MSPeconomist

I'm starting to wonder, admittedly from not a lot of data points--just my own experience, whether DL has cut back on offering advanced Z inventory. Alternatively, could DL's recent announcement that the 150% MQMs for M class will decrease to 100% have caused lots of people to suddenly grab all the Z seats that were out there? Or could the decrease in the number of BE seats due to reconfiguration be the cause?

In the past, with my travel patterns, I've never had much trouble (and less so when PMNW became DL although I miss seeing the upgrade space on the computer myself so quick and easy to check before calling) finding upgrade seats to confirm whenever I was ready to buy an M or equivalent ticket.

Last week I tried looking for two TPAC trips, mid/late March and mid/late November, with a good bit of date flexibility. These are periods of high domestic demand for travel and most so much longhaul international, but the TPAC segments are the problem. The flights seem to be wide open, even with I9 and S9 (although I and S aren't cheap), but there's barely one Z seat in each direction over a week or two interval using a reasonable routing. I've talked with multiple DL agents as well as using EF.

In the past, when I've tried to do this, for travel during the same period and with the same degree of flexibility, I was always able to confirm Z for the schedule I wanted with no apparent problem.

My attitude has been that I'm unhappy of course about the M and B fare increases, but I'm willing in general to make that tradeoff in order to confirm my upgrades at the time of ticketing rather than playing the waitlist game like UA and AA SWU-using elites do. This is an unexpected downgrade in the DL FF program for DMs and PMs, plus any others that would upgrade from M+ fares using miles.

rylan

Yes I see the same thing. Longer range Z seems to be less available. I'd guess DL is selling or pushing to sell more BE seats in I+ so are squeezing the SWU inventory. Seems to be the case with how they gave the finger to M fare buyers. They're chasing the big bucks and forgetting about everything else.

exwannabe

Just spent a few minutes across many months and I see the same thing.

Agree with you that being able to confirm Z vs waitlist is a big issue. I am not flying TPAC in a coach seat, so the waitlist is useless.

Hopefully this might be a transitional issue and it returns to the previous levels "soon".

Xeno

I posted a thread not unlike this last month when I was buying TPAC tickets. Finding Z led to compromises in my schedule even with a price tag near $5K.

MSPeconomist

Has anyone ever refused to board if a BE seat doesn't clear at the gate?

rylan

Don't hold your breath... it appears that along with slashed MQM accrual on very expensive M fares, we are also facing lack of Z availability. Sure makes the SWUs look like a sorry option.

MSPeconomist

I can easily see the AF/KLM reduced availability making DL upgrade and award space much harder to find TATL (to the extent that those who had been using the AF PV to Affaires feature are willing to pay for DL M+), but I was surprised to notice such a big change on TPAC flights, although some intraAsia seems OK still for upgrades.

HongKonger

I have noticed this when I was planning a TPAC itinerary I recently completed. By setting a lot of EF alerts with a little creativity in routing I was able to put together an itinerary with all legs UGed in advance except a domestic leg which also eventually UGed in advance. Availability is thinning out though.

MSPeconomist

When did this start for TPAC (and why did no one report the phenomenon earlier)?

Has anyone observed it getting noticeably worse since the MQMs for M announcement? Will there be absolutely nothing until March 1, when DL will suddenly decide to release more Z seats again? (Yes I'm suspicious.)

rylan

Not sure... I haven't booked any flights since the announcement.

ClipperDelta

TATL Z availability is still decent - haven't noticed much change.

TPAC appears to have become more restrictive in the last few months (before the recent changes) - may have to do with the all-flat-bed offerings across the Pacific starting this spring/summer. With all flat-beds soon, Delta is probably trying to sell more of the BE seats instead of opening them up to upgrades...They have announced in the past that paid BE ridership and revenues have gone up quite a bit once flat-beds were introduced on particular routes....

exwannabe

Have the prices dropped any for the ex-US TPACs? Just priced ATL<>BKK M and it is $4050 RT AI. That is still high, but many have been saying they were over $5k (I have not priced this direction in years).

rylan

Availability was good through last fall for tpac, and that was with lie-flats fully in place on the 747s.. although fall is generally lower travel demand for that region. Probably just as I said... DL only interested in the big bucks front cabin flyer.

rylan

Not that I've seen. BOS-SIN is almost 5k. 4.6k to ICN.

MSPeconomist

This is good. I've been seeing $5-6K and more for DL TPAC RTs.