor it - that was back just like two weeks ago. Other airlines will do that, but of course not the cheapest of them all Dullta. But, that is what DL should do here for you. If DL treated its pax like other airlines treat theirs and took responsibility, they'd open up their wallet and buy you revenue tickets on them for the flights that they failed to book properly for you with CZ. So, I would insist on that...though knowing the extreme cheapness of DL and how DL couldn't care less about its reputation or its pax, they likely won't do it. As another data point for the exact same scenario, UA for me gave me a full refund + cash compensation + a pretty big chunk of extra miles for when this happened, instead of booking the $4000+ revenue ticket on the same flights that I wanted. So that would be other option, to get a full refund + cash and miles compensation from DL due to their failure to ticket this properly. But again, DL always treats its customers worse than every other airline, so, not sure will you get that either. You would from UA..

If I was you, I'd make a prompt complaint here with the DoT and have the DoT hold DL accountable to honor its ticket. You paid the fare (miles and cash) and DL confirmed and ticketed it; now DL needs to live up to it and honor it - it's as simple as that (if it takes them $$ to buy you a replacement revenue ticket, then so be it, but that has to be on them). With proper pressure from the DoT (first you'll have to sell your case and explain it to them), DL may - just may - do something here to make this right. Without it, highly unlikely, given Dullta's abysmal track record of (not) taking care of its pax in such situations where DL is at fault. But, this path will take a few months...so hopefully your flights are not until next year or much later this year.

flyerCO

The poster above anger seems to be misdirected. 1)Unless DL didn't in fact get a confirmed message they've done everything correctly. and 2)If they did indeed get a confirmed message, the issue is with CZ and the DOT compliant should be about them.

Lastly DL treats it's customers far better then the others. Especially in IRROPS. Even those without status fair loads better then they would at UA/AA. One only needs to read the frequent horror stories to see while DL can mess up, it happens gar less often.