Yes, when there is a fixed exchange rate and "classic" DCC hits you, it's just as much as a scam as with a flexible rate.

However, when it's like in the Maldives or Lebanon, where they can run "native" USD transactions, it's no scam but actually beneficial to all USD account holders.

Slightly different topic: My Swiss Credit card company (Corner) informed me about changed (increased) rates: Now when you get DCC'ed, you get slapped just as well a 1.2% surcharge (before it was 0% extra for DCC and 0.9% for non-DCC so DCC was slightly less bad - still bad, just a tiny bit less) as with any regular transaction.

Yes, it seems that the credit card companies want to milk the cow till it drops dead. One decade ago, I thought credit cards will make my travel life easier.. now, I think more and more different..

Sometime around 2004 or so, they took a wrong turn..

Rats, Sixt just hit me with DCC... I didn't check the contract! :mad::mad::mad:

The rental car industry are scum, so this is no surprise. They really don't care how much you hate them and they know their competition is all just as bad.

With car co (as with hotel deposit holding), why not AE?

Took a look at the rental contract, there was a mention of DCC there, but it was not highlighted by the agent (the contract had various circles he made while explaining me the terms). I wrote to Sixt this morning venting my disappointment with how I was hit with DCC and how I could avoid it in the future. They came back immediately with a apology and a 20€ credit ^:cool:

Because my CSP comes with a zero deductible CDW.

Yeah, rental cars are a difficult scenario. I too like to use my CSP because it provides primary all country coverage (even the difficult countries for CDW), so I'd prefer it over my AmEx.

So is there a clear way on how to avoid DCC with them?

Amex would be primary outside the USA for CDW.

Amex excludes the following countries from rental car coverage: Australia, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Jamaica, and New Zealand. CSP rental car coverage is valid in all countries.

Chase' coverage in primary in the United States, while Amex coverage in the US is secondary.

In addition, depending on the card type and options selected, the Amex coverage is limited to between $75,000- $100,000 for damage or theft. CSP has no such dollar limit. Chase excludes from coverage "expensive, exotic, antique automobiles; certain vans; trucks; motorcycles, mopeds and motorbikes; limousines; and recreational vehicles."* I've been assured by a Chase representative that most models of Audi, BMW and Mercedes Benz are covered.

* From the "Letter of Coverage" provided me by Chase at my request.

I thought the premium car rental protection was primary? (This comes with a fee for each rental, of course, whereas CSP includes it as a benefit at no additional cost.)

I don't know. I was comparing the included benefits, not the ones which cost extra.

Why would I want to pay an extra fee per rental for something that is included in the annual fee of another card which I carry?

You wouldn't if you had both cards. However, before CSP became primary, AmEx's car rental protection was usually a better buy and something I did overseas. Now I just use CSP, but it still exposes me to DCC in non-USD denominated locations. Admittedly, the only location where I've rented recently where this is the case has been Australia with Hertz, and fellow FT member and I klashn saw no attempt at DCC.

I have Costo AE and the blue cash every day AE. Both slug a 3% foreign currency transaction fee. So the choice is pay AF to AE, get slugged 3% fee, or DCC with Visa/Master card. Or just withdraw cash and pay in cash, but for bigger transactions you can insist on no DCC.

Rock and a hard place. If the DCCed Visa comes with CDW waiver then that may very well be the decider.

Yep, most AmEx products on offer are ~ 3% FTF. Centurion, Platinum, Delta (within the last 2 years), and SPG (within the last year) are 0% FTF. What I typically do is book the hotel and do the preauth with my Platinum card. I will then settle the bill with my affinity card (Citi Hilton Visa or Chase Marriott Visa). For smaller transactions, as I've said before, I just use cash or a contactless stored value card like Octopus or EasyCard.

It's also worth adding that the PRG (Gold) card is also 0% FTF (albeit no bonus categories at foreign merchants); I suspect that this card may be as popular as most of the other 0% FTF AmEx cards combined.

I'd say in that case, Amex would be the way to go. I'd be surprised if DCC ever was as low as 3%.

