Jan 16, 2017, 6:55 am
Last edit by: storewanderer
Older (archived) threads: 2014-16
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- What is EMV contactless?
EMV contactless is a form of contactless/NFC that uses the same security and encryption that is used when inserting a chip card into an EMV-enabled terminal. Other than not having to sign/enter a PIN for smaller transactions, the security is effectively the same as chip and PIN/chip and signature.
In contrast, MSD contactless is an older version that is designed just and only for the United States. This effectively uses much the same flow as a swiped card transaction with the same rules.
- What is CDCVM?
CDCVM stands for Consumer Device Cardholder Verification Method. It's a method of telling the terminal that the customer verified their identity using their mobile device. Terminals that support it will waive the signature/PIN requirement typically in place for larger transactions, potentially saving time at checkout.
More info: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202527
- Does EMV contactless need to be supported to support CDCVM?
Typically, yes. (However, there are some exceptions below.)
- Why can't I tap my foreign-issued contactless card at most places in the US?
This is likely because the store does not support EMV contactless. Foreign issued contactless cards typically do not support MSD contactless since other markets have had EMV for quite some time. In contrast, most stores in the US have yet to get the necessary certifications/software for EMV contactless so they are typically MSD-only--if contactless is enabled at all. (See below for a list of stores where your card will likely work.)
- I paid for a purchase with Apple/Android/Samsung Pay and still had to sign for it.
Most likely, the store in question does not have EMV contactless enabled (see above question). However, there are instances where CDCVM does not work even with EMV contactless enabled. Restaurants that allow tip adjust, for example--where the tip amount is written on a paper receipt and entered by the staff later--cannot support CDCVM. It may simply be a matter of the merchant's processor or the POS software in use not supporting it too.
Another common reason is if you used a US-issued AmEx card with a mobile wallet. AmEx currently does not allow EMV contactless support in mobile wallets for these cards, so they always run as MSD contactless. Because of this, CDCVM is not supported (with very few exceptions, as noted below).
Note: if you used Samsung Pay, you may have paid with MST instead of NFC. Since MST emulates the magnetic pulses that the terminal receives when swiping a regular card, the normal magstripe rules apply.
- How can I tell whether EMV contactless was used?
An easy way to tell if you have Apple Pay is to pay with a Visa or MC while in airplane mode. Wallet will then show a transaction amount next to "Payment" for the card that was used. Alternatively, EMV-related information will typically print on the receipt (AID, etc.) if EMV contactless was used.
(Non-exhaustive) list of EMV contactless supporting merchants in the US:
- 7-Eleven
- 99 Ranch
- Albertsons (Safeway, Vons, Pak N Save, Jewel, Acme, Shaws, Star, Carrs, Randalls, Tom Thumb, Haggen, Eagle, Lucky UT/SoCal)
- Apple Store*†
- Athleta
- Auntie Anne’s Pretzels
- Banana Republic
- Costco Wholesale
- CVS
- DuaneReade*
- El Pollo Loco
- EG Group US (Quik Stop, Kwik Shop, Tom Thumb, Turkey Hill) Note: cashier must press "Electronic Payment" to activate NFC
- Five Below*
- Five Guys
- GAP
- Grocery Outlet*
- Harmon's Grocery
- H&M*
- Jolibee
- Kohl's*
- Lush Cosmetics*
- Maverik
- McDonald's*
- Meijer
- Old Navy
- Panera Bread
- PetSmart
- Ray's Food Place
- Round Table Pizza
- Royal Farms
- Red Ribbon Bakeshop
- Sheetz
- Sherm's Thunderbird Discount Markets Inc.*
- Sprouts
- Staples*
- Starbucks*
- Subway
- Walgreens*
- Weis Markets
- All businesses that use Square and support contactless*
- All businesses that use Clover and support EMV†**
- All businesses that use First Data standalone terminals (e.g. FD100+FD35, FD130) with EMV enabled**
* CDCVM support confirmed
** CDCVM support depends on store/restaurant
† CDCVM supported in MSD mode
USA contactless credit/debit/transit (2017 - 2021)
Apr 27, 2017, 11:50 pm
#871
Join Date: Mar 2017
Programs: HHonors, TrueBlue, Delta SkyMiles, Hyatt Discoverist, Starwood Preferred Guest, American Airlines.
Posts: 2,035
Would they get the entire amount? Maybe not. They could easily negotiate some sort of revenue sharing if they wanted, though.
Also some banks already offer P2P payments, like I've mentioned with services like Chase Pay. Citi uses a service to transfer money and gives you the option for next day or 3-5 days for speed (next day has limit such as you need the amount + $500 or more in your checking account).
https://online.citi.com/US/JRS/pands...terInstitution
I know AmeriCU uses Pop Money to send money to other banks as P2P payments, although this can only be done online and not through mobile.
Banks either have a partnership with a company already for P2P payments (so they're not interested in dealing with Apple) or have their own in house services they use; thus, they're not interested in giving revenue to Apple. Why would Chase spend the money to build Quick Pay only to let Apple waltz in and compete with it + take revenue? It doesn't make sense for most of the major banks to partner with Apple on this.
Besides, as a consumer, if my bank doesn't have an option for P2P payments, I'm doing it over facebook, not with Apple, who would likely limit who I can send money to (only those with iPhones, Macs and iPads).
