For Chase, I found you can send a Secure Message and attach documents instead of faxing. So it's a little easier.

Has Chase gotten better since your first chargeback experience? I remember it finally ended well, but it took a few calls to get to someone who understood the situation after your DCC at Greyhound.

My experience for charge back last time for What the Pho was better, as I didn't have to explain things. It was during this charge back that I found the attach capability via secure message.

Way back at post 2, JEFFJAGUAR wrote:

It is wordsmithing like this that keeps FT on the cutting edge of travel forums!

It's been much slower in other countries. Almost all companies in the USA would process financial transactions there. There are significant exceptions elsewhere, which is why banks have been slower to introduce it.

I mentioned the situation in Australia previously ...
Amex Australia still has a "Currency Conversion Fee", not an FTF.

List of DCC Prevalence by Country
 

Is there a comprehensive list of DCC prevalence by country somewhere? I'm picturing something that has the country, how commonly DCC is encountered there and particular issues to watch out for. I've seen lists of some top offenders, but not a comprehensive list.

Not comprehensive, but the wiki on the top of this thread has pretty detailed DCC descriptions by country.

Welcome to the posting world of FlyerTalk, by the way! ^

Do you mean the list labeled "Disabling DCC in..."? I was thinking a more comprehensive list would be helpful as there is evidently wide ranging variation. I'm in Eastern Europe and DCC is pushed heavily in Poland, present but easily avoided in Ukraine and not encountered in Belarus or Lithuania (in my limited experience).

I suppose I can update the wiki with such info myself, after another 88 posts....

If you have information to share about these countries I can update the wiki. I've read that Poland is a huge problem with deceptive cashiers who are well aware of the scam.

Sorry to dig up an old post, and from a predecessor thread at that.

But has anyone has any more recent experience? Moondog was DCCed last night by DCC terminal in Shanghai, and it got a bit socially awkward.

I'm not banning PRC on spec but I really have been doing China much much less in favour of Thailand and (more recently) Japan, where I haven't gotten DCCed even tho I communicate with sign language half the time. The heat, exchange rate, lack of promo deals and Air Flow Control doesn't help.

Still like to keep an eye on things in SH in preparation of if (when) it's cool enough and good enough to return to SH for weekend.

The girl walked out on me for being mean to the waitress, and fighting over $5; the system makes guys like us look like losers.

After the girl dumped me, I pulled out 10,000 from the ATM.

I will not repeat my mistake; let's solve HSBC in China!

What I don't understand is that nobody would stand for getting shortchanged/overcharged had you paid in cash. For instance, had you gotten billed for $100 and then the waitress comes back and tries to charge you $105 most people would try to fight the charge. Likewise, when a store tries to give less change than what is expected, people tend to fight it rather than considering the situation a writeoff.

That being said, I have strategically used American Express and/or cash to avoid a DCC fight at the dinner table.

That's what I've been doing in DCC "active" areas/countries: Amex or Cash.

Till Visa and MC fix their problem, they're not getting their share of the cake, as easy as that.

We recently spent three weeks in Japan, including places that attract a lot of tourists, and only saw DCC twice (in two hotels). In both cases there were notices on display that 'explained' DCC without mentioning that it costs the customer money, but in neither hotel did the staff try to push it or trick us.

Typical Japanese honesty~

I found Japan to be a very good place for tourists, including how well it controls DCC.

Bank of China publishes non-compliant instructions to merchants:
 

http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...p?id=11430&p=6
http://wenku.baidu.com/view/5c97658a...87732132e.html

Translated: 1. With regard to foreign currency-denominated Visa/Mastercard, after completing authorisation, when directly charging the card, please directly swipe or insert (if chip) the card into the POS/BMP

2. If no selection is made or yes is selected, DCC functionality is confirmed.

3. Print merchant slip and match cardholder signature.

4. If cardholder has questions about DCC, please show Bank of China explanation on these services (see attachment 1).

5. If cardholder refuses DCC services, merchant cashier can directly cancel the transaction in the POS/BMP. Then run the same transaction again using the same authorisation code and non-DCC for same [RMB] amount, and verify cardholder signature.

6. If cardholder has complaint after returning to their home country, merchant cashier can notify Bank of China related contact and change the DCC transaction into non-DCC.

Translated: Bank of China recommends: merchant cashiers directly use DCC without asking selection from cardholder for every transaction. To date, 90% of overseas cardholders are willing to accept DCC. If there are exceptions, please respond using relevant instructions.

The bolded parts are non-compliant with VIOR and the MC Chargeback Guide. I'll write to both Visa Asia-Pacific and Mastercard International here in HK asking for them to verify a.) whether these are genuine instructions issued by Bank of China and b.) if genuine Visa Asia-Pacific or Mastercard International should ask BoC to withdraw these instructions immediately.

Not optimistic they will do it. Any other ideas?

Also:

Translated: To merchants, DCC provides a more certain exchange rate. To overseas cardholders, it offers value-added services, [whilst] retaining previous settlement options, namely using RMB for settlement. Also, DCC can save merchant swipe fees, being 50% less than the non-DCC fee.

.....
But not actionable.

Wow, the temerity they have for completely and willfully ignoring the regulations around DCC is amazing!

It should default to NO unless one's home currency is specifically selected!

Sent the letters:

http://www.hongkongcard.com/webedito...3434_10595.jpg

http://www.hongkongcard.com/webedito...3450_41927.jpg

http://www.hongkongcard.com/webedito...3403_52164.jpg

http://www.hongkongcard.com/webedito...3419_82266.jpg

You're a good man, Charlie Brown.

