Go Back  FlyerTalk Forums > Miles&Points > Airlines and Mileage Programs > Delta Air Lines | SkyMiles
Reload this Page >

The Definitive B/E Upgrade Complaint Thread

The Definitive B/E Upgrade Complaint Thread

Old Apr 2, 2012, 11:12 am
  #691  
FlyerTalk Evangelist
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: LAX/BOS/HKG/AMS/SFO...hmm, I need a life.
Programs: United1K, AA ExPlAAt, DL MM/Gold, Hilton Diamond, Avis First
Posts: 13,316
Originally Posted by mother-
Just a datapoint: I'm looking for a Sept/Oct trip from NY to Seoul, doing a stayover in Tokyo on the way back for a few days.

UA J fare? $4500
DL J fare? $6700-9000
DL M fare? $4600

What kind of moron would pay their own money for a Delta ticket on that?

Keep in mind NOBODY is going to argue that WBC recliners >> UA J.
Yea but UA J using a W fare and a SWU = $1900.00. That would be the comparison to a Delta M fare right?
avidflyer is offline  
Old Apr 2, 2012, 11:32 am
  #692  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Programs: Delta skymiles DM + 1MM
Posts: 8,144
people vote with their wallets, right? So, if corporations and regular guys like me are willing to pay extra for a premium product, then DL must be doing something right.

Everything I've heard about UA's cheap ugrades comes at a price.

Plus, there is a huge product gap between what DL has and what UA has. Personally, I'd rather be on a 747 upperdeck with a 1 - 1 config then anything UA can throw at me. You pay for what you get.
DL2SXM is offline  
Old Apr 2, 2012, 11:48 am
  #693  
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Southern California
Programs: DL DM, EY Plat, MM Senator
Posts: 493
Originally Posted by nypdLieu
Why is it that you,and others, seem to think that DL's premium cabin is only filled with nonrevs? What kind of inside information do you have to back that up with?

Sure,there are some routes certain times of the year where you will most likely find more Non revs then paying pax, but you make your statement seem like its a blanket statement.

As DL's product gets revamped, I would gladly pay more to fly on the upper deck of a 747 in a 1 - 1 config then that of UA's 2 - 2 747 config. I'm not the only one either as Delta's international long haul fleet, once complete, will leave the competition in the dust... more and more corporations will pay the extra $$$$ to have that flat bed, direct aisle acess.
I would not claim knowing the exact numbers, but countless personal experiences and info from FAs (limited as it is, admittedly) tell that BE filled with non-revs (or, on occasion, flown pretty much empty, and on other occasions filled with gate UG from the oversold Y cabin) is a standard occurrence, not an exception. All the talk about "protecting their business product" is laughable! Recent examples include LAX-HND, ATL-LGW, JFK-LHR, JFK-SVO, NRT-HKG, NRT-BKK, ...

Sorry, but I cannot agree that DL fleet will "leave the competition in the dust." First, I am flying now, not in the future, and second I am not about to pay 2-3x for a product that is not worth that high a premium (and am definitely not paying these ridiculous fares for the "premium" routes such as LAX/SFO-TYO, JFK-SVO flown in the old recliners; I personally find ex-NWA A330 recliners even worse than old BE). Add to that the declining quality of the soft product, especially noticeable on the TPAC routes (for which even the improved hard shell would not compensate), and the decision becomes a no-brainer, unless you are spending someone else's money are are careless doing so.
glbetrotter is offline  
Old Apr 2, 2012, 11:56 am
  #694  
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Southern California
Programs: DL DM, EY Plat, MM Senator
Posts: 493
Originally Posted by nypdLieu

Everything I've heard about UA's cheap ugrades comes at a price.

Plus, there is a huge product gap between what DL has and what UA has. Personally, I'd rather be on a 747 upperdeck with a 1 - 1 config then anything UA can throw at me. You pay for what you get.
No on the first one, it does not if you are 1K on UA. You've been propagating this myth even though it was pointed out numerous times.

No on the second point as well, as there are only a couple of those 747s you are referring to in DL fleet and plenty more lie-flats on UA that can be had for much less money (or go UA IFC for about the same as DL BE). And if you don't want to go with UA metal, you can do even better with Asian airlines TPAC and some TATL and LH with TATL and still get a better product? Surely beats DL/AF/KL combo.
glbetrotter is offline  
Old Apr 2, 2012, 12:11 pm
  #695  
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: BDL/HPN/JFK/FLL
Programs: DL Diamond Ham Sandwich
Posts: 1,051
Originally Posted by avidflyer
Yea but UA J using a W fare and a SWU = $1900.00. That would be the comparison to a Delta M fare right?
For the price of a Delta M fare you could flat out buy J on UA, but yes to use an instrument it would be even cheaper...
mother- is offline  
Old Apr 2, 2012, 1:11 pm
  #696  
k2
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Meechigan
Posts: 1,006
To say DL is leaving competition in the dust is a stretch. They have a long way home before the fleet is converted, and even at that point the product isn't that much better.

If I compare the best DL J experience (777, hopefully soon the 744) with the best UA J experience (CO 777) I give CO a slight edge. If I'm not mistaken there are more of these CO birds than DL's 777 fleet.
k2 is offline  
Old Apr 2, 2012, 1:22 pm
  #697  
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 5,679
Originally Posted by nypdLieu
people vote with their wallets, right? So, if corporations and regular guys like me are willing to pay extra for a premium product, then DL must be doing something right.
I'm going to point out again Airlines don't have fare sales when their cabins are full. You recently benefited was a rare DL initiated J sale.

