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Old Oct 26, 10, 9:42 am   #1
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The end of "bonus" MQM during IROPS/VDB/SDC

Recent posts here seem to indicate that DL is getting smarter about awarding MQM and RDM for fare paid instead of fare flown.

My own recent experiences (below) support the idea that DL is cracking down on this former loophole which allowed members to earn bonus MQM and RDM based on being "rebooked" into full Y/J fare classes.

Personally, I welcome this change as it keeps people from playing/abusing the system, and prevents lower level elites from getting upgraded just because they switched flights.

My experiences:
- Recent return trip -- was supposed to be IAD-JFK-SFO. I took a VDB to F on IAD-JFK and was rebooked to IAD-MSP. That flight was also over, so I took another VDB and was rebooked to IAD-DTW with new paper tickets. That flight was delayed, so after quite a bit of work by one of the GAs, I was rebooked to DCA-MSP-SFO and given a taxi voucher to get to DCA. When I arrived at DCA, with a Y fare class printed on my boarding pass, I realized that my name was not on the upgrade list. Assuming that I was now a PM on a full Y fare, I inquired about getting onto that list. The GA could not get my name to show up on the list, and after trying many things including calling reservations to get it to work, he came to the conclusion that since my original fare class was U (which I did not tell him...), I was not allowed to be added to the list because I had no chance of clearing and the upgrade list was full. The system was actually preventing him from adding me to the list based on my originally (3 re-booking events ago) fare class.

- Trip from this weekend. Was traveling BOS-JFK-ATL-OAK. JFK-ATL was oversold, so I took a VDB to J on the direct JFK-SFO. Credited to my account today, posting as K/J (paid/flown), with no bonus MQM. I have taken VDBs on that route several times and have always received 50% COS bonus when rebooked into J.

I'm not saying it's completely gone, but under the circumstances above, I've always received the bonus MQM, and the last two times I did not. Like I said, I think this way is more fair and am glad that it's the direction that DL is moving in.

Any other experiences/opinions?
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Old Oct 26, 10, 9:48 am   #2
  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GBadger View Post
Recent posts here seem to indicate that DL is getting smarter about awarding MQM and RDM for fare paid instead of fare flown.

My own recent experiences (below) support the idea that DL is cracking down on this former loophole which allowed members to earn bonus MQM and RDM based on being "rebooked" into full Y/J fare classes.

Personally, I welcome this change as it keeps people from playing/abusing the system, and prevents lower level elites from getting upgraded just because they switched flights.

My experiences:
- Recent return trip -- was supposed to be IAD-JFK-SFO. I took a VDB to F on IAD-JFK and was rebooked to IAD-MSP. That flight was also over, so I took another VDB and was rebooked to IAD-DTW with new paper tickets. That flight was delayed, so after quite a bit of work by one of the GAs, I was rebooked to DCA-MSP-SFO and given a taxi voucher to get to DCA. When I arrived at DCA, with a Y fare class printed on my boarding pass, I realized that my name was not on the upgrade list. Assuming that I was now a PM on a full Y fare, I inquired about getting onto that list. The GA could not get my name to show up on the list, and after trying many things including calling reservations to get it to work, he came to the conclusion that since my original fare class was U (which I did not tell him...), I was not allowed to be added to the list because I had no chance of clearing and the upgrade list was full. The system was actually preventing him from adding me to the list based on my originally (3 re-booking events ago) fare class.

- Trip from this weekend. Was traveling BOS-JFK-ATL-OAK. JFK-ATL was oversold, so I took a VDB to J on the direct JFK-SFO. Credited to my account today, posting as K/J (paid/flown), with no bonus MQM. I have taken VDBs on that route several times and have always received 50% COS bonus when rebooked into J.

I'm not saying it's completely gone, but under the circumstances above, I've always received the bonus MQM, and the last two times I did not. Like I said, I think this way is more fair and am glad that it's the direction that DL is moving in.

Any other experiences/opinions?
I noticed this last week. Misconnect outbound, rebooked into full Y. Showed up as 'T/Y' on my summary.

On inbound, cancelled flight. Put up overnight and rebooked into F the next day. Showed T/F on my summary.

