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-   -   DCC: Dynamic Currency Conversion (2017-2025) (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/credit-card-programs/1815666-dcc-dynamic-currency-conversion-2017-2025-a.html)

txflyer77 Nov 5, 2018 5:55 am

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.fly...cb8e6e46eb.png
Now this one really ticks me off. Not only do you have to “cancel” to decline DCC, they’re claiming no markup, but it’s a 6% premium over MC’s rate today!

Majuki Nov 5, 2018 9:08 am


Originally Posted by txflyer77 (Post 30394787)
They’re claiming no markup, but it’s a 6% premium over MC’s rate today!

I fail to see how this is compliant with MC's language when offering DCC. There is a clear discrepancy between the MC rate and the rate they're offering, yet they're deceptively implying that there is no markup. They're required to show the markup above MC's rate, not just the exchange rate they're giving you.

The November 4th MC rate is 1.145436 USD/EUR, so it means it's over 7% higher!

percysmith Nov 5, 2018 9:53 am


Originally Posted by txflyer77 (Post 30394787)
Now this one really ticks me off. Not only do you have to “cancel” to decline DCC, they’re claiming no markup, but it’s a 6% premium over MC’s rate today!

You can't trust foreign tourist operators to protect your best interests can you?

What irks me off more tho is that Mastercard/Visa turn a blind eye on this. Obviously turnover is better than the minority of tourists who take exception to being stinged.

Kremmen Nov 5, 2018 5:46 pm


Originally Posted by txflyer77 (Post 30394787)
Now this one really ticks me off. Not only do you have to “cancel” to decline DCC, they’re claiming no markup, but it’s a 6% premium over MC’s rate today!

Hard to trust a message which is misspelt!

Im a new user Nov 11, 2018 4:22 pm

From EU Regulation 2018/302 (applies from 3 December):

Article 5
Non-discrimination for reasons related to payment

1. A trader shall not, within the range of means of payment accepted by the trader, apply, for reasons related to a customer's nationality, place of residence or place of establishment, the location of the payment account, the place of establishment of the payment service provider or the place of issue of the payment instrument within the Union, different conditions for a payment transaction, where:

(a) the payment transaction is made through an electronic transaction by credit transfer, direct debit or a card-based payment instrument within the same payment brand and category;
Let's say that a customer uses a card issued in an EU country and denominated in currency ABC, but that the merchant's local currency is XYZ.

Assume that the merchant wishes to offer DCC, allowing the customer to pay in currency ABC instead of XYZ. Is the merchant then bound, by the anti-discrimination clause, to also offer local customers with XYZ-denominated cards a choice between currencies ABC and XYZ, with the same order of preference in on-screen menus? If so, then this regulation might be what finally stops DCC within the EU (at least for EU cardholders) as local customers would be surprised if terminals were to offer payment in dozens of foreign currencies in addition to local currency.

tmiw Nov 11, 2018 4:33 pm


Originally Posted by Some person (Post 30419254)
From EU Regulation 2018/302 (applies from 3 December):Let's say that a customer uses a card issued in an EU country and denominated in currency ABC, but that the merchant's local currency is XYZ.

Assume that the merchant wishes to offer DCC, allowing the customer to pay in currency ABC instead of XYZ. Is the merchant then bound, by the anti-discrimination clause, to also offer local customers with XYZ-denominated cards a choice between currencies ABC and XYZ, with the same order of preference in on-screen menus? If so, then this regulation might be what finally stops DCC within the EU (at least for EU cardholders) as local customers would be surprised if terminals were to offer payment in dozens of foreign currencies in addition to local currency.

From what I'm reading this may only apply to cards issued in the EU. If that's the case, I doubt this regulation will be what kills DCC.

Majuki Nov 11, 2018 5:07 pm


Originally Posted by tmiw (Post 30419274)
From what I'm reading this may only apply to cards issued in the EU. If that's the case, I doubt this regulation will be what kills DCC.

I don't think the networks are setup to disable DCC selectively. I know that some currencies aren't supported. For instance, if you have a card denominated on Armenian Dram, perhaps it isn't supported. There might be a way to disable DCC based on the issuing country data on the card. You can't blindly exclude certain currencies since there are USD denominated cards from the EU.

tmiw Nov 11, 2018 5:23 pm


Originally Posted by Majuki (Post 30419335)
I don't think the networks are setup to disable DCC selectively. I know that some currencies aren't supported. For instance, if you have a card denominated on Armenian Dram, perhaps it isn't supported. There might be a way to disable DCC based on the issuing country data on the card. You can't blindly exclude certain currencies since there are USD denominated cards from the EU.

