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The Definitive B/E on JFK-LAX route did not have lie flat seats as advertised thread

The Definitive B/E on JFK-LAX route did not have lie flat seats as advertised thread

Old Feb 22, 15, 10:14 am
  #1  
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The Definitive B/E on JFK-LAX route did not have lie flat seats as advertised thread

I was just on a trip from LAX - JFK returning from LAX - JFK last night. I paid $ (to get to upgradeable fare) + miles to upgrade to lie flat BE seats each way. In doing this I actually had to change flights I took to change to flights where I could get an upgradeable seat to BE. I planned my entire trip around being able to sleep on the plane and get right to work when arrived in NYC and when I got back to LA. The flight out to JFK was great. On the return I kept checking my seat assignment each day (I am neurotic and just enjoyed seeing my seat in the BE cabin on the seating map). The morning of my flight yesterday, I noticed that the cabin layout changed without any notice or email. Instead of 1 + 2 + 1, it was now 2 + 2 + 2. It still said lie flat beds on the seating map, but I wanted to double check so I called Delta. They confirmed that there were stil lie flat beds on this flight. I showed up to the airport and spent the afternoon in the SkyClub waiting for my flight. There was a 2 hour delay at the airport, and then we finally boarded. When we boarded I was in shock to find out that it was an old plane with cramped first class seats and NO business elite. I immediately asked the flight attendants what happened and they had no answer. I ran back out to the gate agent and asked him. He rudely told me to deal with it and call delta in the morning.

How should I be compensated for this? I spent a considerable amount of $ + miles to get a BE lie flat seat. I planned my entire trip and work schedule around these flights. I almost feel like a refund isn't enough for the added inconvenience here. Sould I ask for a GUC or SUC?

The best part was this: once on the plane, we spent over 3 hours stuck on the Tarmac waiting to be de-iced, and I found out (from the nice girl next to me) that they put 6 stand bys who paid for economy seats and were NOT medallion members into first class (which I had paid BE prices for!).

What should I do! Please help!
bidavis01 is offline  
Old Feb 22, 15, 10:30 am
  #2  
 
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Is there anything that guarantees lie flats? If not I think you could call and complain and they will probably give you a large amount of sky miles but probably not an SWU or whatever they are called now.

I would make very clear to delta you called and were assured of lie flat seating. However they can always say unexpected circumstances led to the change.
cfabar1 is online now  
Old Feb 22, 15, 10:35 am
  #3  
 
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Were the rest of the BE amenities offered? Upgraded menu? Blanket pillow, etc?
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Old Feb 22, 15, 10:42 am
  #4  
JBa
 
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http://news.delta.com/2014-06-16-Del...nd-Los-Angeles

Should answer the question
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Old Feb 22, 15, 10:44 am
  #5  
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Originally Posted by merlin3008 View Post
Were the rest of the BE amenities offered? Upgraded menu? Blanket pillow, etc?
Blank + pillow: yes, although not possible to really use either given very limited recline and space.

Upgraded menu: yes

Tumi case: no

And most importantly, lie flat bed: no

My thought is: if you pay for a product and don't get it, you get a refund. I didn't pay for a slightly better meal. I paid for a lie flat bed. If I pay for a Porsche, and show up at the dealership to find a Toyota Camry, should I still pay for the Porsche?
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Old Feb 22, 15, 10:50 am
  #6  
 
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Originally Posted by JBa View Post
See - here's the caveat. In that press release, it states "by Summer 2015".

On the other hand, the new billboard which has gone up outside the Midtown Tunnel in NYC (Eastbound) clearly states lie-flat beds on *every* NYC-LAX flight. Will try to get a snap of it tomorrow if traffic is as slow as I expect it to be.
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Old Feb 22, 15, 11:04 am
  #7  
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I was under the impression that DL stated JFK-LAX was now all lie-flat service. So I would say that you are owed some considerable compensation. I know that JFK-SFO is not a guarantee yet. Quite honestly I don't even know why they would bother with SFO as DL has a very small operation there.
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Old Feb 22, 15, 11:30 am
  #8  
 
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Ordinarily you would be SOL - equipment is not a right on a flight.

HOWEVER, this is a very unique route. They are trying to turn this route into something special and take business from the other airlines. My guess is if you complain you will get a healthy offer.
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Old Feb 22, 15, 11:32 am
  #9  
 
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Originally Posted by bidavis01 View Post
I was just on a trip from LAX - JFK returning from LAX - JFK last night. I paid $ (to get to upgradeable fare) + miles to upgrade to lie flat BE seats each way. In doing this I actually had to change flights I took to change to flights where I could get an upgradeable seat to BE. I planned my entire trip around being able to sleep on the plane and get right to work when arrived in NYC and when I got back to LA. The flight out to JFK was great. On the return I kept checking my seat assignment each day (I am neurotic and just enjoyed seeing my seat in the BE cabin on the seating map). The morning of my flight yesterday, I noticed that the cabin layout changed without any notice or email. Instead of 1 + 2 + 1, it was now 2 + 2 + 2. It still said lie flat beds on the seating map, but I wanted to double check so I called Delta. They confirmed that there were stil lie flat beds on this flight. I showed up to the airport and spent the afternoon in the SkyClub waiting for my flight. There was a 2 hour delay at the airport, and then we finally boarded. When we boarded I was in shock to find out that it was an old plane with cramped first class seats and NO business elite. I immediately asked the flight attendants what happened and they had no answer. I ran back out to the gate agent and asked him. He rudely told me to deal with it and call delta in the morning.