No bonuses.
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Old Oct 26, 10, 10:07 am   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GBadger View Post
Personally, I welcome this change as it keeps people from playing/abusing the system, and prevents lower level elites from getting upgraded just because they switched flights.
I think this is only partially correct. While the MQM/mileage bonus is certainly gone, I don't think the upgrade list is protected so much, especially in IROPS situations. Travel disruptions probably still affect the upgrade lists, especially so when you are lucky enough that your new fare class becomes F/J and allows you to rebook front cabin seats on a positive space basis, jumping the upgrade list altogether. While you don't get the mileage bonus, it does open up your options greatly.
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Old Oct 26, 10, 10:14 am   #4
  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GBadger View Post
Recent posts here seem to indicate that DL is getting smarter about awarding MQM and RDM for fare paid instead of fare flown.

My own recent experiences (below) support the idea that DL is cracking down on this former loophole which allowed members to earn bonus MQM and RDM based on being "rebooked" into full Y/J fare classes.

Personally, I welcome this change as it keeps people from playing/abusing the system, and prevents lower level elites from getting upgraded just because they switched flights.

My experiences:
- Recent return trip -- was supposed to be IAD-JFK-SFO. I took a VDB to F on IAD-JFK and was rebooked to IAD-MSP. That flight was also over, so I took another VDB and was rebooked to IAD-DTW with new paper tickets. That flight was delayed, so after quite a bit of work by one of the GAs, I was rebooked to DCA-MSP-SFO and given a taxi voucher to get to DCA. When I arrived at DCA, with a Y fare class printed on my boarding pass, I realized that my name was not on the upgrade list. Assuming that I was now a PM on a full Y fare, I inquired about getting onto that list. The GA could not get my name to show up on the list, and after trying many things including calling reservations to get it to work, he came to the conclusion that since my original fare class was U (which I did not tell him...), I was not allowed to be added to the list because I had no chance of clearing and the upgrade list was full. The system was actually preventing him from adding me to the list based on my originally (3 re-booking events ago) fare class.

- Trip from this weekend. Was traveling BOS-JFK-ATL-OAK. JFK-ATL was oversold, so I took a VDB to J on the direct JFK-SFO. Credited to my account today, posting as K/J (paid/flown), with no bonus MQM. I have taken VDBs on that route several times and have always received 50% COS bonus when rebooked into J.

I'm not saying it's completely gone, but under the circumstances above, I've always received the bonus MQM, and the last two times I did not. Like I said, I think this way is more fair and am glad that it's the direction that DL is moving in.

Any other experiences/opinions?
Two things: (1) hate you for all your VDBs... I'm never so "lucky." (2) Thought I read in one of the DO threads a sentence that the NWA system had something that prevented this from happening and DL is using that now(so to speak, the idea, not the system necessarily). On my op-ups or VDB to J or F I haven't seen any errors in my favor.
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Old Oct 26, 10, 10:15 am   #5
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Originally Posted by javabytes View Post
I think this is only partially correct. While the MQM/mileage bonus is certainly gone, I don't think the upgrade list is protected so much, especially in IROPS situations. Travel disruptions probably still affect the upgrade lists, especially so when you are lucky enough that your new fare class becomes F/J and allows you to rebook front cabin seats on a positive space basis, jumping the upgrade list altogether. While you don't get the mileage bonus, it does open up your options greatly.
Correct, except that deep in the system there are apparently mechanisms in place that will prevent you from even getting onto the upgrade list in certain situations, based on your original fare class.

I do agree that rebookings into F/J will bump others out of upgrades, but generally, I've found that this is only done when warranted (in case of VDB or if already booked into F using miles/SWU (but not comp. upgrades)).
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Old Oct 26, 10, 10:19 am   #6
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Originally Posted by iamhereandthere View Post
(1) hate you for all your VDBs... I'm never so "lucky."
DL is overselling like crazy. The IAD-MSP flight that I mentioned was over by 10, the JFK-ATL flight on Sunday by 12, and the IAD-JFK flight was going to be overweight (CR2) so they requested 5 volunteers. One of the GAs for the JFK-ATL flight even put into the VDB comments section (which I guess there is one) "PLEASE STOP OVERSELLING FLIGHTS BY THIS MANY!!!"

Guess it works out for them (them being the accountants, not the frontline employees)... And it's certainly worked out for me. I'm planning a trip to Asia for my wife and I using the vouchers...hopefully from one of the DMQM cities so that I can get to DM.
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Old Oct 26, 10, 10:26 am   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GBadger View Post
Correct, except that deep in the system there are apparently mechanisms in place that will prevent you from even getting onto the upgrade list in certain situations, based on your original fare class.