The chip has the issuer's country code on it, so it's definitely possible to enable or disable features based on it. Whether doing so is allowed is another issue though.

percysmith Nov 11, 2018 6:37 pm


Originally Posted by Majuki (Post 30419335)
I don't think the networks are setup to disable DCC selectively. I know that some currencies aren't supported. For instance, if you have a card denominated on Armenian Dram, perhaps it isn't supported. There might be a way to disable DCC based on the issuing country data on the card. You can't blindly exclude certain currencies since there are USD denominated cards from the EU.

I don't think Visa/Mastercard will allow because they will cite those deceitful "antitrust reasons"

Kremmen Dec 1, 2018 9:01 am

The cable car at Santorini in Greece does DCC. (And doesn't accept Amex.)

On the positive side, at least the fee is clearly stated and isn't nearly as bad as some. The DCC fee of 24c on $6.80 comes to 3.53%.


I HAVE CHOSEN TO PAY IN USD & UNDERSTAND MY CHOICE OF CURRENCY IS FINAL. THE EXCHANGE RATE IS BASED ON EUROBANK WHOLESALERATE AS OF 28/11 PLUS AN INTERNATIONAL CONVERSION FEE OF 0.24 USD. THIS SERVICE IS PROVIDED BY EUROBANK
Having refused to sign, the agent "reversed" the transaction by crediting 6 EUR (not DCC), thus meaning I was charged the DCC fee for nothing. I'll have to dispute it.

Majuki Dec 1, 2018 1:58 pm


Originally Posted by Kremmen (Post 30487288)
The cable car at Santorini in Greece does DCC. (And doesn't accept Amex.)

...

Having refused to sign, the agent "reversed" the transaction by crediting 6 EUR (not DCC), thus meaning I was charged the DCC fee for nothing. I'll have to dispute it.

Did you have possession of the terminal, or did the attendant process the card for you? Was there any way to do a contactless payment?

Kremmen Dec 1, 2018 2:44 pm


Originally Posted by Majuki (Post 30488204)
Did you have possession of the terminal, or did the attendant process the card for you? Was there any way to do a contactless payment?

The attendant sits with her window to the customer on her left and the terminal on her right. There is absolutely no way for the customer to reach the terminal, nor to see what is being displayed on it.

The Visa I used doesn't have contactless (stupid Chase), so I didn't pay attention to whether it was possible. Also, couldn't see if there was anything about that on the terminal, as it was so far away.

Majuki Dec 1, 2018 3:15 pm


Originally Posted by Kremmen (Post 30488348)
The attendant sits with her window to the customer on her left and the terminal on her right. There is absolutely no way for the customer to reach the terminal, nor to see what is being displayed on it.

The Visa I used doesn't have contactless (stupid Chase), so I didn't pay attention to whether it was possible. Also, couldn't see if there was anything about that on the terminal, as it was so far away.

I have never been to Greece, so I can't say how prevalent contactless is there. I know that the Pays aren't enabled in Greece. I have to wonder if they have PIN bypass since many coming from others countries would have chip-and-PIN cards. In this sense, I prefer countries with widespread contactless use and chip-and-PIN because the terminals are always customer facing. With a customer facing terminal one can at least see the prompts.

tmiw Dec 1, 2018 3:57 pm


Originally Posted by Majuki (Post 30488446)
I have never been to Greece, so I can't say how prevalent contactless is there. I know that the Pays aren't enabled in Greece. I have to wonder if they have PIN bypass since many coming from others countries would have chip-and-PIN cards. In this sense, I prefer countries with widespread contactless use and chip-and-PIN because the terminals are always customer facing. With a customer facing terminal one can at least see the prompts.

I highly doubt PIN's bypassed with any terminal in Europe. I'm not sure how that situation would be handled, though. Maybe they tap every European card and reserve insert for Americans?

Majuki Dec 2, 2018 1:11 am


Originally Posted by tmiw (Post 30488557)
I highly doubt PIN's bypassed with any terminal in Europe. I'm not sure how that situation would be handled, though. Maybe they tap every European card and reserve insert for Americans?

It's hard to say. I'm venturing a guess that outside of UK cards - which I believe would all have contactless - pretty much the only critical mass of non euro denominated cards they'd tend to see would be American.


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