Last edit by: storewanderer
Older (archived) threads: 2014-16
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FAQ- What is EMV contactless?
EMV contactless is a form of contactless/NFC that uses the same security and encryption that is used when inserting a chip card into an EMV-enabled terminal. Other than not having to sign/enter a PIN for smaller transactions, the security is effectively the same as chip and PIN/chip and signature.
In contrast, MSD contactless is an older version that is designed just and only for the United States. This effectively uses much the same flow as a swiped card transaction with the same rules.
- What is CDCVM?
CDCVM stands for Consumer Device Cardholder Verification Method. It's a method of telling the terminal that the customer verified their identity using their mobile device. Terminals that support it will waive the signature/PIN requirement typically in place for larger transactions, potentially saving time at checkout.
More info: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT202527
- Does EMV contactless need to be supported to support CDCVM?
Typically, yes. (However, there are some exceptions below.)
- Why can't I tap my foreign-issued contactless card at most places in the US?
This is likely because the store does not support EMV contactless. Foreign issued contactless cards typically do not support MSD contactless since other markets have had EMV for quite some time. In contrast, most stores in the US have yet to get the necessary certifications/software for EMV contactless so they are typically MSD-only--if contactless is enabled at all. (See below for a list of stores where your card will likely work.)
- I paid for a purchase with Apple/Android/Samsung Pay and still had to sign for it.
Most likely, the store in question does not have EMV contactless enabled (see above question). However, there are instances where CDCVM does not work even with EMV contactless enabled. Restaurants that allow tip adjust, for example--where the tip amount is written on a paper receipt and entered by the staff later--cannot support CDCVM. It may simply be a matter of the merchant's processor or the POS software in use not supporting it too.
Another common reason is if you used a US-issued AmEx card with a mobile wallet. AmEx currently does not allow EMV contactless support in mobile wallets for these cards, so they always run as MSD contactless. Because of this, CDCVM is not supported (with very few exceptions, as noted below).
Note: if you used Samsung Pay, you may have paid with MST instead of NFC. Since MST emulates the magnetic pulses that the terminal receives when swiping a regular card, the normal magstripe rules apply.
- How can I tell whether EMV contactless was used?
An easy way to tell if you have Apple Pay is to pay with a Visa or MC while in airplane mode. Wallet will then show a transaction amount next to "Payment" for the card that was used. Alternatively, EMV-related information will typically print on the receipt (AID, etc.) if EMV contactless was used.
(Non-exhaustive) list of EMV contactless supporting merchants in the US:
- 7-Eleven
- 99 Ranch
- Albertsons (Safeway, Vons, Pak N Save, Jewel, Acme, Shaws, Star, Carrs, Randalls, Tom Thumb, Haggen, Eagle, Lucky UT/SoCal)
- Apple Store*†
- Athleta
- Auntie Anne’s Pretzels
- Banana Republic
- Costco Wholesale
- CVS
- DuaneReade*
- El Pollo Loco
- EG Group US (Quik Stop, Kwik Shop, Tom Thumb, Turkey Hill) Note: cashier must press "Electronic Payment" to activate NFC
- Five Below*
- Five Guys
- GAP
- Grocery Outlet*
- Harmon's Grocery
- H&M*
- Jolibee
- Kohl's*
- Lush Cosmetics*
- Maverik
- McDonald's*
- Meijer
- Old Navy
- Panera Bread
- PetSmart
- Ray's Food Place
- Round Table Pizza
- Royal Farms
- Red Ribbon Bakeshop
- Sheetz
- Sherm's Thunderbird Discount Markets Inc.*
- Sprouts
- Staples*
- Starbucks*
- Subway
- Walgreens*
- Weis Markets
- All businesses that use Square and support contactless*
- All businesses that use Clover and support EMV†**
- All businesses that use First Data standalone terminals (e.g. FD100+FD35, FD130) with EMV enabled**
* CDCVM support confirmed
** CDCVM support depends on store/restaurant
† CDCVM supported in MSD mode
USA contactless credit/debit/transit (2017 - 2021)
#6001
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Also, from what I heard elsewhere, the EMV slot on the older units isn't big enough for the current metal cards. Which wasn't a problem at the time since metal cards weren't that common, but now? Yeah...