I do agree that rebookings into F/J will bump others out of upgrades, but generally, I've found that this is only done when warranted (in case of VDB or if already booked into F using miles/SWU (but not comp. upgrades)).
Last month, I was flying a one-stopper. Medallion upgrades cleared on both segments. My first flight was delayed but I had a long layover and could easily make the connection. I was rebooked anyway, so I called in to get my original itinerary restored. After they did that, I noticed my ticket said "involuntary reroute" and I could rebook onto any flight that day, and directly into F. So I did change onto a different flight for more miles and a meal in F, jumping what I'm sure was a long line of elites on a popular route at a major hub.

I think you definitely should be on the upgrade list for your new flight, no matter what the circumstances. If I SDC, I should still be entitled to the upgrade if it is available. I agree that the original fare class should be preserved for purposes of determining the upgrade (at least for SDC - I'm okay with VDB/IROPS having a higher priority), but in no circumstances should someone be left off the list altogether.
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Old Oct 26, 10, 10:57 am   #8
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My guess is you being blocked from the upgrade list was a bug, possibly related to time of reticketing being too close to the depature time of the new flight especially if it was already on airport control with the upgrade list closed.

Yes I've seen the thing where you only get miles/mqm credit for your original booking class now. Seems like they is fully implemented. However, you should still be on the upgrade list based on your current booking class. People who are hit by irrops should have some priority, especially with standby. Otherwise you're going to have people stranded for hours/days because they're on a irrops T ticket and medallions using same day standby without any irrops issues would be ahead of them.
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Old Oct 26, 10, 10:59 am   #9
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My guess is you being blocked from the upgrade list was a bug, possibly related to time of reticketing being too close to the depature time of the new flight especially if it was already on airport control with the upgrade list closed.
Very possible, particularly because my ticket was issued at IAD for a flight leaving from DCA, roughly 2.5 hours before the departure time.

The one thing I am very certain of is that this was not a renegade GA. In fact the GA did everything in his power to try to get me to show up on the list and could not make it happen. He even waited to clear the last upgrade under the assumption that if I were on a Y ticket that seat should be mine.
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Old Oct 26, 10, 11:07 am   #10
  
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However, you should still be on the upgrade list based on your current booking class. People who are hit by irrops should have some priority, especially with standby.
And they do. Tie breakers are status and dollar value of ticket.
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Old Oct 26, 10, 11:09 am   #11
  
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Originally Posted by iamhereandthere
Thought I read in one of the DO threads a sentence that the NWA system had something that prevented this from happening and DL is using that now(so to speak, the idea, not the system necessarily). On my op-ups or VDB to J or F I haven't seen any errors in my favor.

NWA was very good at tracking the original fare paid. Very rarely did you get the bonus unless you were rebooked under a new PNR.
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Old Oct 26, 10, 12:59 pm   #12
  
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How funny all these VDB stories. I haven't heard the words "we are in an oversell sittuation..." in several years. Just last week my DEN>ATL leg was oversold and I jumped at getting $400. I had forgotten just how great it felt to have DDs in my possession. FTR, I got immediately booked in FC on both legs (not just DEN > ATL) but the fare class I purchased is what is showing on my activity. It (the Y fare bump up) was good while it lasted.
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Old Oct 26, 10, 1:07 pm   #13
  
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I did a VDB and and SDC not long after the merger and noticed that I got Y or F flight credit for my SM.
I have accumulated more than my share of VDB/SDC/IRRROP "bonuses" until this Sept when they closed the loophole. Now I still look for VDB's when time permits but does not plan for intentional SDC's
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Old Oct 26, 10, 1:15 pm   #14
  
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3 bumps this weekend msp-phx. OUr flights ended up as F class, but no fare class bonus. There was no request for volunteers on any of the flights, as we, and others, quietly asked if they needed volunteers.
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Old Oct 26, 10, 7:06 pm   #15
  
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Two weeks ago, I flew on standby and got the bonus on one flight, but not the other.

I bcouldn't SDC as one was oversold. At the airport, I went to the checkin counter and got a departure management card for the first flight. For the second flight, they could confirm me in F. It posted F/F and I got the 50% EQM and RDM bonuses. I cleared the standby list for the other flight at the gate. I got a coach seat, and it showed up as T/T (rather than Y/Y or Y/T)
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