Skymiles Change Rumor?

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Old Mar 22, 12, 10:49 pm
  #856  
 
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Originally Posted by Dubai Stu View Post
Fares paid versus miles flown creates an inherent conflict of interest for anyone who flies on the client's dime.
So does the fact that higher fares earn more stuff.
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Old Mar 22, 12, 10:54 pm
  #857  
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Originally Posted by Dubai Stu View Post
Fares paid versus miles flown creates an inherent conflict of interest for anyone who flies on the client's dime.
Actually, for that matter, so does FCM.

The irony, as I may have pointed out elsewhere, is that AMEX, DL's intimate partner, through their travel agent group, is charged with the responsible of keeping travel practices and costs within guidelines for so many corporations.
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Old Mar 23, 12, 1:50 am
  #858  
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Ok. This is NOT a rumor. It is going to happen sooner than any of us would believe that it could.
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Old Mar 23, 12, 3:13 am
  #859  
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Originally Posted by holtju2 View Post
Ok. This is NOT a rumor. It is going to happen sooner than any of us would believe that it could.
You can't say that for the simple reason that we don't know what "this" is. Yes, Delta is going to take some action in the belief that it will help its bottom line. In fact, I will go beyond that and say that every single business in the world that has any hope of continuing to exist is going to take some action (indeed, "actions") which it believes will help its bottom line.

Will they all be right? No, as proven by Leo Mullin & Co. Will they all be wrong? No, as proven by Jerry Grinstein & Co.

However, anyone who believes that Delta's first obligation is to its passengers (even to elite medallion members) is wrong. Delta's first obligation is to its stockholders. In many instances, it may well be helping its stockholders by giving more to its frequent fliers, but where it hurts its stockholders Delta is going to have make changes.
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Old Mar 23, 12, 4:05 am
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Originally Posted by bocastephen View Post
A service business that takes that attitude with their bread and butter customers is doomed to fail.
And if you don't believe that DL is a service business or that FFers are their bread and butter customers?


At the end of the day, I don't understand what has changed since before this rumor surfaced. Will people actually be surprised when a legacy carrier moves toward a revenue-based model? Why? At worst (or best), this rumor gives us a guess/prediction as to when that move happens, I don't think it changes the likelihood of it happening. If it isn't DL that is the first mover (or second, if you think WN already rang the bell), then it will be someone else.

I've said it before and I will say it again... If you try to understand the motivations of DL (or legacy carriers in general), then you will be in a much better position to predict the future state. Honestly, I don't need some inside source to tell me that my miles will be worth less tomorrow than today, or that my elite benefits are not guaranteed past next week. Others may be shocked or upset or confused that DL is looking at stuff like this, but I simply don't understand why.
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Old Mar 23, 12, 4:33 am
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Originally Posted by holtju2 View Post
Ok. This is NOT a rumor. It is going to happen sooner than any of us would believe that it could.
NOT a rumor? Care to share your definitive source with us?

And I half expected Delta to make the official announcement as soon as the rumor leaked to head off rampant speculation... So not happening sooner than ANYONE believed!
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Old Mar 23, 12, 5:48 am
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Originally Posted by dcline414 View Post
And I half expected Delta to make the official announcement as soon as the rumor leaked to head off rampant speculation...
Generally that's not DL's MO.....they'll make the changes 4-1-12, then make an official announcement sometime in mid May-early June.
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Old Mar 23, 12, 6:35 am
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Absolutely +1
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Old Mar 23, 12, 6:52 am
  #864  
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Originally Posted by Dovster View Post
However, anyone who believes that Delta's first obligation is to its passengers (even to elite medallion members) is wrong. Delta's first obligation is to its stockholders. In many instances, it may well be helping its stockholders by giving more to its frequent fliers, but where it hurts its stockholders Delta is going to have make changes.
This is true no matter if we like it or not. As you say, sometimes putting your best customers first, does indeed help your stockholders. Where that balance is - I dont know. I am a scientist not a business man.
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Old Mar 23, 12, 8:15 am
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I do not have (yet) an opinion regarding the changes, but I know that they are clearly not a rumor. For that reason, I am VERY disappointed when DL sends the following respponse

"When confronted with rumors concerning future strategic initiatives, we
maintain a strict ‘no comment’ policy to ensure we avoid providing an
implied confirmation or denial.

I realize this is a disappointment, and trust you will understand our
position. We hope you will continue to make Delta your airline of choice"


It suggests that the agents do not read. I presented them with facts, and gave them information on the job openings that DL has posted. So, please don't call it a rumor.

