Jul 14, 2015, 4:38 pm
Last edit by: Zorak
Summary of SkyMiles Upgrade Changes
Effective Aug 1, 2015, DM's on paid fares and no companions will no longer receive complimentary upgrades JFK-LAX/SFO. Delta's reps failed to disclose this in their June 14 announcement.
For travel on or after June 1, 2016, additional fare classes are eligible for SkyMiles upgrades:
Within North American and northern South America, L/U/T fares are now eligible. (Previously only Y/B/M/H/Q/K)
For all other markets, H/Q/K fares are now eligible. (Previously only Y/B/M)
SkyMiles Upgrade Awards will also require more miles. Prices for the following markets as quoted by multiple reservations agents: (Pricing is one-way)
(current chart based on observations has been moved to this thread: Upgrading with miles)
Effective Aug 1, 2015, DM's on paid fares and no companions will no longer receive complimentary upgrades JFK-LAX/SFO. Delta's reps failed to disclose this in their June 14 announcement.
For travel on or after June 1, 2016, additional fare classes are eligible for SkyMiles upgrades:
Within North American and northern South America, L/U/T fares are now eligible. (Previously only Y/B/M/H/Q/K)
For all other markets, H/Q/K fares are now eligible. (Previously only Y/B/M)
SkyMiles Upgrade Awards will also require more miles. Prices for the following markets as quoted by multiple reservations agents: (Pricing is one-way)
(current chart based on observations has been moved to this thread: Upgrading with miles)
SkyMiles July Announcements
Jul 14, 2015, 12:09 pm
#31
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
Programs: A3*Gold, SPG Plat, HyattDiamond, MarriottPP, LHW exAccess, ICI, Raffles Amb, NW PE MM, TWA Gold MM
Posts: 100,404
I was just going to start the thread, and saw SM Rep already beat me to it! Haha...
Alright, couple of questions:
1. So, what's gonna be the order regarding the UG's on the TCON sectors. I'd presume: DM's who use GUCs>PM's who use RUC's>comp. medallion UG's for DM's>miles used for K+ fares (will it be based on status?!). Is that right?
2. Two contradictory points/titles: On one hand, they say that DL apparently increased the 'Low Awards' availability, starting at 7.5k miles (kudos to those who can find it!). Is it safe to assume that these 'Low Awards' availability increase can be extended to the premium cabins as well? If that's the case, then their next point, 'Head's Up for Summer of 2016' says that the miles required for UG is going to increase, is kind of contradictory, in that, the award level will not be 'low' anymore?! Or is it that they are increasing the miles required for low award levels? Kinda confused!
3. Earning of MQDs: It says UG's to premium cabins will now count towards MQDs: Does it mean UG's after buying the ticket (the banner that you see on top of your itinerary), or does it mean the really cheap FCM's?
Alright, couple of questions:
1. So, what's gonna be the order regarding the UG's on the TCON sectors. I'd presume: DM's who use GUCs>PM's who use RUC's>comp. medallion UG's for DM's>miles used for K+ fares (will it be based on status?!). Is that right?
2. Two contradictory points/titles: On one hand, they say that DL apparently increased the 'Low Awards' availability, starting at 7.5k miles (kudos to those who can find it!). Is it safe to assume that these 'Low Awards' availability increase can be extended to the premium cabins as well? If that's the case, then their next point, 'Head's Up for Summer of 2016' says that the miles required for UG is going to increase, is kind of contradictory, in that, the award level will not be 'low' anymore?! Or is it that they are increasing the miles required for low award levels? Kinda confused!
3. Earning of MQDs: It says UG's to premium cabins will now count towards MQDs: Does it mean UG's after buying the ticket (the banner that you see on top of your itinerary), or does it mean the really cheap FCM's?
However, I don't know of a current published rule about how GUC or RUC upgrades are prioritized. Some people assume it's by elite level (of the passenger rather than the FF account?) then fare class then time or request, but I've heard statements that the only thing that matters is the time of request.
2. If DL intended to increase BE/D1/FC award inventory, I'm sure that would have been highlighted in the announcement. No news is bad news here.