I was worried about the reported rampant DCC in Spain. To my surprise, NONE happened during our few days in Madrid last week. The hotels all billed in Euro - 1 Marriott, 2 AC Hotels, 1 Crowne Plaza. All restaurant meals as well as fast foods were in euro despite I was never shown the handhelds. Did not buy anything so no idea on that front.

The only annoying thing is one of the AC hotels authorized the card used for booking a day BEFORE arrival, on refundable booking, and at the wrong rate (the rate was reduced after a Marriott Look No Further guarantee was approved and correctly reflected on Marriott site.) It also tried to authorize an unknown amount on a point stay booking. But the card on file had expired as the booking was made last Dec and the card expired in Feb. At check in I was told the card was invalid and I just gave them the new card. Much later I Found an email that I must provide a new card immediately (a day before arrival, on a point stay) otherwise the reservation would be canceled. There is no telling how much the hotel tries to authorize. This is the first time on hundreds nights of hotel stay around the world that I encounter a hotel would authorize the card on file a day before guest check in, on refundable booking and on award nights. Crowne Plaza MAD airport did put 10 euro test charge on the card on the day of arrival at around noon time per the Chase email alert on International authorization, but seemed to automatically reverse the charge once the card was proven being "good card" as I saw both the billing and "return" on the Chase IHG card online.

I have started to see this at Hiltons in NYC in the past year or so. When I thought about it a bit, it makes total sense. Whether it be a cancelable post-paid reservation, or an award reservation, the credit card is on file as a guarantee to pay the no-show penalty should you no show. Without a valid credit card on file to which the penalty can be charged, the reservation is not valid. I would imagine that properties that historically had too many "credit card guaranteed" reservations that they were unable to collect the no-show penalty from would be the ones to implement such a policy.

I agree the test is probably necessary to make sure the card remains in good standing for the guarantee - hence the Crowne Plaza put a 10 euro test around noon time at arrival date. However authorize the FULL rate a day BEFORE arrival date in my opinion the hotel has gone too far. On top of that at check out they still require the physical card to rerun the actual charge when could not use the pre-authorized code to do the billing. This AC Hotel (Carlton) has a screwy system - when I showed the front desk clerk the reservation print out, he said, "Is it all you can show for your reservation? You dont have any voucher?" Would he be able to see how the reservation is made? (directly on Marriott site with fully refundable rate later adjusted lower due to LNF claim but it was still a fully refundable booking pay at check out.) He then needed to make a copy of my print out of the reservation. What if the guest only has the electronic version saved on a device? The AC Atocha 2 blocks away has zero question on the reservation and never pre-authorizes the SAME credit card.

That's good to know -- thanks for letting us know. I didn't have any DCC problems in Madrid, either: department store machines offered a choice, everyone else just charged EUR. But that was in 2014 so I had been concerned by some of the reports here.

Got back from Malta last week. As far as I can see, there aren't any reports from this country. (For those who have never heard of Malta, it is a beautiful island nation located between Italy and Libya. Ninth smallest country in the world, member of the EU and uses the Euro as a currency. Officially bi-lingual Maltese and English, many Italian speakers and plenty of ex-pats from around Europe.)

Most retailers had two card terminals (even at each supermarket checkout). One from Bank of Valletta (BOV) and one from Global Payments (HSBC). For local debit cards without Visa/Mastercard, they selected the machine based on the card presented. For foreign cards, it seemed to be a mix as to which machine was used. Even visiting the same restaurant on two occassions, I ended up with one BOV receipt and one HSBC receipt.

In terms of DCC, only the HSBC machines offered it. I was offered DCC four times and all the staff were clear and knowledgable about the "service". All offered a choice of Sterling or Euro before entering the PIN. In one store, the cashier even asked about my choice of currency just on sight of my Halifax card - her response was "good choice" when I opted for Euros! Opting out was easy: green to select DCC or red to opt out.

I found this article in a local newspaper to be quite interesting, where DCC is sold as being very beneficial and free of charge to customers: http://www.independent.com.mt/articl...lux-6736136636

What a load of crap.

