Compensation question
 

About 9 months ago, I booked a flight for my family of 4 going from YEG to PVR for December 27. Some months later I got email saying there was an itinerary change. Flight number changed and flight time changed by 10 minutes. For whatever reason, Delta had rebooked our ticket on Alaska airlines.
Fast forward to December 27th, we all wake up at 3 am and make it to airport 2+ hours before flight time. When we get to Delta counter, the lady tells us that she can't find our reservations. When I show her the printout from Delta website, she indicates its operated by Alaska. Anyways, we manage to get Alaska boarding passes and go through security never thinking anything was amiss. Then when it time to board, we are told that flight is overbooked and they have to find us another flight. Here are the issues:
- Alaska air never told us flight was overbooked ( rumour has it there was an equipment change due to mechanical issue and this resulted in overbooking by 6)
- made NO boarding announcements (people just lined up)
- Never asked for volunteers
- they rebooked us with having to overnight in Calgary and then arrive in PVR next day.
- we lost a day of vacation and prepaid hotel room.

What should we expect for compensation?
(Thanks in advance)

It sounds like your issue is with AS rather than DL, although Canada might have different consumer protection rules than the USA.

I'm assuming DOT rules apply and this was an IDB where the airline didn't give you a statement of your rights and didn't ask for volunteers. Moreover, it's not clear whether AS followed their own priority rules (that must be stated in their CoC) to select the passengers to be given IDBs. It sounds like you weren't the last to check in and you had seat assignments if you were given boarding passes (is this right or did you have seat request cards or whatever term AS uses for the thing to get you through security when the seat will be assigned at the gate), so perhaps you were picked because you had award tickets or were viewed as DL passengers (since DL miles were used and DL had transferred the ticket and reservation over to AS). These might not be the criteria specified is AS's own rules in its CoC.

OP - Focusing in on the oversold flight, it is likely that US DOT rules will be more generous here and will apply to AS as a US carrier. The compensation for involuntary denial of boarding due to an oversale is 400% of the cost of the ticket segment, capped at US$1,350. I don't know what the segments cost, but you can calculate that. Hopefully your travel insurance will cover the lost prepaid hotel.

As to the rest, if you knew that you had been rebooked onto AS, you should have gone to AS first. If you were unsure, at least call ahead to ask.

Yes, AS ought to have asked for volunteers and it ought to have off-loaded passengers in a pre-determined order. I am not certain why that was your family. But, that will not affect your compensation.

I would file a request with AS for the IDB compensation, ask to be advised within 7 business days and, if you have not heard, file a US DOT complaint (easily done on the website) on the 8th day.

Isn't there some sort of a clause that states that if a plane has to be downsized due to mechanical reasons, no compensation is due, although they usually do give some to smooth over the customers? What am I thinking of?

Nope. When it comes to IDB, the only exception that I'm aware of, is if they can get you to final destination within X hours of scheduled arrival. Otherwise IDB is an IDB regardless of if it's caused by Wx, or maintenance, or ...

Just found this:

Compensation for Involuntary Denied Boarding

If you are denied boarding involuntarily, you are entitled to a payment of “denied boarding
compensation” from the airline unless:

(1) you have not fully complied with the airline’s
ticketing, check-in and reconfirmation requirements, or you are not acceptable for
transportation under the airline’s usual rules and practices; or

(2) you are denied boarding
because the flight is canceled; or

(3) you are denied boarding because a smaller capacity
aircraft was substituted for safety or operational reasons; or

(4) on a flight operated with an
aircraft having 60 or fewer seats, you are denied boarding due to safety-related
weight/balance restrictions that limit payload; or

(5) you are offered accommodations in a
section of the aircraft other than specified in your ticket, at no extra charge (a passenger
seated in a section for which a lower fare is charged must be given an appropriate refund); or

(6) the airline is able to place you on another flight or flights that are planned to reach your
next stopover or final destination within one hour of the planned arrival time of your original
flight.

So if a flight is oversold what stops an airline from substituting a smaller plane and claiming "mx issue" to avoid payout of IDB comp? Does the airline have to somehow prove with mx records to the DOT if a consumer filed a claim?

Doesn't every aircraft always have some MX issues such as tilted tray tables or power outlets not working? An airline could always try to claim MX and substitute a smaller aircraft to avoid paying VDB/IDB, including cases where they want to make the substitution because the flight isn't full (on the original size aircraft).

So what protects consumers from these kinds of games/tactics? I want to believe that in general airlines don't do this, but I also wouldn't put it past them.

They don't even have to do that because they could site "operational reasons" which are entirely in their discretion.

The rules I cited above are US DOT rules. This flight originated in Canada. Does anyone know if Canadian law is the same as US?!?

Also, this is AS, not DL op'd. Even if they cite this law for not giving compensation, I would certainly think that AS would still want to schmooze a family of 4 with SOME type of comp, vs potential bad publicity!

You are correct. The aircraft substitution exemption for IDB compensation has long existed in U.S. regs. If the DOT thought it was abused it could change the reg.

