763's to nrt from west coast
Apr 20, 2010, 8:16 pm
#1
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Join Date: Apr 2010
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763's to nrt from west coast
hi long time reader but first time poster. I just heard that delta is going to start flying those nasty 763's between the west coast and narita. This is a route that was previously reserved for A330's, which has at least tolerable business class seats. Does anyone know why they switched aircraft? And will they be switching back or switching to a plane with a more modern business class? Thanks! Any help appreciated!
Apr 20, 2010, 8:26 pm
#2
Join Date: May 2006
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hi long time reader but first time poster. I just heard that delta is going to start flying those nasty 763's between the west coast and narita. This is a route that was previously reserved for A330's, which has at least tolerable business class seats. Does anyone know why they switched aircraft? And will they be switching back or switching to a plane with a more modern business class? Thanks! Any help appreciated!
Apr 20, 2010, 8:26 pm
#3
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Welcome to FlyerTalk snowboard1219.
Delta will be using 767-300ERs from Narita to SFO/PDX this summer; Seattle, Los Angeles and Salt Lake will see A330s.
The biggest reason for the change is reallocation of assets as a result of the merger. Delta is starting to use some of the A330s for routes out of ATL/JFK to Europe now, especially routes such as to Rome where the A330 can move a lot of people (only the 744 has more seats), and it's heavily slanted toward coach seating. Add in cargo capacity, etc. and Delta feels like the A330s can be used more profitably on other routes.
The 767s are in line to be getting new business class seats over the next couple of years, going with full lie-flats (not the angled ones like on the A330s) - some of the 767-400s already have these.
However, if you still want the A330, you can still connect at LAX (SFO-LAX/LAX-SFO connects to the LAX NRT flight) or PDX (by taking a codeshared Horizon flight up to Seattle to catch the A330 up there).
Delta will be using 767-300ERs from Narita to SFO/PDX this summer; Seattle, Los Angeles and Salt Lake will see A330s.
The biggest reason for the change is reallocation of assets as a result of the merger. Delta is starting to use some of the A330s for routes out of ATL/JFK to Europe now, especially routes such as to Rome where the A330 can move a lot of people (only the 744 has more seats), and it's heavily slanted toward coach seating. Add in cargo capacity, etc. and Delta feels like the A330s can be used more profitably on other routes.
The 767s are in line to be getting new business class seats over the next couple of years, going with full lie-flats (not the angled ones like on the A330s) - some of the 767-400s already have these.
However, if you still want the A330, you can still connect at LAX (SFO-LAX/LAX-SFO connects to the LAX NRT flight) or PDX (by taking a codeshared Horizon flight up to Seattle to catch the A330 up there).
Apr 20, 2010, 8:29 pm
#4
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hi long time reader but first time poster. I just heard that delta is going to start flying those nasty 763's between the west coast and narita. This is a route that was previously reserved for A330's, which has at least tolerable business class seats. Does anyone know why they switched aircraft? And will they be switching back or switching to a plane with a more modern business class? Thanks! Any help appreciated!
I certainly do not find the 763's to be nasty.
Welcome to FT!
Apr 20, 2010, 8:39 pm
#5
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Join Date: Apr 2010
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Well thanks for the quick reply and the welcome! Am I mistaken? I thought that the delta 763's were the ones that had seats that didn't go anywhere near flat and that had tiny ptv's that you cant even watch while your seat is fully reclined. I believe the reason I dislike this route so much is because before pvg-atl was cancelled and they were still flying the 763's I flew in BE and was crammed in that little seat with a small ptv for 14 hours and it left a bad taste in my mouth.
Apr 20, 2010, 8:43 pm
#7
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PVG-ATL was on a 777-200ER, though the seats on the 767-300ERs are pretty similar to those that were on the 772Es (with the exception of the 763s having narrower seats).
Apr 20, 2010, 8:46 pm
#8
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That was before they had all of the 777's updated with the new seats. sorry about the mistake. 
Apr 20, 2010, 8:59 pm
#9
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Apr 20, 2010, 9:14 pm
#10
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hi long time reader but first time poster. I just heard that delta is going to start flying those nasty 763's between the west coast and narita. This is a route that was previously reserved for A330's, which has at least tolerable business class seats. Does anyone know why they switched aircraft? And will they be switching back or switching to a plane with a more modern business class? Thanks! Any help appreciated!
Apr 20, 2010, 9:18 pm
#11
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Welcome snowboard1219.
The DL faithful will swear these seats "aren't that bad" are "tolerable" or are actually preferred by them. That's great if a few people have convinced themselves of that, but I don't see SQ and others rushing over to pick up these same seats, the reality is most carriers got rid of these circa 1990s products from their long haul flights years ago.
They are a crappy product plain and simple and a couple of subjective viewpoints to the contrary doesn't change that. For the rest of us, I guess we'll be avoiding those routes, because I honestly cannot see why someone would part with the money for a full fare business ticket and sit on one of these old seats.