I think there is a compelling argument to be made that that marketplace for Y/B/M upgrades is very closed and operates exactly the way DL wants it. It's hard enough to query DL/3rd party service to figure out inventory, let alone compare prices to another program on a day to day basis.

I think at the end of the day DL begrudgingly provides Y/B/M upgrades as a line item on the FFP benefits guide, but in reality they want customers to be in the J cabin on Awards and Revenue tickets.
motytrah is offline  
Old Apr 2, 2012, 1:31 pm
  #698  
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: TPA & ATL
Programs: DL PM, USLess air & HHoners
Posts: 1,237
Originally Posted by motytrah
I think at the end of the day DL begrudgingly provides Y/B/M upgrades as a line item on the FFP benefits guide, but in reality they want customers to be in the J cabin on Awards and Revenue tickets.
agree completely...
localady is offline  
Old Apr 2, 2012, 1:33 pm
  #699  
 
Join Date: May 2008
Programs: DL AA UA
Posts: 2,359
Originally Posted by localady
agree completely...
Agree, but also see that such a preference makes DL non-competitive with other programs in this area.
ADLFO is offline  
Old Apr 3, 2012, 6:33 am
  #700  
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Fort Lauderdale
Programs: UA: 1K 1.5MM, DL: LTDM 3.5MM, JB: Mosaic4, LH: exSEN 1MM, Bonvoy LT Titanium Elite, Hertz PresC
Posts: 266
Which was exactly the point I was trying to make.......
Christefan is offline  
Old Apr 3, 2012, 6:47 am
  #701  
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Long Beach, CA
Programs: DL DM
Posts: 5,292
Originally Posted by Christefan
Which was exactly the point I was trying to make.......
Then I will bring it back to my point....why are y'all here? Why don't you go over to the grass-is-greener UA? Read the posts on their thread. My oh my...it is a paradise in which to be right now.

When you wedge yourself into that 8 abreast J in UA, feel special, and feel priveledged knowing that you have a J on your boarding pass. You are flying BUSINESS class my friends. You are a success.

Back to my domestic upgrade meal choice.....hmmmm....Cheerios.....or Cheerios. These upgrades have made it so luxurious!
bubbashow is offline  
Old Apr 3, 2012, 12:25 pm
  #702  
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Programs: UA GS>1K>Nothing; DL PM 2MM; AS 75K>Nothing>MVP
Posts: 9,335
Originally Posted by bubbashow
Then I will bring it back to my point....why are y'all here? Why don't you go over to the grass-is-greener UA? Read the posts on their thread. My oh my...it is a paradise in which to be right now.
Because more choices and more competition is better. We'd like DL to speed up their conversion to flat bed seats and we'd like DL offer a competitive FF program, which results in a reasonable cost of travel. Some of us have put in a lot of miles on DL, and most of it was pretty good until the current management regime. We are hoping that at some point, DL will go back to providing a good product at competitive prices.

Isn't that OBVIOUS? Why would we waste our valuable time writing comments on this forum otherwise?
5khours is offline  
Old Apr 3, 2012, 12:31 pm
  #703  
Suspended
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 18
Originally Posted by 5khours
Because more choices and more competition is better. We'd like DL to speed up their conversion to flat bed seats and we'd like DL offer a competitive FF program, which results in a reasonable cost of travel. Some of us have put in a lot of miles on DL, and most of it was pretty good until the current management regime. We are hoping that at some point, DL will go back to providing a good product at competitive prices.

Isn't that OBVIOUS? Why would we waste our valuable time writing comments on this forum otherwise?
If you have the time to write comments on this forum...how valuable do you want us to believe your time is? I'll start the bidding at minimum wage. Can someone let me know how much that is nowadays?
subpig is offline  
Old Apr 3, 2012, 12:47 pm
  #704  
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Programs: UA GS>1K>Nothing; DL PM 2MM; AS 75K>Nothing>MVP
Posts: 9,335
Originally Posted by subcuckpig
If you have the time to write comments on this forum...how valuable do you want us to believe your time is? I'll start the bidding at minimum wage. Can someone let me know how much that is nowadays?
My time is cheap enough that I can afford to spend two minutes writing a comment if I think it might in the future save me $50k a year, which is how more I would be spending if I had the same travel pattern and flew DL instead of UA.
5khours is offline  
Old Apr 3, 2012, 3:37 pm
  #705  
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Long Beach, CA
Programs: DL DM
Posts: 5,292
Originally Posted by FlytheTail
+1. If I have a choice and prices are the same, I'll pick direct aisle access. But they're not, and it's not worth the high premium to me. YMMV.

I do love DL's 777, they're my favorite. But I much prefer UA's new J cabins (including their 777) to DL's 763, 747, and 330 J cabins today (not in the future).

And, although I think UA's 2-4-2 configuration in J was a mistake, I sat in one 4 weeks ago and had a surprisingly good sleep -- much better than I do on the sliders. Yes, your neighbors are close but lie flat is key for me.
To A LOT of us on here, time is the value. I live in DTW. I can be nonstop almost anywhere I want to be. If you have time in your business to fly all over the U.S. to snag a UA flight from a (mostly-atrocious) UA hub, go for it. When I go, I usually HAVE to go. Time is worth money. DL treats me well. DL doesn't want low fares in its front cabin. After years of complaining on FT, it stays the same. You will see SWUs become more-liberal when the frequent flyer program becomes more-restrictive.

Why can't people get it through their heads that DL doesn't want low fares up front on international? I for one am glad. They have ruined domestic F by letting everyone with any status get up front for free.
bubbashow is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Manage Preferences - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service -

This site is owned, operated, and maintained by MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Designated trademarks are the property of their respective owners.