One of the standout features of our Dynamic Currency Conversion service is that there are no undisclosed fees, so customers will know exactly what they are paying at the point of sale.

Yea, the fee for DCC is "not undisclosed" only if you know that day's actual forex rate between the two currencies, and convert the native amount of the transaction into the other currency yourself and compare that with the DCC offer.

In the United States, as dcc developed first in Ireland and metastasized throughout the torist world, some of the near criminal large banks saw one of their most lucrative fees, the foreign currency exchange fee begin to become less. So their ressponse was to change the fee to a foreign transaction fee. With many of these near criminal banks (Bank of America, citibank, JP Morgan Chase are prime examples), foreign transactions are nailed witn a 3% fee so being dcc'd does not prefvent the imposition of this fee in the slightest.

[QUOTE=BruceyBonus;26538678]

In terms of DCC, only the HSBC machines offered it. I was offered DCC four times and all the staff were clear and knowledgable about the "service". All offered a choice of Sterling or Euro before entering the PIN. In one store, the cashier even asked about my choice of currency just on sight of my Halifax card - her response was "good choice" when I opted for Euros! Opting out was easy: green to select DCC or red to opt out./QUOTE]

Usually the "good choice" is the opposite. :)

Also, the problem with green/red is that a person who is unaware of DCC might think that red will cancel the transaction. The whole thing is setup for you to take the bait, against Visa/MC policy.

I'm just curious about the editorial policy of that newspaper. Next time I have to run some propaganda piece for Our Dear Leader or need some supposedly disinterested English-language mouthpiece to extol the virtues of Chinese rule over Tibet I know who to call. Probably cheaper than hiring black hats to hack BBC.

LOL!

Exactly.

I was recently in Hong Kong for a holiday and used my Visa for 9 transactions (most of them card-present ones) and saw that 8 transactions that has posted are in HKD.

At one of the merchants (Admiralty MTR to purchase Disneyland and Oceanpark tickets), I had a bit of a scare when the sales clerk passed me a slip to indicate HKD/SGD and I ticked HKD. While the final slip given to me indicated I was charged in HKD, it was an offline transaction, and I received a sms notification from my bank that I was charged in SGD (about SGD2 more after accounting for the foreign transaction fee on my card). Subsequently I was relieved that the charge posted in HKD.

At another restaurant in IFC, my friend was presented with the credit card machine, and asked to press the green button to be charged in SGD and red for HKD. Very counter-intuitive, but at least the restaurant and machines were DCC-compliant. For the other transactions, the sales clerks generally charged HKD without asking.

1) This is consistent behavior for many cases of DCC. The preauth/pending transaction will be DCC with the DCC amount, but the posted amount will be in local currency. I'm glad everything worked out in your case.

2) Which restaurant was this? When percysmith and I were at Greyhound Cafe 18 months ago, they definitely weren't compliant, at least at the Cityplaza location.

I just returned from a 4-day, 3-night trip to the UK, and I'm happy to say I only encountered DCC at the two Marriott properties where I stayed. At each location, I was able to opt-out without hassle, and the reception knew exactly what to do. The full list of card transactions:

Non-DCC Transactions:

• Travelex ATM with Fidelity Visa at LHR (surprised this didn't offer DCC!)
• Heathrow Express
• Nando's
• Fortnum & Mason
• McDonald's
• National Express Ticket Kiosk (for the Hotel Hoppa at the London Heathrow Marriott)

DCC Transactions (both opted out):

• Grosvenor House (Barclay's terminal that presented an offer of 2.99%; press OK for USD, cancel for GBP)
• London Heathrow Marriott (was not in a position to see the terminal, but assume it is the same acquirer as Grosvenor House since the receipt is the same)

In the case of the LHR Marriott, the receptionist asked the gentleman after me about currency choice to which the gentleman replied "pounds, please". Whether or not that was in response to my proactive announcement about my currency preference, I won't know. However, I was unknowingly hit with DCC at this very location in November 2011. This was the last time I ever let it happen to me once I became aware of DCC.

