Skymiles Change Rumor?

Old Mar 25, 2012, 5:47 pm
  #1081  
 
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Originally Posted by mnredfox
While still in rumor phase (which of course this could go on a long time), anyone nervous about piling up rollover MQM's as a result of this?

I'm about to cross over the DM threshold but instead of building up rollover, I'm thinking about doing a UA challenge for 1K and staying there the rest of the year if this is true.

Anyone else in the same boat?
I'm looking at DM from PM mid year and am seriously considering a 2nd half status match. Not sure with whom. I would like more information from Delta before I initiate the challenge.
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Old Mar 25, 2012, 5:52 pm
  #1082  
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Originally Posted by GYEWorldTraveler
Fares have been $1000-1500 in the past two years....I have flown the route several times...right now all airfares are higher. And I was not strictly talking about MRs, I am talking about taking THAT trip. I don't think I would ever consider doing a weekend in Y with only a couple hrs in JNB....thats a bit ridiculous. I don't have the time or desire to fly an intl MR like that.......so I think you missed the point of my post. I think DL probably does worry about what I just pointed out...otherwise they wouldn't be considering a revenue based FF program.

To possibly help you better understand here is a scenario:

A:
Happy Delta Flyer buys a J class ticket LAX-LHR for $8,000. As a DM Happy Delta Flyer earns 16,066 flown miles, 8,033 Class of Service Bonus miles and 20,083 DM bonus miles for a total of 44,182 total RDMs.

B:
Happy Delta Flyers buys a T class ticket LAX-JNB for $1,500. As a DM Happy Delta Flyer earns 20,770 flown miles and 25,963 DM bonus miles for a total of 46,733 total RDMs.

In scenario B Happy Delta Flyer is getting more RDMs for a lot less spend than scenario A. You can bet the house that DL wants passenger A's enjoying more benefits than passenger B's. With the current mileage based FF program it is difficult to differentiate for DL because both passengers are DMs. A revenue based FF program would address this issue.

I wish they would transition into this by just adding a 5th tier that is revenue based and then from there they could transition the program if it was a general consensus that it was a necessary action. However, with the company doing well and appearing healthy right now it is a bit of an interesting move (in my opinion). I feel many people on this boards pain and hope that it is only a rumor but from a business standpoint I understand why a revenue based program would be attractive. I guess there really is no good time to introduce it though....
Why would pax A buy unrestricted J?
You should be comparing discount J to discount Y.
Where is pax A connecting?
JFK?
ATL?
DTT?
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Old Mar 25, 2012, 5:54 pm
  #1083  
 
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Originally Posted by bubbashow
Moreover, they are consistently delivering profits for their stockholders.
Delta doesn't pay dividends to their stockholders so they are delivering no profits to their stockholders. Their stock price hasn't moved much over the last couple of years either so there has been no appreciable capital gains by their stockholders.
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Old Mar 25, 2012, 5:55 pm
  #1084  
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Originally Posted by bubbashow
I contribute to a VERY real side on this board. You choose to ignore it, but I have received NUMEROUS PMs from many that agree with me. However, this board is about DL, not me....so move on, nothing to look at here.
Not really. It's about a planned ACTION by DL.
Did you notice that you are the poster that has made the most posts, by the way?
I understand you have a different opinion, but at least I am listening to it.
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Old Mar 25, 2012, 6:01 pm
  #1085  
 