Folks can talk about yields all they want, downsizing to a 767 is no excuse for not having upgraded these seats long ago. And the calendar for refurbishment is so vague and protracted that it's becoming increasingly clear that we'll still see these seats in 2011. I could see someone who flies transpac once a year taking these, but realistically, for the high flyer that is doing this trip 8-10 or more times a year, DL is actually going to further reduce premium cabin traffic where it continues to offer this outdated product. You can fly CX, AC, UA (747) or SQ and get a true state of the art bed, why settle for the recliner?
The DL faithful will swear these seats "aren't that bad" are "tolerable" or are actually preferred by them. That's great if a few people have convinced themselves of that, but I don't see SQ and others rushing over to pick up these same seats, the reality is most carriers got rid of these circa 1990s products from their long haul flights years ago.
They are a crappy product plain and simple and a couple of subjective viewpoints to the contrary doesn't change that. For the rest of us, I guess we'll be avoiding those routes, because I honestly cannot see why someone would part with the money for a full fare business ticket and sit on one of these old seats.
Folks can talk about yields all they want, downsizing to a 767 is no excuse for not having upgraded these seats long ago. And the calendar for refurbishment is so vague and protracted that it's becoming increasingly clear that we'll still see these seats in 2011. I could see someone who flies transpac once a year taking these, but realistically, for the high flyer that is doing this trip 8-10 or more times a year, DL is actually going to further reduce premium cabin traffic where it continues to offer this outdated product. You can fly CX, AC, UA (747) or SQ and get a true state of the art bed, why settle for the recliner?
Apr 20, 2010, 9:26 pm
#12
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The OP can surely connect via other DL cities and have access to a Flat Bed / Lie Flat product. If I were PDX based, I'd have no issues with a nonstop on a 763 vs connecting for a flat bed.
Apr 20, 2010, 9:29 pm
#13
Original Poster
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 23
Welcome snowboard1219.
The DL faithful will swear these seats "aren't that bad" are "tolerable" or are actually preferred by them. That's great if a few people have convinced themselves of that, but I don't see SQ and others rushing over to pick up these same seats, the reality is most carriers got rid of these circa 1990s products from their long haul flights years ago.
They are a crappy product plain and simple and a couple of subjective viewpoints to the contrary doesn't change that. For the rest of us, I guess we'll be avoiding those routes, because I honestly cannot see why someone would part with the money for a full fare business ticket and sit on one of these old seats.
Folks can talk about yields all they want, downsizing to a 767 is no excuse for not having upgraded these seats long ago. And the calendar for refurbishment is so vague and protracted that it's becoming increasingly clear that we'll still see these seats in 2011. I could see someone who flies transpac once a year taking these, but realistically, for the high flyer that is doing this trip 8-10 or more times a year, DL is actually going to further reduce premium cabin traffic where it continues to offer this outdated product. You can fly CX, AC, UA (747) or SQ and get a true state of the art bed, why settle for the recliner?
The DL faithful will swear these seats "aren't that bad" are "tolerable" or are actually preferred by them. That's great if a few people have convinced themselves of that, but I don't see SQ and others rushing over to pick up these same seats, the reality is most carriers got rid of these circa 1990s products from their long haul flights years ago.
They are a crappy product plain and simple and a couple of subjective viewpoints to the contrary doesn't change that. For the rest of us, I guess we'll be avoiding those routes, because I honestly cannot see why someone would part with the money for a full fare business ticket and sit on one of these old seats.
Folks can talk about yields all they want, downsizing to a 767 is no excuse for not having upgraded these seats long ago. And the calendar for refurbishment is so vague and protracted that it's becoming increasingly clear that we'll still see these seats in 2011. I could see someone who flies transpac once a year taking these, but realistically, for the high flyer that is doing this trip 8-10 or more times a year, DL is actually going to further reduce premium cabin traffic where it continues to offer this outdated product. You can fly CX, AC, UA (747) or SQ and get a true state of the art bed, why settle for the recliner?
I couldn't agree with you more! I am actually a Northwest faithful so I am used to the a330 WBC seats. I will admit they do have their flaws (it can be difficult to sleep because your are sliding down to the bottom of the seat) but they are a heck of a lot better than the Delta than the old Delta 767 seats. Delta does need to upgrade all of their seats and not give a "vague" timeline like you said. Pre-Merger NW was a large amount better because they had actually retired all the old dc-10's (which i actually liked
) (the dc10's actually compare with the 767's delta has) and had either a 747 or a330 for the long international routes. I also agree with you that delta will certainly lose business with their outdated product. (unfortunately not my business though)
Apr 20, 2010, 9:35 pm
#15
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The business class seat on the old NW A330 is relatively comfortable and more or less comparable with other TPAC airlines. I live in Oregon and just came back from a week in AMS. I flew to SEA to use the A330 instead of the B767 on the PDX flight. The 767 seats are, unless upgraded, IMHO, a much less desirable seat. I fly TPAC 3 times a year and would use PDX as my gateway except for the 767. Instead I use SEA or LAX and then fly on KE for great inflight service, a very comfortable lie flat business class seat and a pre flight lounge with some thing more than pretzels and Bishoff cookies.