Further, U.S. DOT IDB compensation doesn't apply to international departures to the U.S.

https://www.transportation.gov/airconsumer/fly-rights

And, lastly, it was an Alaska op. It doesn't belong in the Delta forum.

Well, I would argue that this post is OK here, as the OP booked their flights with DL. DL changed their flights to AS, and even tho they were likely notified of the change, they apparently didn't realize it til the TA told them this at the counter. You know, it was probably in tiny print "operated by Alaska Airlines". I believe we have all glossed over the same thing at times.

True, that, the actual IDB beef is with AS and Canadian law.

:)

These rules have been in effect for a long time. Have we really seen much abuse of the system? Honestly, no. Look at all the reports of VDB compensation. I think it would be more of a hassle for DL (or other airlines) to downgrade the aircraft just to avoid paying IDB compensation. New crew would be needed most likely that is certified on the new aircraft, etc.

New crew would mean new pilots, although there are some aircraft types that are so similar that IIRC the pilots are certified on both. Unlike some other (foreign) carriers, DL FAs are certified on every aircraft in the fleet.

Downsize
 

Dave, you're correct.
They're calling it a downsize due to mechanical problems. Apparently in this case both US and Canada laws say that no comp is required.

Update:
Since they consider it aircraft downgrade due to mechanical, no compensation is due, however ,We've been offered $400pp in "flight discount"
Fair?
This was my first time flying with Alaska... I normally stick with Staralliance due to status.
Not sure if this was an isolated incident but I'd rather not fly with AS ever again...

You might be able to use the $400 credit to purchase a (codeshare) flight on an AS partner.

Is that $400 per person or total?

You should look at your ticket price and calculate what the DOT mandated payment (in money) would be if it were officially an IDB.

$400 each.
Dot would be $1200 each for denied boarding and resulted in 19 hour delay. However I don't have a leg to stand on since they claim it was aircraft downgrade. And of course they will not compensate for lost hotel night or dinner meal.

Compensation Stipulation Upon Check-in
 

I couldn't see the sense on starting a new thread and decided to tag onto this one under its Title.

More and more I am forced to make decisions while checking in on the Delta web site

e.g.

upgrades paid or requested ?

Paid Mileage bonuses ?

Trip intreruption insurance?

and now

Do I want to volunteer to give up my seat for $100, 200, 300, 400 500 ?



The last one got my attention. Why should I decide 24 hours early? At that point I'm just looking forward to getting to the airport and to the gate and then finally to my destination. I'm not interested in a bidding war based on my level of hurt a day later.

My body has been programmed to weigh all pros and cons after the facts are fully available and I don't care if somebody else has committed their decision before me.

So when i arrive at the gate and only then do I ask if they need volunteers and the answer i got this week was yes!!. After they reviewed my record and my companions, they made an offer way more then what was selectable during check-in 24 hours earlier.

I took the offer which was 8 times more than what I paid for my ticket

As I left the gate area to cash in the meal voucher they gave me I heard the PA ask for even more volunteers at 1/2 the price they offered me but still way more than was listed on the check-in site.

OK I'm happy but still curious

What factors does delta weigh in making ad-hoc offers at the gate?

In my case

I had MM status

Our two seats were in paid first class (domestic)

The flight was connecting at a gateway (international) to another full flight

Presumably some of the passengers on the flight we volunteered were high paying international passengers.

My guess is that we made 4 other people very happy (two that got upgrades and two that got on the plane at the last minute). What we paid for our tickets was not a factor as we got to our destination to our satisfaction. That the major factor were the benefits to the other passengers we saved and the lack of IROP problems flowing down wind in the Delta system.

If I'm right than I will continue to waivie my check-in decisions until I'm actually at the gate.

waiting to hear from others experience

Rarely have I experienced DL using the list and amounts that they solicit from the online or kiosk bidding. But I have my own strategy in that regard.

In any case, nothing is firm until you accept the deal at the gate (after they tell you how they will re-accommodate you).

Whew! Where to begin! :)

1) If you don't want to decide at check-in - - DON'T! There's certainly nobody pressuring you to choose a $$$ amount at check-in. Simply choose not to volunteer! Done.

2) Even when you do choose an amount, they rarely seem to use those amounts. My last VDB - I bid $300 to get on the list. It doesn't mean that I had to accept it at the gate if I decided to change my mind!

When I got to the gate, I was told that she needed 6 vols, and everybody was getting $500. I told her that I had heard some offers as high as $800. She said, if I didn't want the $500 - she'd find someone else. THEN, she looked up my bid and saw that I bid $300! She asked me what I was complaining about, as I was getting $200 more than I bid! (I wasn't complaining - - Just discussing! :D)

3) I'd say that, right now, because of holiday passenger loads, and this past week's IROPS due to weather nationally, flights are bursting at the seams right now, so the $$$ amounts they're paying out are higher than usual.

4) MEAL VOUCHERS?!?!? Supposedly, they stopped issuing those a long time ago! I asked at the gate, the service desk, AND, at the SkyClub! ZIP!!! NADA! And my VDB was overnight!

5) I will say one thing about bidding online. She already had my name on a sheet with #1 written next to it. So, it's possible that bidding online MAY put you higher up in the cue.