(BTW, Clover does still have one of the faster non-QC EMV implementations, so there's that at least. I should probably insert next time, though, and make sure they didn't go implement it.)
#6002
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#6003
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#6004
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They need to buy a new point of sale system then. Can't take metal cards? That stinks... There's a ton of them out there now.
#6005
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That’s what I’m wondering too. I may check today myself here in AZ. I guess I just have to be “in the mood” to eat In N Out.
#6006
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Also, the receipt doesn't look any different than usual (no EMV data, just "C" next to the card number when you insert/remove). Is there more info printed at the location that has it enabled?
All that said, the above could very well change once it's enabled, assuming it's still rolling out.
#6007
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Even though my region is not promoted for Kroger Pay, it has shown up on my local Kroger region app. This is a combined QR code with loyalty and payment together. There is a bit of incentive to use the app, until 8/31/2019 (at least):
You can add any credit card to the app, including Visa Credit.
I expect this is available for other regions as long as you have the menu option in the app. It does seem that we are in full soft rollout.
I do not know how Kroger Pay shows as a transaction when it posts.
You can add any credit card to the app, including Visa Credit.
- You will earn 1.5 fuel points that can be used toward discounted purchases of fuel at Kroger Fuel Centers for each $1 of eligible net purchases. Your fuel points can be tracked on your receipt, in your Account on Kroger.com or in the App.
- You will earn a discount equal to 2% of the aggregate cost of Our Quality Brand Products (excluding weighed items). This discount may be automatically applied to (and may be aggregated with other discounts applied to) a future purchase when you use Kroger Pay. For a complete list of Kroger Our Quality Brands visit kroger.com/b/ourbrands*.
I do not know how Kroger Pay shows as a transaction when it posts.
#6008
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Even though my region is not promoted for Kroger Pay, it has shown up on my local Kroger region app. This is a combined QR code with loyalty and payment together. There is a bit of incentive to use the app, until 8/31/2019 (at least):
You can add any credit card to the app, including Visa Credit.
I expect this is available for other regions as long as you have the menu option in the app. It does seem that we are in full soft rollout.
I do not know how Kroger Pay shows as a transaction when it posts.
You can add any credit card to the app, including Visa Credit.
I expect this is available for other regions as long as you have the menu option in the app. It does seem that we are in full soft rollout.
I do not know how Kroger Pay shows as a transaction when it posts.
#6009
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I saw EMV in action with (I think) the Verifone e355 for the first time. UNTUCKit was the store in question. Unfortunately it didn't look like contactless was enabled but at least it was facing up on the table with the iPad's display facing downward until the transaction finished; I'm not sure the cashier would have done that if PIN wasn't enabled, but who knows? I should see if it's certified for EMV contactless in case that's the reason why contactless wasn't turned on.
Also, I tried a Visa card in Google Pay at Sprouts today and didn't see the PIN VERIFIED message on the receipt. Granted, the amount was a lot smaller, but I thought CDCVM got used for all Visa mobile wallet transactions (whereas it's only used for MC above the contactless limit).
BTW contactless still works at H&M but I didn't see it on the Google Pay app. I should pay attention when I'm near there over the next week or two to see if it starts appearing (again?).
EDIT: yep, it's certified:
EDIT 2: I almost forgot--the ATMs at the Capital One Cafe here apparently have contactless readers ("place phone here" to the left of the PIN pad, but no lights or the usual contactless symbol). They didn't respond to my phone at all though. Do they work at other Capital One ATMs?
Also, I tried a Visa card in Google Pay at Sprouts today and didn't see the PIN VERIFIED message on the receipt. Granted, the amount was a lot smaller, but I thought CDCVM got used for all Visa mobile wallet transactions (whereas it's only used for MC above the contactless limit).
