Jan 16, 2017, 6:55 am
Last edit by: storewanderer
Older (archived) threads: 2014-16
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- What is EMV contactless?
EMV contactless is a form of contactless/NFC that uses the same security and encryption that is used when inserting a chip card into an EMV-enabled terminal. Other than not having to sign/enter a PIN for smaller transactions, the security is effectively the same as chip and PIN/chip and signature.
In contrast, MSD contactless is an older version that is designed just and only for the United States. This effectively uses much the same flow as a swiped card transaction with the same rules.
- What is CDCVM?
CDCVM stands for Consumer Device Cardholder Verification Method. It's a method of telling the terminal that the customer verified their identity using their mobile device. Terminals that support it will waive the signature/PIN requirement typically in place for larger transactions, potentially saving time at checkout.
More info: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202527
- Does EMV contactless need to be supported to support CDCVM?
Typically, yes. (However, there are some exceptions below.)
- Why can't I tap my foreign-issued contactless card at most places in the US?
This is likely because the store does not support EMV contactless. Foreign issued contactless cards typically do not support MSD contactless since other markets have had EMV for quite some time. In contrast, most stores in the US have yet to get the necessary certifications/software for EMV contactless so they are typically MSD-only--if contactless is enabled at all. (See below for a list of stores where your card will likely work.)
- I paid for a purchase with Apple/Android/Samsung Pay and still had to sign for it.
Most likely, the store in question does not have EMV contactless enabled (see above question). However, there are instances where CDCVM does not work even with EMV contactless enabled. Restaurants that allow tip adjust, for example--where the tip amount is written on a paper receipt and entered by the staff later--cannot support CDCVM. It may simply be a matter of the merchant's processor or the POS software in use not supporting it too.
Another common reason is if you used a US-issued AmEx card with a mobile wallet. AmEx currently does not allow EMV contactless support in mobile wallets for these cards, so they always run as MSD contactless. Because of this, CDCVM is not supported (with very few exceptions, as noted below).
Note: if you used Samsung Pay, you may have paid with MST instead of NFC. Since MST emulates the magnetic pulses that the terminal receives when swiping a regular card, the normal magstripe rules apply.
- How can I tell whether EMV contactless was used?
An easy way to tell if you have Apple Pay is to pay with a Visa or MC while in airplane mode. Wallet will then show a transaction amount next to "Payment" for the card that was used. Alternatively, EMV-related information will typically print on the receipt (AID, etc.) if EMV contactless was used.
(Non-exhaustive) list of EMV contactless supporting merchants in the US:
- 7-Eleven
- 99 Ranch
- Albertsons (Safeway, Vons, Pak N Save, Jewel, Acme, Shaws, Star, Carrs, Randalls, Tom Thumb, Haggen, Eagle, Lucky UT/SoCal)
- Apple Store*†
- Athleta
- Auntie Anne’s Pretzels
- Banana Republic
- Costco Wholesale
- CVS
- DuaneReade*
- El Pollo Loco
- EG Group US (Quik Stop, Kwik Shop, Tom Thumb, Turkey Hill) Note: cashier must press "Electronic Payment" to activate NFC
- Five Below*
- Five Guys
- GAP
- Grocery Outlet*
- Harmon's Grocery
- H&M*
- Jolibee
- Kohl's*
- Lush Cosmetics*
- Maverik
- McDonald's*
- Meijer
- Old Navy
- Panera Bread
- PetSmart
- Ray's Food Place
- Round Table Pizza
- Royal Farms
- Red Ribbon Bakeshop
- Sheetz
- Sherm's Thunderbird Discount Markets Inc.*
- Sprouts
- Staples*
- Starbucks*
- Subway
- Walgreens*
- Weis Markets
- All businesses that use Square and support contactless*
- All businesses that use Clover and support EMV†**
- All businesses that use First Data standalone terminals (e.g. FD100+FD35, FD130) with EMV enabled**
* CDCVM support confirmed
** CDCVM support depends on store/restaurant
† CDCVM supported in MSD mode
USA contactless credit/debit/transit (2017 - 2021)
Oct 5, 2020, 1:25 am
#8806
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,722
Well it seems QuikTrip is rolling out contactless readers to their pumps as we speak according to them on Twitter. They use a custom POS system and Flex Pay IV without the contactless readers previously so that is probably the contactless readers that they will be adding. Not sure what they will do about locations with old pumps though it should be interesting to see. I wonder if contactless at the pump will be EMV contactless especially since QT was one of the first gas stations I saw with EMV contactless inside.
Last edited by scibot; Oct 5, 2020 at 2:02 am
Oct 5, 2020, 11:04 am
#8807
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,507
Dollar Tree's contactless has issues with MC debit; my card declined when I tried to use it last night (with PIN). My Visa CC, of course, worked fine, and it's possible MC debit without PIN would have worked too.