With regard to Shanghai, my two primary cards are Bocom dual currency and my corporate Amex, so I haven't encountered DCC as an issue. In the cases where I've used my CSP (usually restaurants or hotels), I try to watch carefully for it on the receipt and whatnot, and I recall only seeing it a handful of times.

Shanghai honestly isn't so bad these days because many of the larger acquirers are now compliant (and 交行/国行 have a small footprint here), but if you chance upon HSBC, prepare for a battle (HSBC is small but its niche happens to be merchants that we foreigners frequent).

At the Stedelijk Museum in Amsterdam today the terminal required me to choose between Euros (shown first) and my card currency (shown second). It showed the precise amounts that would be charged in each case: 20.00 EUR or 22.31 USD (in other words only around 1% markup). I had to select "1" or "2" -- no confusing yes/cancel nonsense.

I'd still very much prefer an end to DCC, but if it's going to be offered then this was almost as transparent as it can get. (For maximum points they'd need to spell out the markup.)

I don't have specific directions for disabling DCC to add to the wiki at this point. In addition to the general info I already shared I can say Latvia also doesn't seem to have DCC, or at least it's not widespread. As to Poland, it's pervasive and I encountered situations where staff were clearly trained to select it even if customers preemptively requested the charge in local currency. Further, terminals (supermarkets, etc) defaulted to DCC and required selecting the cancel button to get the local currency (giving the impression you're canceling the transaction). In at least one instance I was then required to confirm my decision, again by selecting the red cancel button. I noticed most/all of these transactions were processed by PolCard and I'm considering sending them a letter.

Question: how much control do individual banks have over this situation? Can Chase unilaterally end DCC with their cards? I'm trying to think through how to lobby for reform and it seems like one challenge is that it's unclear which entities (banks, visa/MC, individual countries) are the best hope for eliminating or at least improving it.

My ICBC Visa card doesn't suffer DCC, so there's definitely a way to do it. However, until I get somewhere I can get an IC card reader I have no idea what they did.

I have visited Poland twice in recent years and always had good experiences. On the first visit I was using a contactless card and was never offered DCC. All transactions charged in PLN. Second time with a chipped card but no contactless. After a few odd looks from cashiers (contactless and EMV were introduced at the same time in Poland, so all their cards are contactless if they have a chip) I was only ever offered DCC in Carrefour. The machine had the confusing press Cancel to charge in PLN type of system. But at least this message appeared in English automatically. Nowhere else, including transport and hotels, were I offered DCC.

When you get here we'll look. I'm guessing no currency code.

Contactless will prevent DCC because contactless doesn't support DCC.

Not exactly:

http://i.imgur.com/iCPw1pJ.png?1

(although maybe Visa Europe explicitly prohibits it?)

Sorry, VEPS prohibits DCC. I'm assuming most payWave transactions use VEPS.

If anyone's curious, I bumped into something kind of strange in Romania these past couple of weeks.

Euronet ATMs here have large signs "offering" you transactions processed in your home currency. I need to try with a couple more cards, but it only asked me if I wanted to run it in USD (at 3.6RON/USD when the rate is actually 3.97RON/USD, so a commission of a little less than 10%) when I did a cash advance on my Barclaycard Ring, not my Schwab debit card. I'd need to try again with my TD debit card to see if it's unique to the Schwab card or if the machine only offers DCC to MasterCard, but there it is.

DCC on a credit card cash advance but not for an actual ATM debit withdrawal itself?

So that might explain why Barclay's ATMs here offer to DCC my CapitalOne 360 card but not my Schwab card! Unless the Schwab card is somehow DCC-immune.

Note - different ATM locations and I thought that was the reason, but maybe not now.

It doesn't make any sense why DCC would be offered for MC but not Visa. That being said, I've never seen an ATM DCC offer for my Fidelity Cash Management Account Visa.

I tried again with a variety of cards. It won't DCC for any kind of Visa card, credit or debit. MasterCard and Maestro are both affected.

Worse, it gave me a DCC offer for my Canadian Maestro debit card... In USD. Because I totally want to pay the Euronet commission and my bank's foreign currency transaction fee.

Another Indian case - HK$182.40 was charged. Probably like my Maldives transaction - unless you've got a good supervisor, there's no way to avoid DCC.

http://www.hongkongcard.com/forum/fo...p?id=12272&p=6 #53

http://www.hongkongcard.com/webedito...2547_56638.png

Well, I guess that's a really easy one to dispute?

I just got back from a trip to India. DCC has gone out of control. Marriott hotel insisted only DCC. Only when I threatened this s my last stay there and I would complain to Marriott USA, then the guy brought out an old terminal for processing non DCC. He told me that IDBI bank has INSISTED all transactions MUST be DCC by default. I also stayed at two Hilton hotels. Their defaultLt is DCC. but if you request no DCC prior to paying, they happily do a non DCC transaction. I recommend including India in the high risk countries because banks are now actively giving instructions for no choice to customer and there is sharing of the spoils between bank and merchants.

Not at all. Notice there is no signature field for this slip. These merchants just throw the checked box receipt and print another receipt with no check box. The fraud is done in a very clever way.


I stayed at ITC Maurya in New Delhi. They have separate signature slip and separate slip for DCC that allows them to file signature slip and a freshly printed non check box DCC after you leave. Again culprit is IDBI.

Don't think so - don't Indian merchants have to have a signed copy of the slip? Otherwise the chargeback can be more easily pursued - not properly authorised.

The cardholder of the slip in #1996 should've taken a photo of the merchant slip not the cardholder slip.