BTW contactless still works at H&M but I didn't see it on the Google Pay app. I should pay attention when I'm near there over the next week or two to see if it starts appearing (again?).
EDIT: yep, it's certified:
EDIT 2: I almost forgot--the ATMs at the Capital One Cafe here apparently have contactless readers ("place phone here" to the left of the PIN pad, but no lights or the usual contactless symbol). They didn't respond to my phone at all though. Do they work at other Capital One ATMs?
Last edited by tmiw; Apr 14, 2019 at 9:20 pm
#6010
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Just saw this Chase commercial on TV. At least one can't say they aren't trying to promote contactless:
#6012
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I saw EMV in action with (I think) the Verifone e355 for the first time. UNTUCKit was the store in question. Unfortunately it didn't look like contactless was enabled but at least it was facing up on the table with the iPad's display facing downward until the transaction finished; I'm not sure the cashier would have done that if PIN wasn't enabled, but who knows? I should see if it's certified for EMV contactless in case that's the reason why contactless wasn't turned on.
#6013
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Another one with EMV Contactless sometimes: Ray's Food Place.
I went to five locations. 3 of them ran it EMV Contactless and the other 2 ran it MSD Contactless. Used the same card every time. The EMV Contactless processes pretty much instantly but the MSD Contactless took about 5 seconds. I didn't get a chance to see how they were running chip cards because I was the only customer buying anything every single time.
They are on the NCR similar to Sprouts, Grocery Outlet, and similar. The receipt looks slightly different than the others though. It has "Sale" "MID" and various other lines.
I went to five locations. 3 of them ran it EMV Contactless and the other 2 ran it MSD Contactless. Used the same card every time. The EMV Contactless processes pretty much instantly but the MSD Contactless took about 5 seconds. I didn't get a chance to see how they were running chip cards because I was the only customer buying anything every single time.
They are on the NCR similar to Sprouts, Grocery Outlet, and similar. The receipt looks slightly different than the others though. It has "Sale" "MID" and various other lines.
#6014
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I've been using my Chase Freedom contactless and TD Visa debit lately as well as my phone quite a bit and my observations are that it is a major PITA sometimes to find the spot where to tap. Especially on those big Verifone terminals, you never know where you have to tap etc. For some reason, whenever I've been in Europe, the termianls are usually very small and everyone is conditioned to just bring it close to the screen - you tap it on the screen and it pretty much works 99% of the time, sometimes they are on the side and weird places, but for the most part, it's all universal. Here, I found that most of the Verifone ones have it at the bottom, you have to keep hovering around and who knows where it will be, who knows what you will have to press first etc. etc.
I know I am preaching to the choir here but it is just such a shame that we can't have it universal and working well, because at this point I feel that it's a lottery if it will work, and I spend time hovering my card around like I'm using a metal detector on the beach or something. Seems easier to just insert the card and be done with it, which is what I do not want to do, because I really want these contactless things to take off here.
I know I am preaching to the choir here but it is just such a shame that we can't have it universal and working well, because at this point I feel that it's a lottery if it will work, and I spend time hovering my card around like I'm using a metal detector on the beach or something. Seems easier to just insert the card and be done with it, which is what I do not want to do, because I really want these contactless things to take off here.
#6015
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BTW I thought Apple stores used Ingenico equipment? This might mean that newer locations (the San Diego one opened last year when the mall expansion was done) are using different devices than older ones.
I've been using my Chase Freedom contactless and TD Visa debit lately as well as my phone quite a bit and my observations are that it is a major PITA sometimes to find the spot where to tap. Especially on those big Verifone terminals, you never know where you have to tap etc. For some reason, whenever I've been in Europe, the termianls are usually very small and everyone is conditioned to just bring it close to the screen - you tap it on the screen and it pretty much works 99% of the time, sometimes they are on the side and weird places, but for the most part, it's all universal. Here, I found that most of the Verifone ones have it at the bottom, you have to keep hovering around and who knows where it will be, who knows what you will have to press first etc. etc.