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Originally Posted by AA_EXP09
Not really. It's about a planned ACTION by DL.
Did you notice that you are the poster that has made the most posts, by the way?
I understand you have a different opinion, but at least I am listening to it.
For that, I thank you. I do not monitor how many posts are made. My passion on this topic reflects my passion on what I believe an elite program should be. I have chatted with a FT member through this who spent over 100,000 on 17 trips. I believe he deserves far-more perks than I. I, however, fly a lot. I HATE what DL has done to the Elite program and see a possible revenue-based earning and redemption scheme the solution to the problem that DL has created.
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Old Mar 25, 2012, 6:02 pm
  #1086  
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Originally Posted by AA_EXP09
Exactly. He had treated me as if I do not deserve any status on any airline.
Did you seriously write this? It may be time to relax a bit. It's just an airline.
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Old Mar 25, 2012, 6:07 pm
  #1087  
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Originally Posted by bubbashow
For that, I thank you. I do not monitor how many posts are made. My passion on this topic reflects my passion on what I believe an elite program should be. I have chatted with a FT member through this who spent over 100,000 on 17 trips. I believe he deserves far-more perks than I. I, however, fly a lot. I HATE what DL has done to the Elite program and see a possible revenue-based earning and redemption scheme the solution to the problem that DL has created.
He was probably purchasing full Y /discounted J fares.
Those come with many benefits that should only be had on the flights that he took, not flights that he would take after those flights.
I.e.ability to use SWU
150% MQM.
This member is probably at least a GM, if not PM.
AA is doing another promo for HVCs with AAirpass.
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Old Mar 25, 2012, 6:09 pm
  #1088  
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Originally Posted by Deadtail
Did you seriously write this? It may be time to relax a bit. It's just an airline.
In all honesty, I don't care as I barely fly DL at all.
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Old Mar 25, 2012, 6:13 pm
  #1089  
 
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Originally Posted by AA_EXP09
Why would pax A buy unrestricted J?
You should be comparing discount J to discount Y.
Where is pax A connecting?
JFK?
ATL?
DTT?
Why would I compare discount J to discount Y? All I am doing is comparing two types of passengers. One is a Business passenger who travels to LHR for business Sun-Thurs, the other is a DM going to JNB booking a couple weeks out. The LHR pax is LAX-JFK-LHR because that seems to be the best routing to get BE on all flights (as opposed to domestic F). All I am trying to show is that there are different types of passengers and while both DMs on paper DL probably would like to reward passenger A more than passenger B. Right now I don't think DL is rewarding its top spend DMs as much as they would like to and likely (in the companies eyes) rewarding the high mileage, lower revenue DMs more than they would like.

I really feel for the GMs, PMs and DMs that pay $600-1000 every week to fly from smaller cities and on CRJs and don't get the UGs they probably deserve. The proposed new system would likely help this segment of medallions that spend a lot but fly less miles than an international commuting DM. I think a lot of good could come from this type of change.....and having talked with some people that have been invited to the focus groups I think one huge positive that may be coming is a more usable SWU (with lower fare requirements), improved mileage upgrade abilities and more cash + miles (points) options. But I won't argue that LUT passengers likely won't have it as good as they do now
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Old Mar 25, 2012, 6:17 pm
  #1090  
 
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Originally Posted by AA_EXP09
He was probably purchasing full Y /discounted J fares.
Those come with many benefits that should only be had on the flights that he took, not flights that he would take after those flights.
I.e.ability to use SWU
150% MQM.
This member is probably at least a GM, if not PM.
AA is doing another promo for HVCs with AAirpass.
Who then (may I ask) would deserve benefits on later flights?
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Old Mar 25, 2012, 6:25 pm
  #1091  
 
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Originally Posted by AA_EXP09
He was probably purchasing full Y /discounted J fares.
Those come with many benefits that should only be had on the flights that he took, not flights that he would take after those flights.
I.e.ability to use SWU
150% MQM.
This member is probably at least a GM, if not PM.
AA is doing another promo for HVCs with AAirpass.
HVC on AA is Concierge Key, not AAirpass - that is a whole other program.

Fact: Most companies are now focused on targeting, acquiring and retaining those customers that add most to the bottom line, not necessarily volume. That is above and beyond the airline industry.

Fact: Those that are truly HVC (think beyond Medallion status) on DL rarely invoke most of the advertised benefits of Medallion status (SWU usage, comp. upgraded, free bags, etc.). It makes sense to add a level that recognizes and adds true benefits to these people.

Most of the people on this thread that are complaining are likely those that are already complaining of bloated elite ranks. I don't get that, but that is a whole other thread to begin with.

Many current 'elites' are NOT profitable to Delta. They pay for subsidized tickets (LUT) and demand all the benefits. The former may add to revenue, but the latter further takes away from the bottom line. I'm not sure why that is so hard to admit and/or comprehend.
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Old Mar 25, 2012, 6:32 pm
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Originally Posted by pitbulllover
HVC on AA is Concierge Key, not AAirpass - that is a whole other program.

