waltinsocal

My feeling is that we don't know if there will be fewer, or the same number of visitors to the SCs. What I do feel is that the bean counters at DL will not allow DL to introduce any new/changes to any program that will not enhance revenue, which is DL's right and is perfectly fine even though many of us may not like the changes. I believe that DL feels that it will make more revenue off of the changes to the SC rules. Whether or not that means that SCs will have the same or fewer number of guests is an open question. I would caution against drawing any conclusions about the changes until about at least 6 months to a year have passed and folks have decided to either renew their memberships or pursue other options. I will gag, if in only 2 months, someone posts here that the crowds have magically become smaller, and the SCs are no longer "overcrowded".

davisew

We've all seen how FCM has played out. I don't know why anyone thinks SCM will be any different.

Pathfinder813

It'll be interesting to see what happens after May 1. Here's what I think:

For DL Amex holders, not much really changes for DL Amex Plat (the DL branded card) except that entry is now a few dollars more. I think these cardholders who do pay to get in will continue but I'd think they only utilize the SC if there is enough time. In other words, if I had a card, I'd only pay the money to use the SC if I had to wait over 1 hour or so to board my flight. If they were paying $25 before, I don't think an extra $4 will be a deterrence.

For DL Reserve or Amex Plat holders, I think this is the game changer here. With no guest privileges, they would be forced to pay per guest or get their significant others an extra card which costs a decent chunk of change. I think if someone was traveling with two others, he or she would have to pay $58 and at this point, they'd do the math and decide that maybe sitting at an airport bar would be better. Ditto for any family.

I think not too much changes for SkyClub members and DM passengers; many of these people are flying on business and I'd think they're usually travelling alone.

As for day passes, I suppose people can continue to pay $50 but as much as we love to complain about overcrowding and bad behavior, I'm not too sure that someone who pays $50 would be acting like an animal in the lounge; especially if there's only Gordon's, cheap wine and beer. However, I suppose if they do pay, come in, get drunk and be rowdy, they weren't that smart to begin with...

Here's to hoping DL knows what they're doing and that the SCs can get a little better. Man do I miss the days when the LAX CRC was nice and quiet and still had the rotunda with glass walls...

waltinsocal

You know what's interesting about these threads about SC "overcrowding";
What in the world does overcrowding mean?

In a strictly legal sense, there is no "overcrowding" if the total number of individuals in a SC is equal to or fewer than the local fire department allows in the SC.

Beyond that, we hear the usual complaining here about too many people being in his/her favorite SC. Can someone please define for me what "overcrowding" is at the SC at LAX? Is it 80 people in the SC? Or 70?
Do you want 5 people in the SC because it makes you feel more special when you are in there?

Seriously, I get tired of the phrase tossed about here that says SCs are overcrowded. Those of you who use it frequently, do you even know what that means. And I don't want to hear that you only want your personally desired number of people in a certain SC.

So for LAX, can someone toss out an ABSOLUTE maximum number of people inside there at one time that would not make the place "overcrowded" I mean, you see the chairs in there. Should DL remove seating so fewer people have a place to sit? Should the door dragons turn paying members away when your number is reached? And by the way, I do mean "absolute" number. The interior size of the club is set in stone, so it shouldn't be that difficult to come up with a number that satisfies you.

motytrah

Most people define it based on the ability to find a seat and the ability to utilize services reasonable amount of time (i.e. bar, showers, etc.) Which has zero to do with the calculations the fire Marshall uses to calculate egress times.

If you normally have to cruise the club waiting for seats to open up it's overcrowded. If you're normally waiting in a long queue at the bar it's overcrowded. If they normally tell you there's a long wait for the showers it's overcrowded.

jsbh

You will still have access as a DM this Medallion year. 2015 will be Individual unless you upgrade.

See here: http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/delta...p-options.html

keeton

Well, "crowding" (whether legally "over" or not) is an issue.

Examples:
1. You have to wait to get in to the SC because of fire regulation rules (and this has happened to me).
2. You cannot find the seat type you want (bar, individual, group or work area) because they are all occupied or someone has stowed their luggage in a seat.
3. You have to stand in a substantial line for the services (bar, food, agent or showers).

The above, and a general decline in service (especially the less-experienced, less-empowered agents), is why I let my membership lapse a couple of months ago after well over a decade of membership. And you know what...I don't miss a thing.

squatch

if the net result of this is that they install more (and more easily accessible) power outlets in the MCO skyclub, then all the better. right now the energy situation at MCO is garbage

Billy Mumphrey

Maybe I'm just not going at peak times, but I've never seen any SkyClub overcrowded. Busy, sure, but have always been able to find 2 seats together and never waited more than a couple minutes for a drink at the bar.

In February I went into a EWR United club with some credit card day passes around 4:30pm and when we left an hour later there were 40 people in line waiting to get in. The lounge dragon let in 2 people when my wife and I left. People were visibly upset and I could see their point if they invested a lot in a membership, only to be waiting in a ridiculous line. Granted this was right before most of the European departures take off, probably a very peak time, but I've never seen this at Delta's T4 SkyClub at JFK around the same time.

MSPeconomist

Try DCA in the late afternoon or early evening, especially on Thursday. There are no seats and long lines for the (tended) bar. There can be a wait to enter, especially during IROPs.

ijgordon

Particularly interested in this. Was at the LGA C club a couple weeks ago at 7:30am on a Saturday and there were quite a few kids screaming and running around. It wasn't overcrowded at that point, but it certainly wasn't peaceful. I presume that if parents have to pay for any kids beyond a limit, they'll be disincented to even visit the club. Which is good for the rest of us. ^

MSPeconomist

We can only hope, but the immediate effect will only be for those who enter with AmEx Plat or DL Reserve cards.

TheMadBrewer

This. Over the 20+ years I have had access to the WorldClub/SkyClub (thru membership or Amex Plat) I bet I've averaged less than two guests a year. A couple of passes a year -- make them such that the member must be with them if you want to avoid them being sold -- would keep me very happy.

ijgordon

Understood, but my wild-... guess is that probably half the people enter the clubs that way.

I do like the idea of a limited number of guest passes. Amex should pay for them for us since they still really haven't taken much sting away from the loss of AA/US and this pending downgrade. Using the $200 airline credit isn't the answer, IMO.

xliioper

Not really comparable at all. FCM was about giving cheaper access to FC (available to anyone) over those Medallions who wish to take a chance on a comp upgrade. There's no class of customer who is getting cheaper access to the SC's.

I don't know if there were be a readily apparent reduction in crowding, but I can't see things getting worse with the changes. As others have noted, it will probably take some time to fully play out as those with existing memberships and Amex Plat/DL Reserve cards chose not to renew due to the changes.