The statements about upgrades with miles apply to instrument-supported upgrades for tickets paid with money, not the difference in costs in miles for coach versus premium cabin award tickets. [Note also that you cannot "upgrade" an award ticket with miles; you must reissue it as a BE/D1/FC award ticket and pay the difference in miles plus any applicable change/cancel/redeposit fee that applies, currently $150 for accounts that are not DM or PM.]
3. I would assume both, but we will see.....
Jul 14, 2015, 12:11 pm
#32
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: MSP
Programs: Delta PM, Hyatt Discoverist, Hertz PC
Posts: 2,303
Well, I for one am very curious how much upgrades to D1 from an S or H fare TPAC will be. I seem to get a lot of those flying to China, so it could be a boon for me. But it all depends on the rates.
Jul 14, 2015, 12:12 pm
#33
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: MSP
Programs: Delta PM, Marriott Plat, Hertz Pres
Posts: 3,649
Jul 14, 2015, 12:15 pm
#34
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
Programs: A3*Gold, SPG Plat, HyattDiamond, MarriottPP, LHW exAccess, ICI, Raffles Amb, NW PE MM, TWA Gold MM
Posts: 100,404
If anything, there's an argument that PWM should be cheaper if it requires a DL AMEX card, but more expensive if PWM tickets earn MQMs/MQSs/RDMs.
Jul 14, 2015, 12:15 pm
#35
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Back in Reds Country (DAY/CVG). Previously: SEA & SAT.
Programs: DL PM 1MM, AA PLAT, UA Silver, Marriott Bonvoy Titanium
Posts: 10,348
Jul 14, 2015, 12:17 pm
#36
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
Programs: A3*Gold, SPG Plat, HyattDiamond, MarriottPP, LHW exAccess, ICI, Raffles Amb, NW PE MM, TWA Gold MM
Posts: 100,404
Jul 14, 2015, 12:20 pm
#37
formerly known as daveland
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: NY, NY, USA
Programs: Hyatt Globalist, Marriott LTP, Delta Platinum, Hilton Honors Diamond, Wyndham Diamond
Posts: 2,969
Actually - is there a chart showing the mileage upgrade prices? PLEASE tell me these won't be the dynamic upgrade prices I've been occasionally quoted by reps - where it's the difference between Y and F but in miles.... (That will only be 150,000 miles to upgrade one way, sir!)
Jul 14, 2015, 12:22 pm
#38
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: BOS
Programs: DL DM 2MM, Marriott LT Titanium, Hertz PC, Avis PC
Posts: 15,193
I would have to think they're going to tier the upgrade levels... would not be reasonable to charge the same amount of miles for an M>J upgrade vs a K>J upgrade.
Currently for intl, YBM are 25k each way for many routes... just wild speculation but what if the SHQK are 2x the price at 50k each way, or more?
Currently for intl, YBM are 25k each way for many routes... just wild speculation but what if the SHQK are 2x the price at 50k each way, or more?
Jul 14, 2015, 12:23 pm
#39
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
Programs: A3*Gold, SPG Plat, HyattDiamond, MarriottPP, LHW exAccess, ICI, Raffles Amb, NW PE MM, TWA Gold MM
Posts: 100,404
I would have to think they're going to tier the upgrade levels... would not be reasonable to charge the same amount of miles for an M>J upgrade vs a K>J upgrade.
Currently for intl, YBM are 25k each way for many routes... just wild speculation but what if the SHQK are 2x the price at 50k each way, or more?
Currently for intl, YBM are 25k each way for many routes... just wild speculation but what if the SHQK are 2x the price at 50k each way, or more?
Jul 14, 2015, 12:24 pm
#40
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: STL
Programs: DL DM; HH gold
Posts: 554
In general I like the concept - if there is reliable availability (or at least an agent can confirm inventory) AND they clear at booking, I will be more than happy to buy up to a K+ for TATL. Most of my attempts in the past with doing miles upgrades withered on the waitlist and as we know miles upgrades don't clear at the gate (does that change?).
Honestly, though, this is also clearly a self-serving move for DL, as they have a pretty good understanding of D1 demand and can match available miles UG to that. Why not let medallions burn all those pesky miles (balance sheet liability), make them feel good and get them a D1 seat that would otherwise not have sold/filled with OpUp/NR, AND have another coach seat to sell. Still - it's somewhat of a win-win, but let's not kid ourselves on who the long-term winner is in this.