Fact: Most companies are now focused on targeting, acquiring and retaining those customers that add most to the bottom line, not necessarily volume. That is above and beyond the airline industry.

Fact: Those that are truly HVC (think beyond Medallion status) on DL rarely invoke most of the advertised benefits of Medallion status (SWU usage, comp. upgraded, free bags, etc.). It makes sense to add a level that recognizes and adds true benefits to these people.

Most of the people on this thread that are complaining are likely those that are already complaining of bloated elite ranks. I don't get that, but that is a whole other thread to begin with.

Many current 'elites' are NOT profitable to Delta. They pay for subsidized tickets (LUT) and demand all the benefits. The former may add to revenue, but the latter further takes away from the bottom line. I'm not sure why that is so hard to admit and/or comprehend.
^ At least there are a few on FT that think like this We must be a minority though. The general feeling I get from reading many threads and posts here is that the majority want to pay the least and get the most --- and I have no problem with that at all. I just think that its important to see both sides....at the end of the day though DL has to do what they feel is right for business....which many times may not be right or good for a certain population of customers/passengers
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Old Mar 25, 2012, 6:45 pm
  #1093  
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Originally Posted by mother-
nsx, no offense, but Southwest fliers have almost nothing in common with "elite" legacy carrier customers.
On the Southwest forum you will find unanimous agreement that top elite status on a traditional carrier beats top status on Southwest hands down. However for a short-haul nonstop flight at top fare the Southwest program is competitive even for these top elites. For lower fares, connecting flights, or longer flights, it's no contest: legacy elite status wins.

I think Southwest did as much as it could for HVCs with RR 2.0 within the limitations of its hard product. As you note, that's not enough except in special cases.

I'm here not to tout Southwest for HVCs but to share the experience we had during over one year of anticipation and dread of Rapid Rewards 2.0. Virtually all the informed speculation here on FT about those changes proved to be correct, all without any inside information! Underestimate the perspicacity of FTers at your own risk.
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Old Mar 25, 2012, 6:48 pm
  #1094  
 
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Originally Posted by pitbulllover
Many current 'elites' are NOT profitable to Delta. They pay for subsidized tickets (LUT) and demand all the benefits. The former may add to revenue, but the latter further takes away from the bottom line. I'm not sure why that is so hard to admit and/or comprehend.
Perhaps because it is at least as likely WRONG as ACCURATE.

Based on what information can you claim that? Did you get it from the good old 'rectal database'? (thanks FT for that term, I shall use and cherish it). At the least admit that you don't know what you're claiming any more certainly then we know you're wrong.

(BTW I base my opinion on things like Delta making $425m net last quarter, and attributing it to better load factors and cargo.)
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Old Mar 25, 2012, 6:50 pm
  #1095  
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Originally Posted by pitbulllover
HVC on AA is Concierge Key, not AAirpass - that is a whole other program.

Fact: Most companies are now focused on targeting, acquiring and retaining those customers that add most to the bottom line, not necessarily volume. That is above and beyond the airline industry.

Fact: Those that are truly HVC (think beyond Medallion status) on DL rarely invoke most of the advertised benefits of Medallion status (SWU usage, comp. upgraded, free bags, etc.). It makes sense to add a level that recognizes and adds true benefits to these people.

Most of the people on this thread that are complaining are likely those that are already complaining of bloated elite ranks. I don't get that, but that is a whole other thread to begin with.

Many current 'elites' are NOT profitable to Delta. They pay for subsidized tickets (LUT) and demand all the benefits. The former may add to revenue, but the latter further takes away from the bottom line. I'm not sure why that is so hard to admit and/or comprehend.
While I generally agree with everything you said there is one major point you are leaving out: It is their game and their rules. If they did not "sell" benefits based on mileage people would not have an expectation of those benefits. I have said it a million times: FF programs are going away. I will play the "game" (Different than gaming) as long as they are dealing the cards.

THAT is what FT is (or should be) about. Getting the most out of the program. "The program" is what it is until it is not....that is up to DL and it certainly looks like they are coming around to your line of reasoning.
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