Also, still no contactless at Michaels or Walmart, but that's not a huge surprise I think.
Also, still no contactless at Michaels or Walmart, but that's not a huge surprise I think.
Oct 5, 2020, 4:35 pm
#8808
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,722
Dollar Tree's contactless has issues with MC debit; my card declined when I tried to use it last night (with PIN). My Visa CC, of course, worked fine, and it's possible MC debit without PIN would have worked too.
Also, still no contactless at Michaels or Walmart, but that's not a huge surprise I think.
Also, still no contactless at Michaels or Walmart, but that's not a huge surprise I think.
Oct 5, 2020, 4:57 pm
#8809
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Canada
Programs: BA Gold (OWE), Star Alliance Gold, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 2,194
Walmart have just started rolling out contactless here in Canada, so fingers crossed the US is next (although MasterCard mandated that new terminals in Canada are contactless, so they basically had too when they replaced their terminals). Both Walmart and Michaels are some of the very last merchants not to have contactless in Canada. Since the limit increase to $250 for contactless payments, I've seen people who have quite obviously forgotten their PINs when in Walmart as they basically tap for 100% of transactions (except in Walmart).
Oct 5, 2020, 6:11 pm
#8810
Join Date: Oct 2019
Posts: 137
Oct 5, 2020, 7:40 pm
#8811
Join Date: Oct 2014
Programs: Skymiles
Posts: 3,251
Walmart have just started rolling out contactless here in Canada, so fingers crossed the US is next (although MasterCard mandated that new terminals in Canada are contactless, so they basically had too when they replaced their terminals). Both Walmart and Michaels are some of the very last merchants not to have contactless in Canada. Since the limit increase to $250 for contactless payments, I've seen people who have quite obviously forgotten their PINs when in Walmart as they basically tap for 100% of transactions (except in Walmart).
Oct 5, 2020, 8:04 pm
#8813
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,507
Fairly sure it's EMV contactless as I got a PIN prompt with my UNFCU credit card the very first time I was able to tap there.
FWIW, Quick Chip came back as of my last visit the other day (or possibly never disappeared; I don't go there often enough to know for sure).
Have they announced any sort of plan at all? I remember hearing something about Michaels planning on doing it at one point but it could have easily been something else they'd have been able to claim as "contactless" (like curbside pickup or something similar to Kroger's Scan & Go).
Not sure about Canada but where I live I've seen no indication thus far they were swapping anything out. The Lane/7000 would be the most likely candidate if they are/were, however.
Also, keep in mind that they don't strictly need to swap anything out just to enable contactless. After all, 7-Eleven does it fine with their iSC250s.
I still think it's coming but it might be after contact EMV gets enabled. Else, why use the Verifone readers when they could have possibly installed something proprietary like what ExxonMobil did back in the day? (Assuming there still were non-payment capable readers available for sale, that is.)
Also, even if the Verifone readers are/were the only option, you'd think Costco Pay would be at way more locations by now if that's what they were going with. Haven't they been testing Costco Pay for like a year or something? I forget exactly when it first came out to know for sure.
Have they announced any sort of plan at all? I remember hearing something about Michaels planning on doing it at one point but it could have easily been something else they'd have been able to claim as "contactless" (like curbside pickup or something similar to Kroger's Scan & Go).
Not sure about Canada but where I live I've seen no indication thus far they were swapping anything out. The Lane/7000 would be the most likely candidate if they are/were, however.
Also, keep in mind that they don't strictly need to swap anything out just to enable contactless. After all, 7-Eleven does it fine with their iSC250s.
Also, even if the Verifone readers are/were the only option, you'd think Costco Pay would be at way more locations by now if that's what they were going with. Haven't they been testing Costco Pay for like a year or something? I forget exactly when it first came out to know for sure.
Oct 5, 2020, 9:37 pm
#8814
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,507
I went to the newly opened Raising Cane's tonight and surprisingly, they finally enabled EMV. They made the Lane/3000s customer facing, too, with "WE ACCEPT TAP TO PAY" in large letters on the FreedomPay firmware they're running. I'm going to say they're another place that only started officially accepting it due to COVID.
(Note: I'll need to go back again and determine how contact EMV works there. Tapping a Visa card worked fine, though, albeit with no info on the receipt.)
(Note: I'll need to go back again and determine how contact EMV works there. Tapping a Visa card worked fine, though, albeit with no info on the receipt.)
Oct 5, 2020, 10:06 pm
#8815
Join Date: Oct 2014
Programs: Skymiles
Posts: 3,251
Another restaurant got table side payments! Yay!