Side-note: I think if this miles UG program works well, it spells the end of OpUps (or at least makes them much more rare).
Jul 14, 2015, 12:25 pm
#41
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2015
Location: Back in Reds Country (DAY/CVG). Previously: SEA & SAT.
Programs: DL PM 1MM, AA PLAT, UA Silver, Marriott Bonvoy Titanium
Posts: 10,348
will be taken as a complaint, and not an "analysis".
Also, it's hardly a "transfer" of benefits. After all, ANYONE who has enough miles could upgrade to D1 on JFK-LAX/SFO, which would put them ahead of DMs waiting for a complimentary upgrade on these routes. When DL allowed PMs who selected SWUs to use those certs on JFK-LAX/SFO, they were ahead of DMs awaiting complimentary upgrades. So at worst, all you can "complain" about is that it's back to the way it was for DMs. And if a DM is that worried about it, they can 1) buy a D1 ticket to begin with or 2) select RUCs as one of their choice benefits and use one themselves.
Jul 14, 2015, 12:27 pm
#42
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: VA
Programs: DL GM
Posts: 154
Keith
Jul 14, 2015, 12:28 pm
#43
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: YTO/DEL/BOM/GAU
Programs: A few airlines, hotel programs and car rentals
Posts: 1,238
2. If DL intended to increase BE/D1/FC award inventory, I'm sure that would have been highlighted in the announcement. No news is bad news here.
The statements about upgrades with miles apply to instrument-supported upgrades for tickets paid with money, not the difference in costs in miles for coach versus premium cabin award tickets. [Note also that you cannot "upgrade" an award ticket with miles; you must reissue it as a BE/D1/FC award ticket and pay the difference in miles plus any applicable change/cancel/redeposit fee that applies, currently $150 for accounts that are not DM or PM.]
The statements about upgrades with miles apply to instrument-supported upgrades for tickets paid with money, not the difference in costs in miles for coach versus premium cabin award tickets. [Note also that you cannot "upgrade" an award ticket with miles; you must reissue it as a BE/D1/FC award ticket and pay the difference in miles plus any applicable change/cancel/redeposit fee that applies, currently $150 for accounts that are not DM or PM.]
'The statements about upgrades with miles apply to instrument-supported upgrades for tickets paid with money...' ~ I was wondering what this phrase meant, MSPeconomist? I thought instrument supported UG's are the ones got through GUCs/RUCs?
Jul 14, 2015, 12:30 pm
#44
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Minneapolis: DL DM charter 2.3MM
Programs: A3*Gold, SPG Plat, HyattDiamond, MarriottPP, LHW exAccess, ICI, Raffles Amb, NW PE MM, TWA Gold MM
Posts: 100,404
Maybe it's different in Minnesota but where I'm from, an expression like this:
will be taken as a complaint, and not an "analysis".
Also, it's hardly a "transfer" of benefits. After all, ANYONE who has enough miles could upgrade to D1 on JFK-LAX/SFO, which would put them ahead of DMs waiting for a complimentary upgrade on these routes. When DL allowed PMs who selected SWUs to use those certs on JFK-LAX/SFO, they were ahead of DMs awaiting complimentary upgrades. So at worst, all you can "complain" about is that it's back to the way it was for DMs. And if a DM is that worried about it, they can 1) buy a D1 ticket to begin with or 2) select RUCs as one of their choice benefits and use one themselves.
will be taken as a complaint, and not an "analysis".
Also, it's hardly a "transfer" of benefits. After all, ANYONE who has enough miles could upgrade to D1 on JFK-LAX/SFO, which would put them ahead of DMs waiting for a complimentary upgrade on these routes. When DL allowed PMs who selected SWUs to use those certs on JFK-LAX/SFO, they were ahead of DMs awaiting complimentary upgrades. So at worst, all you can "complain" about is that it's back to the way it was for DMs. And if a DM is that worried about it, they can 1) buy a D1 ticket to begin with or 2) select RUCs as one of their choice benefits and use one themselves.
Jul 14, 2015, 12:31 pm
#45
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Northern Calif./Eastern Ida.
Programs: Amethyst Premier Plutonium Medallion
Posts: 20,640
RUCs on premium transcon travel is huge (if they clear). Does this mean we can apply them immediately, for travel after 7/21, or can only start applying them after 7/21?