In the case of both hotel receipts, the credit card terminal receipts printed without the DCC verbiage and clearly indicated that the account will be debit in GBP.

On a related note, the Travelex ATM receipt specifically said, "The exchange rate and authorised amount will be determined by your issuer." That's the way I like it. :D

Guys, remember we talked about a ICBC credit card that has 10 currencies?

Got one and played with it in Japan.

It is really helpful that when you want to actually charge something using the local currency and let the transaction post to your account in local currency, this is the one. The benefits might be that you have cash of various currencies so you can pay the credit card using various currencies instead of letting the bank convert everything into one currency, or you've been playing the FX game and are good at preparing foreign currency in advance and catch a good rate.

However, at InterContinental Tokyo Bay, the POS did recognized that my card's primary currency is CNY. It gave me the prompt of asking for a pick between JPY and CNY.

OK, now I'm guessing the card is just like a ordinary VISA card with CNY being its currency, to some extent. However, the card is different that other currencies can post natively through VISA's system, as I'm 100% sure that it is NOT like VISA convert JPY to CNY and then ICBC convert it back to JPY and post to your account. It is actually JPY all the way through VISA's system into ICBC's system. If this is a regular credit card, VISA would definitely have to convert JPY into whatever the card's only currency is using VISA's rate, and there is nothing the bank can do to prevent this OTHER THAN making the card capable of charging JPY directly in the VISA's system.

Therefore, I'm guessing it is prone to DCC if the POS really wants to do some dirty stuff. I'm still curious to see whether Tax Refund can be process natively without any conversion on VISA's part.

My understanding of the process without DCC:
POS) Do you take JPY?
VISA) YES
POS) Charge 10000 JPY to card XXX

With DCC:
POS) What's your primary currency?
VISA) CNY
POS) (DCC stuff...)

I thought each card contains information on its "native" currency and can only have one?

Imagine those who got this for its intended purpose only to get hit with DCC in other countries. :o

Hi Majuki, this was at the Tasty's Congee and Wonton Noodle Restaurant at IFC Level 3. When my friend paid at the counter, the sales clerk turned the machine over and asked him to press green for SGD and red for HKD. The second time round we went there, the waitstaff brought the checkbook, and the charge was processed in HKD without us specifying. I guess the location has lots of travelers traffic (its above the in-town check-in) so the restaurant is aware of DCC complaints?

That's what I'm guessing, that the card has ONE native currency.

However, if VISA doesn't know this card can charge in ten different currencies, VISA itself would do the conversion and post to ICBC using CNY only.

Now, it is certainly not the case. When you use those 10 currencies, charges are without conversions. When using other currencies, VISA would convert those into CNY or USD since I haven't tried that feature yet.

Therefore, it's not a multi native currency card, but definitely a multi currency card.

Be very careful when paying Paypal in mobile mode
 

I got hit. I can't find I was asked to pay in HKD anywhere so I'm charging this back

Attachment 9487

Attachment 9488

Attachment 9489

Attachment 9490

May 01, 2016 May 03, 2106 PAYPAL *SALAPAY TH 6683532xxxx HK 7742342612261xxxxxxxxxx HKD 252.90

When you chargeback a DCC transaction and the currency conversion rate goes up in the meantime, do you get charged the conversion rate that you would have had on the day of purchase? Or do you get charged the new higher conversion rate?

If it is #2, then what is the point of chargingback a DCC?

It's certainly happened. When I used mine in Austria, shops that could DCC would always ask if I wanted to be charged in US$ even though euros are one of the 10 currencies supported (and I can pay that euro balance in US$ for less than 0.2% spread).


The one time I actually got taken was VAT refund after a summer trip/exchange program to Europe. I presented my ICBC card because it natively supported euros and pounds. Global Blue refunded me in US$ minus their spread. Don't know who to blame for that one, though.

This is not so much DCC but Global Blue taking maximum advantage of multi-currency processing http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...hp?id=6982&p=3 #21