pitbulllover

Ironically, bubbashow, I was just writing a similar response as you posted this ^

Lackey99

When I started this thread it was a light-hearted rant about DL holding back FC seats. I like the way it evolved and I agree with the posters who feel that "seat in butt" and revenue count more than all the schemes DL has created to get people status (or more status). I was VERY happy when I truly earned FO two years ago. I earned it "butt in seat". I was rewarded with about 70% UG's, first on plane, no bag fees, etc....

Last year DL tempted me with lots of "candy mqm's". I flew 32 segments last year (mostly short to medium distance) but ended up with 93,993 mqms. I was probably "butt in seat" for around 25-30k miles the rest were "candy". There were lots of mqm promos last year and I took advantage of most of them...to the tune of probably 60k+ mqm's. As my wife says, "I'm smarter than the average bear." By the way...I will have FO for next year after flying DCA to SFO in 6 weeks due to rollover candy mqm's.

Do I deserve PM status like most of you...NO FREAKING WAY. But the way DL has destroyed the program my PM is now like my FO from 2 years ago. I say go back to the way it was.

hazelrah

Why are you as an elite customer worred about Delta's revenue? Personally, as a fellow elite I'm concerned about the elite program, and Delta's devaluation thereof.

There really isn't anything special about Delta. *A is a better alliance and the awards are better. It just seems to me to be non-sequitur to say, I'm loyal to Delta but they are becoming less loyal to me but I'm still going to be loyal to Delta.

I take each day at a time. I'm still weighing the effects of the first -class upsell but *A looks better every day.

davetravels

SORRY - - levity and fun are strictly PROHIBITED here! We take our FlyerTalk and our travels VERY seriously!!!

pitbulllover

It's pretty much like that across the board with domestic FF programs. I fly more than enough BIS to reach DM on DL. Over the last several years, I have not seen the value of incremental benefits of reaching anything more than mid-tier status on any one airline. Most of the programs have all become pretty diluted, but I believe DL by the most.

So, I just spread that over 2-3 airlines to get to mid-tier. That allows me to have more flexibility in booking, earning and redeeming.

I think all airlines will be watching how SWA does their new program based on revenue. The programs need to move to that direction if they are going to provide the value that they once did.

BusTrav8yrs

Whoever told you that at DL was wrong. I thought the same thing when I got the card, but found out later that it only trumps someone of same status on same fare, so the upgrade priority goes like this if you are not on a Y fare with the AMEX Reserve:

Anyone with status on Y fare or IRROPS
Anyone with higher status than you
Anyone with same status as you on higher fare
Anyone with same status, same fare has AMEX Reserve and requested upgrade (purchased ticket) at an earlier date than you.
You
Everyone else.

So unless you buy Y, you can easily be as low as 5th on the priority list as a Plat.

hazelrah

It will be highly amusing when more and more Platiunums are denied upgrades due to FC upsell - oh the humanity

GBadger

I'm tracking a couple of things in the "2011 Upgrade Success Thread":
F seats available at T-24 and
F seats available at the gate

To get an idea of how many seats may be going to the up-sell program. I realize it's not perfect -- but if I routinely see the number of F seats go from 9 to 2 or similar within 24 hours from flight time, I think it's safe to say that there's some impact of that program.

bubbashow

THERE'S NO EVIDENCE THIS IS EVEN HAPPENING YET!!! The only instances on here are anecdotal, and I don't believe them.

I have been booked into F DIRECTLY off of IRROPS. Any last-minute buys would probably go to F because of the fare difference.

Paranoid for nothing! God...can't we spend our efforts on something more-productive...aliens...ghosts....the JFK assasination.....so much more to theorize about than a program that HASN'T EVEN STARTED!

avidflyer

Well I am one of those anecdotal cases and I was there. I get that you don't believe me but why? What skin do I have in the game that would make me post something that would cause you and a bunch of other people here call me a liar?

Also, this was announced by DL (not me) as a "pilot program" in the second half of last year that has been "very successful" and will be implemented in April. Do you know what they are talking about? The sale of upgrades at the gate has been around for years...that is NOT a "pilot program".

Just curious where you get your info. I have some pretty darn good sources and they tell me that this program is NOT, repeat NOT, what we all think of as Gate Upgrades.

So I ask you: What is the Pilot Program that will be pushed into production in April?

GBadger

I know about IROPS. I know about VDB. I know about all of those possibilities (that was the "not perfect" part of my post).

As a scientist, I like to collect data...

You can believe that it hasn't started. I'll believe the numerous accounts on here that seem to imply it has. I'm not paranoid, but I am interested in seeing what the impact is. I KNOW AS does this, and I also know that on two recent AS flights, F availability went from 7 and 8 to 0 and 0 the morning of the flight due to kiosk upgrades. The final result? No upgrade for me... If that starts happening routinely on DL (which is why I'm keeping track, to see how often it happens), I don't have any reason to fly DL. I'm certainly not sticking around for the ease of use of SkyMiles...

hazelrah

Soon the only status that will matter for SkyPesos is Diamond - Holy EXP, Batman, Shades of AA.

GBadger

I'm not certain Diamond will be protected from this.

sxf24

For a scientist, you're awfully willing to rely on a bunch of hearsay.

First, let us distinguish between a) upselling to F fares at POP, b) upselling to F fares at the kiosk, and c) offering upgrades for a fee at the kiosk or gate.

Passengers that buy into F by paying the fare difference between classes of service have (and should have) priority over elite members who have requested complimentary upgrades. DL and AS both actively market this option.

GBadger

It's been reported enough times that I'm willing to start paying attention to it.

There are people on this board who's opinions and stories I value, avidflyer being one of them. If he says that his flying companion was offered a $75 upgrade at the kiosk on a U fare (that he paid for), for MSP-SEA, I believe him. I don't believe that $75 is the fare difference between U and F (or P, or A) on that route.

Like I said, I'm not sold on this being a major problem, but the only way to confirm it as such (or clearly deny that it is) is to collect data, which I'm starting to do. I'm not on a witch-hunt here and will provide the results for what they are. I would encourage others to do the same, in order to increase the sample size.

In terms of distinguishing between the different types, from what I've read the POP upgrade options have been equivalent (roughly) to a fare difference buy up to F. The Kiosk ones have not. And the gate buy ups are (or have been) offered only after medallions are upgraded so they don't impact the upgrade bottom line. I'm fine with DL selling up at purchase by offering the difference to F (or close to it). I'm not too happy with DL offering heavily discounted F to anyone who wants it at check-in. If they believe it will help their bottom line that's great, but I'm looking at my own bottom line. No domestic upgrades really reduces the benefit for me to flying DL. I can get better SWU and mileage usage benefits as well as better Y seating (at least for now) on UA.