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FlyerTalk Forums (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/index.php)
-   Credit Card Programs (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/credit-card-programs-599/)
-   -   Life span of a "Hard Pull" (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/credit-card-programs/1445671-life-span-hard-pull.html)

wastedwords Mar 20, 2013 2:44 pm
Whether or not the inquiry is on your report, they can still see the accounts you have currently, their credit limits, and the date each account was created. I don't see why the "hard pulls" are so important.

I'm a programmer, so it just makes sense to me that they'd be able to chomp on that data and figure it out for themselves.

I wonder if some credit algorithms are already advanced enough to ignore the inquiries physically listed on the report and instead infer the actual number of inquiries based on your accounts and account age.

isle-hawg Mar 20, 2013 4:00 pm
Originally Posted by UnitedFlyGuy (Post 20377864)
Stays on the report for 2 years but stops factoring into credit score after 1.
Experian factors it in for the full 2 years according to my Experian "Plus" score monitoring service.

Calipso Mar 20, 2013 5:14 pm
Originally Posted by iliopsoas (Post 20449818)
Are you sure about that? I just bumped a bunch of inquiries off my EQ and TU reports recently.
It's been written many times that attempting to B* will work temporarily and after a while the inquiries have re-appeared weeks or months later.

Google it on flyertalk.

I'm currently at:
EX: 12
EQ: 1 (Few more days for it to fall off)
TU: 6

Successfully using B* on TU hasn't worked for many for quite some time. Also, there are ways of triggering the INQ's back on to Equifax as well.

Originally Posted by wastedwords (Post 20453727)
Whether or not the inquiry is on your report, they can still see the accounts you have currently, their credit limits, and the date each account was created. I don't see why the "hard pulls" are so important.

I'm a programmer, so it just makes sense to me that they'd be able to chomp on that data and figure it out for themselves.

I wonder if some credit algorithms are already advanced enough to ignore the inquiries physically listed on the report and instead infer the actual number of inquiries based on your accounts and account age.
Irrelevant. A credit writer can see that stuff and make those conclusions, but during the initial application process if you are granted a credit card without having to talk to a rep (or credit writer) or recon for one.....they will never be the wiser.

I have been using EQ inquiries for credit line increases and new chase cards. Bumped the INQ's off and gotten new cards during my "clean" report period.

wastedwords Mar 20, 2013 10:00 pm
Originally Posted by Calipso (Post 20454487)
Irrelevant. A credit writer can see that stuff and make those conclusions, but during the initial application process if you are granted a credit card without having to talk to a rep (or credit writer) or recon for one.....they will never be the wiser.

I have been using EQ inquiries for credit line increases and new chase cards. Bumped the INQ's off and gotten new cards during my "clean" report period.
I'm not saying that B* doesn't work in real world situations. Obviously from your experience and others, it must be useful. But the whole process just doesn't make sense to me from a data standpoint. The data is all there in the credit report. I don't understand why they have to rely on an inquiry value to compute credit worthiness. Maybe they need to hire better programmers.

Calipso Mar 21, 2013 2:55 pm
Originally Posted by wastedwords (Post 20455766)
I'm not saying that B* doesn't work in real world situations. Obviously from your experience and others, it must be useful. But the whole process just doesn't make sense to me from a data standpoint. The data is all there in the credit report. I don't understand why they have to rely on an inquiry value to compute credit worthiness. Maybe they need to hire better programmers.
They are going to have to. Equifax has been trying to kill B* for years and put out many speed bumps to slow it down.

I'm rather surprised creditors haven't done the same thing. Easiest way would be to look at new accounts and AAoA. But if you think about it, how can the company determine if these new accounts didn't come from credit pulls with Experian and Transunion?

My AAoA took a huge beating in 2012 with all the credit cards I app'd and got. Backdating by AMEX certainly helped a little. I'm at one inquiry and pulling every day to get it off.

Mile-a-holic Mar 21, 2013 3:04 pm
Originally Posted by g8trgr8t (Post 20449702)
USAA now ony allows one credit report a month, FYI. So, can't do daily pulls.

robertw477 Mar 21, 2013 8:57 pm
Originally Posted by Mile-a-holic (Post 20459691)
USAA now ony allows one credit report a month, FYI. So, can't do daily pulls.
I hear if you call them and mention you want unlimited pulls, they have a product for that even though it doesnt show online. Havent tried but that is what I hear.

oceandreamer Mar 21, 2013 9:55 pm
Originally Posted by robertw477 (Post 20461314)
I hear if you call them and mention you want unlimited pulls, they have a product for that even though it doesnt show online. Havent tried but that is what I hear.
Their deal works about the same as Amex Credit Secure. Basic 1-3x per month product, but you can upgrade it to unlimited pulls for @ double the price. I have the unlimited USAA puller still. When I called to cancel when they changed to 1x monthly late last year, they offered me 6 months unlimited pulling at the 1x pull price. After 6 months, it basically doubles in price.

oceandreamer Mar 21, 2013 9:56 pm
Originally Posted by isle-hawg (Post 20454116)
Experian factors it in for the full 2 years according to my Experian "Plus" score monitoring service.
True, but FAKO scores are for entertainment purposes only. :D FICO is what matters, and after 1 year, the inquiry is completely ignored for scoring purposes.