It’s a small restaurant called Gurley St Cafe. They used Upserve tablets (similar to toast tab), when the server came I just used my Apple Pay on the back of her device. Then she handed me the terminal to tip and leave an electronic signature....even though I used contactless.
The server said they just got it a few days ago and so far they love them. I hope this trend continues.
It’s a small restaurant called Gurley St Cafe. They used Upserve tablets (similar to toast tab), when the server came I just used my Apple Pay on the back of her device. Then she handed me the terminal to tip and leave an electronic signature....even though I used contactless.
The server said they just got it a few days ago and so far they love them. I hope this trend continues.
Oct 5, 2020, 11:50 pm
#8816
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Canada
Programs: BA Gold (OWE), Star Alliance Gold, Hilton Diamond
Posts: 2,194
Oct 6, 2020, 10:54 am
#8817
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 1,722
I went to the newly opened Raising Cane's tonight and surprisingly, they finally enabled EMV. They made the Lane/3000s customer facing, too, with "WE ACCEPT TAP TO PAY" in large letters on the FreedomPay firmware they're running. I'm going to say they're another place that only started officially accepting it due to COVID.
(Note: I'll need to go back again and determine how contact EMV works there. Tapping a Visa card worked fine, though, albeit with no info on the receipt.)
(Note: I'll need to go back again and determine how contact EMV works there. Tapping a Visa card worked fine, though, albeit with no info on the receipt.)
A source on Reddit here: https://www.reddit.com/r/ApplePay/co...tco_gas_pumps/ but I will believe it when I see it. They have had the hardware for years now its just normal Flex Pay IV seen at many stations with working contactless. Many places in Colorado that have chip at the pump still have contactless MSD at the pump so even if they got chip I'd expect contactless to still be MSD. Of course that is with Passport and I have no idea what system Costco uses for the pumps. The receipts you get from the pumps look nothing like anything I've seen elsewhere.
Oct 6, 2020, 1:18 pm
#8818
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: San Diego, CA
Programs: GE, Marriott Platinum
Posts: 15,507
Well I used contactless at Raising Canes back in February 2020 right before the pandemic got well known and maybe they were a test location as they already had both EMV and contactless enabled but as we all know the pinpad was facing the cashier. They had no issues with me paying that way but it was brand new so the cashier did ask the manager if they had it and of course they did and everyone was super nice at that corporate Raising Canes. My local franchised Raising Canes still does not have pinpads at all though. I'm glad they put them facing the pinpad towards the customer as tapping a pinpad facing the cashier was a bit awkward.
Still, it's good they're finally doing it officially, even if it did seem like they did it mainly due to the pandemic (albeit coincidentally).
A source on Reddit here: https://www.reddit.com/r/ApplePay/co...tco_gas_pumps/ but I will believe it when I see it. They have had the hardware for years now its just normal Flex Pay IV seen at many stations with working contactless. Many places in Colorado that have chip at the pump still have contactless MSD at the pump so even if they got chip I'd expect contactless to still be MSD. Of course that is with Passport and I have no idea what system Costco uses for the pumps. The receipts you get from the pumps look nothing like anything I've seen elsewhere.
Also, Costco is getting EMV (and maybe contactless) at the pump late enough that it's probably not possible for them to do MSD contactless even if they wanted. Hence why they might do only contact EMV initially if they can't get EMV contactless implemented quickly enough.
Oct 7, 2020, 9:13 pm
#8819
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: RDU
Programs: DL(PM), UA(Silver), AA(EXP) Marriott(Ti), HH(Gold), Hertz(PC)
Posts: 2,667
The Maggiano's restaurant chain now does the pay at the table by QR code thing that seems to be gaining in popularity. I'm OK with this approach, it keeps the card in your wallet.
Oct 8, 2020, 9:15 am
#8820
Join Date: Oct 2007
Programs: AA, WN, UA, Bonvoy, Hertz
Posts: 2,491
I had been doing so many app and other CNP transactions in recent months, that I forgot about some of the in-person use problems that I have been having in the past. Sadly, they haven't gone away.
My current example is I still get failure (transaction declined) on MC credit tap at In N Out (also a few other places like Krispy Kreme too). I think this has been happening since In N Out offered tap. I have to try the card again via chip to get it to go through. I know it is not my tap because I then try it a few minutes later at a Toast box via tap, and it works just fine. Such a disappointment. Is MC credit (physical card not mobile wallet) tap working for anyone out there at this chain?
My current example is I still get failure (transaction declined) on MC credit tap at In N Out (also a few other places like Krispy Kreme too). I think this has been happening since In N Out offered tap. I have to try the card again via chip to get it to go through. I know it is not my tap because I then try it a few minutes later at a Toast box via tap, and it works just fine. Such a disappointment. Is MC credit (physical card not mobile wallet) tap working for anyone out there at this chain?