How should I be compensated for this? I spent a considerable amount of $ + miles to get a BE lie flat seat. I planned my entire trip and work schedule around these flights. I almost feel like a refund isn't enough for the added inconvenience here. Sould I ask for a GUC or SUC?

The best part was this: once on the plane, we spent over 3 hours stuck on the Tarmac waiting to be de-iced, and I found out (from the nice girl next to me) that they put 6 stand bys who paid for economy seats and were NOT medallion members into first class (which I had paid BE prices for!).

What should I do! Please help!
Unfortunately, it seems this is happening more frequently. This post from a flyer a few weeks ago talks about the same situation. Was this the same flight you were on?

OP, be ready for the DL fanboys to start attacking you that s&*t happens and to deal with it. That even though you paid more money and spent miles you're owed nothing. They'll no doubt be adding their insight soon.

Originally Posted by JBa View Post
That link discusses all flights to LAX, SFO and SEA from JFK being lie-flat by summer. This link is the one you'll want to reference that states as of July 1st, 2014 all JFK-LAX is lie-flat.

Originally Posted by landeej View Post
See - here's the caveat. In that press release, it states "by Summer 2015".

On the other hand, the new billboard which has gone up outside the Midtown Tunnel in NYC (Eastbound) clearly states lie-flat beds on *every* NYC-LAX flight. Will try to get a snap of it tomorrow if traffic is as slow as I expect it to be.
Link in post above to confirm all JFK-LAX vv has been advertised as all lie flat since July 2014.
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Old Feb 22, 15, 11:35 am
  #10  
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Call to complain. Next time it goes to 2-2-2 switch flights if you can.
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Old Feb 22, 15, 12:00 pm
  #11  
 
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Originally Posted by bidavis01 View Post
My thought is: if you pay for a product and don't get it, you get a refund. I didn't pay for a slightly better meal. I paid for a lie flat bed. If I pay for a Porsche, and show up at the dealership to find a Toyota Camry, should I still pay for the Porsche?
Not the best analogy. If you buy a Porsche and get a Camry, do you expect them to refund the Porsche price but still let you keep the Camry?

They got you to your destination, safely I might add albeit late, but apparently all you were denied was an opportunity to recline your seat all the way flat. BTW, I fly in those “cramped” F seats a lot. If you think they are bad, try flying in one of the seats behind the curtain.

Contact DL and most likely they will send you an ‘apologize for the inconvenience’ letter and add in some RDM’s. Wouldn’t be holding my breath if you think there will be a refund.
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Old Feb 22, 15, 1:05 pm
  #12  
 
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One of the earliest lessons I learned on this great website/community is to question what you are told if something seems fishy. Equipment swaps happen, and now you know never to just accept the answer without some due diligence.

You'll learn to identify aircraft types and their respective cabin and what can or cannot be possible.

I agree there's reason to complain; how much you can get as compensation is up to debate.

Good luck.
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Old Feb 22, 15, 1:05 pm
  #13  
 
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Originally Posted by Sez_Who View Post
Not the best analogy. If you buy a Porsche and get a Camry, do you expect them to refund the Porsche price but still let you keep the Camry?

They got you to your destination, safely I might add albeit late, but apparently all you were denied was an opportunity to recline your seat all the way flat. BTW, I fly in those “cramped” F seats a lot. If you think they are bad, try flying in one of the seats behind the curtain.

Contact DL and most likely they will send you an ‘apologize for the inconvenience’ letter and add in some RDM’s. Wouldn’t be holding my breath if you think there will be a refund.
I think that OP could make a good case for a Delta credit voucher for the amount between the lowest available fare and the upgradable fare that he purchased. This plus a refund of the miles used for the upgrade. While OP did fly in first class, OP might not have spent money and miles for a domestic first class experience (though many still would have on a transcon).
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Old Feb 22, 15, 3:51 pm
  #14  
 
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Not really sure why you think you should be compensated for anything. Equipment changes and delays happen all of the time, to every airline for a myriad of reasons. Would you have preferred waiting for Delta metal that had BE lie flat, because I'm sure your delay would have been much, much longer. If there is some difference in price/miles between business with lie flat vs. regular biz, then you should be compensated for the difference. Otherwise, you shouldn't be compensated at all.

I just don't understand this mentality that you are owed something if the slightest thing goes off schedule. I'm sure Delta would throw miles your way as it is no skin off of their back and it keeps the customer happy.
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Old Feb 22, 15, 4:05 pm
  #15  
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Having has this happen, I emailed, called customer care, generally complained all over and asked for the fare difference and my SWU back. All I got was 12.5k, the amount of miles is takes to upgrade a one way fare to BE. YMMV.
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