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-   -   DL applies for Haneda slots: ATL/LAX/MSP (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/delta-air-lines-skymiles/1761085-dl-applies-haneda-slots-atl-lax-msp.html)

TrojanTraveler Apr 22, 16 9:33 am


Originally Posted by WWads (Post 26521022)
The new Airbuses can't come soon enough. It's kind of ridiculous that DL runs 767s on TPAC flights.

I actually think the 767 J seat is better than the 777 J seat. Neither of them are that great though (albeit they were a great improvement years ago when rolled out). DL really doesn't have many current options, which to your point should improve when the Airbuses arrive.

3Cforme Apr 22, 16 10:05 am


Originally Posted by WWads (Post 26521022)
The new Airbuses can't come soon enough. It's kind of ridiculous that DL runs 767s on TPAC flights.

Because you would rather have a narrower coach seat in 3x3x3 config on a UA or AA 787 (or 3x4x3 on a 777) than 2x3x2 on a Delta 767?


Originally Posted by MSPeconomist (Post 26520554)
MSP-HND on the 767 D1 seats? ick!

Not gonna happen. MSP-HND is about 250sm farther than the longest 767 route DL has operated. The set of low-probability hypotheticals about which you can complain is infinite.

TrojanTraveler Apr 22, 16 10:07 am


Originally Posted by 3Cforme (Post 26521176)
Because you would rather have a narrower coach seat in 3x3x3 config on a UA or AA 787 (or 3x4x3 on a 777) than 2x3x2 on a Delta 767?

I think it depends on if you are traveling in the back or the front. In the back I agree with you...2x3x2 to me beats anything.

TrojanTraveler Apr 22, 16 10:11 am


Originally Posted by 3Cforme (Post 26521176)
The set of low-probability hypotheticals about which you can complain is infinite.

Oh, and I found this hilarious.

readywhenyouare Apr 22, 16 10:13 am


Originally Posted by WWads (Post 26521022)
The new Airbuses can't come soon enough. It's kind of ridiculous that DL runs 767s on TPAC flights.

That's news to me. Would you mind telling us which 763ER's are leaving? Only the domestic 763A's are scheduled for retirement except for four ETOPS models used for Hawaii.

davisew Apr 22, 16 10:24 am


Originally Posted by ashill (Post 26518926)
It wouldn't shock me if DL is engaging in some gamesmanship here, thinking that ATL is their strongest case (since they knew that AA would also apply for LAX) and thus likely to be awarded anyway. I wonder if it will come back to bite them if the DOT has had enough of DL's shenanigans with HND in general and awards LAX-HND to AA, then sees MSP as a bogus request with very little local traffic. And if DL didn't get their second choice, why give them their third?

Although maybe MSP does make sense since ATL doesn't have a ton of local traffic anyway and, as jrkmsp pointed out, MSP serves more connecting cities logically. In fact, with only MSP and DFW requested in the interior of the country and MSP being better-located geographically for connections, maybe MSP does stand a chance after all.

I'm surprised that neither DL nor AA requested JFK and that nobody requested ORD.

1. DL requests MSP-HND.
2. Request denied.
3. DL promptly drops MSP-NRT. ("Not Sustainable", DL states as much in their application.)
4. Public complains. Breathless editorials in the local fishwrap.
5. "We wanted to keep service to TYO but the gub'mint wouldn't let us!"
6. Everyone forgets and moves on.

MSPeconomist Apr 22, 16 10:28 am


Originally Posted by WWads (Post 26521022)
The new Airbuses can't come soon enough. It's kind of ridiculous that DL runs 767s on TPAC flights.

DL uses 767s on all of its LHR routes. You would think these birds would be noncompetitive.

pbarnette Apr 22, 16 10:43 am


Originally Posted by MSPeconomist (Post 26521277)
DL uses 767s on all of its LHR routes. You would think these birds would be noncompetitive.

You'd think that if you'd never flown the competition.

Austin787 Apr 22, 16 11:03 am

I think the DOT considers the alliance, not just the airline, when awarding the HND slots. UA and AA have alliance partners in Japan, while HA and DL don't. I can see DL getting 2, or perhaps all 3, of it's requested routes. I think DL is a slam dunk for LAX-HND and likewise HA for HNL-HND.



Originally Posted by MSPeconomist (Post 26521277)
DL uses 767s on all of its LHR routes. You would think these birds would be noncompetitive.

The 767 is the best long haul plane for those flying in Y. 2-3-2 is somewhat better than 2-4-2 and much better than 3-3-3 and 3-4-3.

DiverDave Apr 22, 16 12:24 pm


Originally Posted by WWads (Post 26521022)
The new Airbuses can't come soon enough. It's kind of ridiculous that DL runs 767s on TPAC flights.

DL's 767s are the best long-haul aircraft if you are riding in the back. And yes, folks actually do that. :)

David

GRALISTAIR Apr 22, 16 12:27 pm


Originally Posted by sbm12 (Post 26518424)
SEA would have stood zero chance given the recent dropping IMO.

Agreed :)

MSPeconomist Apr 22, 16 12:28 pm


Originally Posted by Austin787 (Post 26521422)
I think the DOT considers the alliance, not just the airline, when awarding the HND slots. UA and AA have alliance partners in Japan, while HA and DL don't. I can see DL getting 2, or perhaps all 3, of it's requested routes. I think DL is a slam dunk for LAX-HND and likewise HA for HNL-HND.




The 767 is the best long haul plane for those flying in Y. 2-3-2 is somewhat better than 2-4-2 and much better than 3-3-3 and 3-4-3.

Yes, but it's the worst current DL wide body aircraft for D1 seats.

I guess at LHR VS flights are under the JV, so DL doesn't much care whose aircraft are better. BA/AA have some battered old planes, but I don't know how often they appear on the LHR routes.

pbarnette Apr 22, 16 1:11 pm


Originally Posted by MSPeconomist (Post 26521767)
I guess at LHR VS flights are under the JV, so DL doesn't much care whose aircraft are better.

There are a lot of criticisms of the VS seat, particularly the new one, which is pretty cramped.


Originally Posted by MSPeconomist (Post 26521767)
BA/AA have some battered old planes, but I don't know how often they appear on the LHR routes.

Considering BA has a hub at LHR, it is probably safe to assume that some of those battered old planes fly to, you know, LHR. And they most certainly do. The average condition may not be as shabby as some of the stuff they base out of LGW, but most of the planes I've been on are pretty beat up.

In general, I think you are exaggerating both how bad the 767 is in D1 and exaggerating the standard of the product offered by the competition.

RealHJ Apr 22, 16 2:02 pm


Originally Posted by MSPeconomist (Post 26521767)
Yes, but it's the worst current DL wide body aircraft for D1 seats.

Not really. That is highly subjective.

Now, without a doubt DL 767s used to be the worst (of DL and pretty much any airline) int'l J seating when they had the old, beat up cheap recliners and DL was way behind everyone else int'l J seating wise. With the current seating it's far better than DL 777s (those are by far the worst), and really no worse (IMO) than A330s or 747s; in a way 767s are better than A330 or 747 as the screen doesn't need to be popped up, so you can enjoy the IFE programming also during the times when you couldn't on A330 and 747 as the screen has to be stowed away.

So, it's a matter of opinion. Personally I slightly prefer DL 767s J vs A330 or 747 seating.

bubbashow Apr 22, 16 4:29 pm


Originally Posted by 3Cforme (Post 26521176)
Not gonna happen. MSP-HND is about 250sm farther than the longest 767 route DL has operated. The set of low-probability hypotheticals about which you can complain is infinite.

....at least she didn't use the word "horrid" again in description.


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