In another part of the email, I explained to them that I am cocnerned that I cannot make an informed business decision regarding ticket purchases, and they've refused to address that question. If DL wants to change the rules, I want to ensure it does not happen mid-game, or mid-year. I do have some (small) interest in that. My research associates and I balance miles travel and paid travel (both not always in the lowest fare classes) to maximize our ability to meet all research groups needs. I am asking for honest communciation, clear details and an obligation that rules would not change mid year, retroactively, or in a one day notice. It is not alot to ask for (and I wish to skip the sarcasm, mr. Roberston, et. al. ... ) You have a service record of negative 'hit and run' changes. It is not that one can claim delta has been using a fair practice on changes to SM T&C.

So, actions speak louder than words. My action? this morning, I cancelled few tickets for the team (slightly more than $8K). I am looking on our April to June travel plans and I will consider further changes.
Borrowing a sentence from Jeff, I will say "It was a hard decision, but it was the right one."

Last edited by DLroads; Mar 23, 12 at 9:11 am
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Old Mar 23, 12, 8:25 am
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Originally Posted by Spence1097 View Post
Just think if US had their way a few years ago they would have bought Delta and this giant thread would not even exist as Skymiles would have gone the way of Worldperks as they would have been absorbed into Dividend Miles.
Which in retrospect is not all that horrible a proposition (from a purely FF perspective) as those WP miles are pretty dang valuable.
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Old Mar 23, 12, 9:32 am
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Originally Posted by Dubai Stu View Post
Fares paid versus miles flown creates an inherent conflict of interest for anyone who flies on the client's dime.
That already exists. You don't think there isn't already a group of folks who book M/B/Y on a client dime already to get the %150 MQM's and better upgrade ability?. Buying a Y fare consistantly seems a waste to me if you aren't changing the day you leave just the time, SDC seems to work most of the time for that. And even if you do change day occasionally so you pay a change fee and higher fare that one time vs. the Y fare every time.
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Old Mar 23, 12, 10:10 am
  #868  
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Originally Posted by DLroads View Post
...In another part of the email, I explained to them that I am cocnerned that I cannot make an informed business decision regarding ticket purchases, and they've refused to address that question. If DL wants to change the rules, I want to ensure it does not happen mid-game, or mid-year. I do have some (small) interest in that. My research associates and I balance miles travel and paid travel (both not always in the lowest fare classes) to maximize our ability to meet all research groups needs. I am asking for honest communciation, clear details and an obligation that rules would not change mid year, retroactively, or in a one day notice. It is not alot to ask for (and I wish to skip the sarcasm, mr. Roberston, et. al. ... ) You have a service record of negative 'hit and run' changes. It is not that one can claim delta has been using a fair practice on changes to SM T&C....
You are spot on.

Clearly there are two aspects to the "rumor"... revenue-based qualification and FBATR ("Faith-Based Award Ticket Redemption" or "Pray for an Award You Can Afford"©). The usual apologists are focusing on the first, perhaps because it might be the easier to justify. And, in the process, they are diverting attention away from the second aspect, which you address above. I share your frustration.

While I concede that DL management has written their C of C to allow them to do most anything DOT doesn't specifically prohibit (yet), having the right to do something doesn't make it right to do.

Marketing that "If you give us lot's of business in year X, we'll give you these benefits in year X+1", then changing those benefits mid-way thru X+1 is a decidedly low-class act. But, DL management have repeatedly shown that they have no compunctions when that sort of behavior is involved.

Thus, it is a bit ironic that I ran across this Dilbert cartoon last night:

http://dilbert.com/fast/2007-09-15/
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Old Mar 23, 12, 10:18 am
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Originally Posted by StayingHomeIsBetter View Post
Clearly there are two aspects to the "rumor"... revenue-based qualification and FBATR ("Faith-Based Award Ticket Redemption" or "Pray for an Award You Can Afford"©).
Wrong branding on your ©. Try this:

Sky Faith Award®

Gotta keep with the Sky Team even if the SKY is falling.
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Old Mar 23, 12, 10:24 am
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Originally Posted by DLroads View Post
I presented them with facts, and gave them information on the job openings that DL has posted. So, please don't call it a rumor.
[/B]
How do you know DL posted that job opening? How do you know that "internal memo" is genuine?

this could all be an elaborate hoax by some individuals with a dark sense of humor, who are now rolling on the floor laughing at the rage they have unleashed. (god I hope so... )
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