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Frequent Flyer Who Doubted Delta's Math Loses Challenge

Frequent Flyer Who Doubted Delta's Math Loses Challenge

Old Jan 16, 14, 7:26 pm
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Frequent Flyer Who Doubted Delta's Math Loses Challenge

Just how far would you go for a few more Skypesos?

http://www.courthousenews.com/2014/01/16/64608.htm
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Old Jan 16, 14, 8:12 pm
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This was actually reported a few day ago. No real news here, the same result happened with UA. Nevertheless, a good reminder for those who are quick to say that pax should sue airlines when they don't get intended results.

The only lawsuit that has real potential merit is a class action that challenges who actually owns these airline miles. The airlines claim they do but fact is, some are purchased by pax. If the court rules the airlines own them, we are DOA. OTOH, if we own them, it is the airlines who have serious problems.

Of course, it will take 10 yrs to get a final decision in something like this but it would be nice to have this resolved.
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Old Jan 17, 14, 4:53 am
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Wow. Extra miles for entering a holding pattern? That's... Nuts!

The "direct" flight mileage penalty, while a well known rule by the cognoscenti, is a good point though.
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Old Jan 17, 14, 11:32 am
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Originally Posted by DeltaFan4Now View Post
The "direct" flight mileage penalty, while a well known rule by the cognoscenti, is a good point though.
Indeed... I wonder if the outcome would have been different if the plaintiff had focused on that issue, rather than weakening their position by mixing in the absurd claim that they should get miles according to the flight path.
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Old Jan 17, 14, 11:48 am
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Originally Posted by TravellingSalesman View Post
Indeed... I wonder if the outcome would have been different if the plaintiff had focused on that issue, rather than weakening their position by mixing in the absurd claim that they should get miles according to the flight path.
Wouldn't it be a good enhancement to make it even simpler by calculating miles as start-to-finish? It would add an interesting twist to single-day MRs ... ATL-NYC-DTW-xxx-xxx-ATL ... leading to zero miles
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Old Jan 17, 14, 12:16 pm
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Originally Posted by DeltaFan4Now View Post
Wow. Extra miles for entering a holding pattern? That's... Nuts!
Considering it's a privately run program, they can give credits however they see fit.

Originally Posted by DeltaFan4Now View Post
The "direct" flight mileage penalty, while a well known rule by the cognoscenti, is a good point though.
That's why I avoid direct flights at all times.
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Old Jan 17, 14, 12:32 pm
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Originally Posted by cre95 View Post
Wouldn't it be a good enhancement to make it even simpler by calculating miles as start-to-finish? It would add an interesting twist to single-day MRs ... ATL-NYC-DTW-xxx-xxx-ATL ... leading to zero miles
I believe TK already does it this way -- flying XXX-YYY-ZZZ earns you miles as if you flew XXX-ZZZ.
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Old Jan 17, 14, 12:40 pm
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So for those more knowledgeable about legal stuff than I am, does the fact that Delta awards miles for mileage runs, even though they say it's not permitted, weaken their position that the T&C's apply or does it not make any difference?

I realize in this case, there has already been a ruling but just wondering if the plaintiff could have possibly used mileage runs to show that DL doesn't always uphold it's own T&C's.
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Old Jan 17, 14, 12:42 pm
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But it would be nice if the miles awarded for a flight were the same as the distance as reported in the flight details.
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Old Jan 17, 14, 1:32 pm
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Originally Posted by justhere View Post
So for those more knowledgeable about legal stuff than I am, does the fact that Delta awards miles for mileage runs, even though they say it's not permitted, weaken their position that the T&C's apply or does it not make any difference?
Who's to say that someone is specifically on a mileage run? You can always say that you are handing someone some papers at the airport, and flying back.

I reported in another thread that, I booked a goofy 4-flight one-way int'l trip - and ditto on the return - and was somehow auto rebooked to a 2-flight itinerary each way. I just called up and was put back on the 4-flight itinerary - on the exact same flights I booked originally - no questions asked.

Yes, I know - I'm a gamer!
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Old Jan 17, 14, 1:51 pm
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Originally Posted by SJC ORD LDR View Post


That's why I avoid direct flights at all times.
The judge also cited this rarely-enforced technicality:

"On connecting flights that require a change of plane and flight number, mileage credited will be calculated based upon the distance from origin to destination for each segment of the trip. However, use of connecting itineraries in lieu of nonstop and/or direct flights for the accumulation of additional mileage is not permitted."
In theory, any combination of connecting flights could be reward with the same mileage as a "direct" flight, if a "direct" flight is available.

There are cheaper ways to earn miles than paying attorneys to pursue federal lawsuits. One of the flights she was complaining about took place last March, which means that this suit was resolved in <10 months, an amazingly short time for a federal suit. I'd bet if anyone pulled up the file on PACER, it would turn out to be a summary dismissal.

Meet the unsuccessful plaintiff: Wynette Kwok

She used to work for Walt Disney. FairyLand, here we come!
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Old Jan 17, 14, 1:57 pm
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Originally Posted by davetravels View Post
Who's to say that someone is specifically on a mileage run? You can always say that you are handing someone some papers at the airport, and flying back.
That was my point. DL doesn't know why you are flying so I was curious how having that seemingly non-enforceable part of the T&C's tied directly into the part about earning miles might affect things from a legal perspective.
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Old Jan 17, 14, 2:34 pm
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Originally Posted by MikeMpls View Post
The judge also cited this rarely-enforced technicality:



In theory, any combination of connecting flights could be reward with the same mileage as a "direct" flight, if a "direct" flight is available.

There are cheaper ways to earn miles than paying attorneys to pursue federal lawsuits. One of the flights she was complaining about took place last March, which means that this suit was resolved in <10 months, an amazingly short time for a federal suit. I'd bet if anyone pulled up the file on PACER, it would turn out to be a summary dismissal.

Meet the unsuccessful plaintiff: Wynette Kwok

She used to work for Walt Disney. FairyLand, here we come!
Yes -- more interesting would be to identify the lawyer(s) who filed this farkakte lawsuit.
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Old Jan 17, 14, 4:37 pm
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Originally Posted by bloxomo View Post
I believe TK already does it this way -- flying XXX-YYY-ZZZ earns you miles as if you flew XXX-ZZZ.
TK gives actual miles for segments flown.
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Old Jan 17, 14, 4:40 pm
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Originally Posted by cre95 View Post
Wouldn't it be a good enhancement to make it even simpler by calculating miles as start-to-finish? It would add an interesting twist to single-day MRs ... ATL-NYC-DTW-xxx-xxx-ATL ... leading to zero miles
Originally Posted by justhere View Post
That was my point. DL doesn't know why you are flying so I was curious how having that seemingly non-enforceable part of the T&C's tied directly into the part about earning miles might affect things from a legal perspective.
It doesn't matter why you flying. Most customers fly round trips, although not on the same day, but again, that doesn't matter either. What matters are the destination(s) you are paying DL to get you to. In the first case above, I doubt the ticket is fared as ATL->ATL, one or more of the other cities in the itin are included in the fare basis for the ticket. DL is obligated to get you to those cities (to the extent that their COC actually obligates them to anything). Those cities would count for mileage calculation in any case. Other cities are connections that DL isn't required to get you to, in theory they could change the program and follow the TK example above and not include those in the mileage calculation (luckily for us, they don't exclude them).
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