Keep in mind I'm not saying I don't want to see this happen, but there's too many obstacles to make it happen, and it's not profitable for the banks.
Maybe not on the public website but for all we know, they're sending a slip of paper talking about it (like what AmEx does).
Apr 28, 2017, 2:11 am
#872
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 432
It's not because unlike Prestige, the chip is still on the front and the mag strip on the back and is very clear to see. I actually believe the Citi Prestige design was great and wish they gave people a way to keep it. I still have mine but sadly the card expires soon.
On topic, Capital One Venture and Venture One are also contactless and designed in the same way.
On topic, Capital One Venture and Venture One are also contactless and designed in the same way.
Apr 28, 2017, 2:37 am
#873
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 489
It's not because unlike Prestige, the chip is still on the front and the mag strip on the back and is very clear to see. I actually believe the Citi Prestige design was great and wish they gave people a way to keep it. I still have mine but sadly the card expires soon.
On topic, Capital One Venture and Venture One are also contactless and designed in the same way.
On topic, Capital One Venture and Venture One are also contactless and designed in the same way.
Apr 28, 2017, 3:44 am
#874
Join Date: Mar 2017
Programs: HHonors, TrueBlue, Delta SkyMiles, Hyatt Discoverist, Starwood Preferred Guest, American Airlines.
Posts: 2,035
I guess the Venture comes contactless too, but Capital One said my account doesn't qualify at this time. I'm guessing one reason as to why is because my card is made out of metal.
Apr 28, 2017, 3:07 pm
#875
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,507
The person said contactless is coming standard on the Capital One cards. AMEX doesn't offer contactless as a standard feature on their cards, at least not yet. If the feature is standard, it should be advertised on the site, and the photos of the card(s) should be updated to have the contactless logo on it/them.
Apr 28, 2017, 4:12 pm
#876
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 432
Credit: 2wice
Assuming that it becomes a standard feature on nearly every card at some point, is it really necessary to have the icon be plainly visible on the website? I would think it'd be like what the chip is now, where it's assumed that the card is chip and signature with no PIN support unless mentioned otherwise.
Apr 28, 2017, 4:51 pm
#877
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,722
I spoke with CS and the rep saw an option for contactless. Here's a photo of the back of a Quicksilver but all have contactless. I have Venture but have seen photos of Venture One, Quicksilver and Quicksilver One in both network flavors with contactless.
Credit: 2wice
I have Venture and it now has contactless.
Correct, the cards don't even depict the association logos which is on the back with the contactless symbol.
Credit: 2wice
I have Venture and it now has contactless.
Correct, the cards don't even depict the association logos which is on the back with the contactless symbol.
Also my local Starbucks just opened and they use the same UI on VX820 (contactless works well) as all other Starbucks but it seems they are using HP for the hardware, or at least the touchscreen part is HP. MasterCard contactless works well at Starbucks so the Capital One Wallet was indeed the issue and only one receipt prints now so no other receipt with the chip info on it.
Last edited by scibot; Apr 28, 2017 at 4:58 pm
Apr 28, 2017, 7:24 pm
#878
Join Date: Mar 2017
Programs: HHonors, TrueBlue, Delta SkyMiles, Hyatt Discoverist, Starwood Preferred Guest, American Airlines.
Posts: 2,035
Assuming that it becomes a standard feature on nearly every card at some point, is it really necessary to have the icon be plainly visible on the website? I would think it'd be like what the chip is now, where it's assumed that the card is chip and signature with no PIN support unless mentioned otherwise.
I have Venture and it now has contactless.
Apr 28, 2017, 7:56 pm
#879
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 432
No, I have the Venture WEMC and the metal is exclusive to VS. From what I understand Venture VS has three card options: standard, contactless or metal. There is no contactless metal right now.
Apr 28, 2017, 8:51 pm
#880
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 1,592
My Quicksilver One MC isn't eligible right now is what the CSR just said and that I could call back once a month and eventually it would be, hmm.
Also my local Starbucks just opened and they use the same UI on VX820 (contactless works well) as all other Starbucks but it seems they are using HP for the hardware, or at least the touchscreen part is HP. MasterCard contactless works well at Starbucks so the Capital One Wallet was indeed the issue and only one receipt prints now so no other receipt with the chip info on it.
Also my local Starbucks just opened and they use the same UI on VX820 (contactless works well) as all other Starbucks but it seems they are using HP for the hardware, or at least the touchscreen part is HP. MasterCard contactless works well at Starbucks so the Capital One Wallet was indeed the issue and only one receipt prints now so no other receipt with the chip info on it.
Apr 28, 2017, 9:04 pm
#881
Join Date: Mar 2017
Programs: HHonors, TrueBlue, Delta SkyMiles, Hyatt Discoverist, Starwood Preferred Guest, American Airlines.
Posts: 2,035
Apr 28, 2017, 10:56 pm
#882
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,507
BTW, Capital One does advertise the feature in the stuff they mail with the card:
Apr 29, 2017, 4:39 pm
#883
Join Date: Apr 2017
Posts: 150
There is no such thing as contactless metal. All contactless cards must be plastic, or else the antenna will not function correctly. The "premium" metal credit cards all are contact EMV only, with mag-swipe fallback.
Apr 29, 2017, 4:40 pm
#884
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,507
The new AmEx Platinum is available with contactless despite being a metal card.