Calipso Mar 23, 2013 4:55 pm
Originally Posted by Mile-a-holic (Post 20459691)
USAA now ony allows one credit report a month, FYI. So, can't do daily pulls.
Congratulations on being WRONG.

I pull daily with USAA.

You may be thinking about American Express's credit puller which used to be daily then turned into 3 times per month.

Report Type Order Date Expiration Date
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/22/2013 4/21/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/21/2013 4/20/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/20/2013 4/19/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/19/2013 4/18/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/18/2013 4/17/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/17/2013 4/16/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/16/2013 4/15/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/15/2013 4/14/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/14/2013 4/13/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/13/2013 4/12/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/12/2013 4/11/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/11/2013 4/10/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/10/2013 4/9/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/9/2013 4/8/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/8/2013 4/7/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/7/2013 4/6/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/6/2013 4/5/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/5/2013 4/4/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/4/2013 4/3/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/3/2013 4/2/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/2/2013 4/1/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/1/2013 3/31/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 2/28/2013 3/30/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 2/27/2013 3/29/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 2/26/2013 3/28/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 2/25/2013 3/27/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 2/24/2013 3/26/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 2/23/2013 3/25/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 2/22/2013 3/24/2013

Originally Posted by oceandreamer (Post 20461579)
Their deal works about the same as Amex Credit Secure. Basic 1-3x per month product, but you can upgrade it to unlimited pulls for @ double the price. I have the unlimited USAA puller still. When I called to cancel when they changed to 1x monthly late last year, they offered me 6 months unlimited pulling at the 1x pull price. After 6 months, it basically doubles in price.
^^^ This

I called to cancel USAA because they changed the product. They offered me daily pulls for the same price I was paying before.

Mile-a-holic Mar 26, 2013 6:47 pm
Originally Posted by Calipso (Post 20470906)
Congratulations on being WRONG.

I pull daily with USAA.

You may be thinking about American Express's credit puller which used to be daily then turned into 3 times per month.

Report Type Order Date Expiration Date
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/22/2013 4/21/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/21/2013 4/20/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/20/2013 4/19/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/19/2013 4/18/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/18/2013 4/17/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/17/2013 4/16/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/16/2013 4/15/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/15/2013 4/14/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/14/2013 4/13/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/13/2013 4/12/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/12/2013 4/11/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/11/2013 4/10/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/10/2013 4/9/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/9/2013 4/8/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/8/2013 4/7/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/7/2013 4/6/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/6/2013 4/5/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/5/2013 4/4/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/4/2013 4/3/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/3/2013 4/2/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/2/2013 4/1/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 3/1/2013 3/31/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 2/28/2013 3/30/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 2/27/2013 3/29/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 2/26/2013 3/28/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 2/25/2013 3/27/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 2/24/2013 3/26/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 2/23/2013 3/25/2013
3B Report w/3B Scr/Analysis/Fct 2/22/2013 3/24/2013



^^^ This

I called to cancel USAA because they changed the product. They offered me daily pulls for the same price I was paying before.
Good to know, but what they offer new customers is 1x month. Not sure what new customers can get?

wastedwords Mar 26, 2013 9:17 pm
Originally Posted by Mile-a-holic (Post 20488407)
Good to know, but what they offer new customers is 1x month. Not sure what new customers can get?
Yeah...I'm wondering, does "I heard this guy on Flyertalk was offered daily pulls" work when you are signing up?

sosabe77 Mar 27, 2013 4:25 am
24 months, impact diminishes as time goes on, no impact on score after 12 months, but a creditor may still look at the amount of inquiries in order to assess your credit worthiness.

Mile-a-holic Mar 27, 2013 6:24 am
Originally Posted by wastedwords (Post 20489115)
Yeah...I'm wondering, does "I heard this guy on Flyertalk was offered daily pulls" work when you are signing up?
LOL...I'd suggest saying that you've had your identity compromised/potentially compromised/whatever is reasonable, and want to be able to check more frequently. That other services offer more frequent pulls, and can USAA match? As always, call back if you don't llike the answer that you get.

My point is simply that the *standard* offer is no longer daily pulls. You might be able to get daily, but it's going to take some work and may not work for new accounts.

silver6054 Mar 27, 2013 10:51 pm
Originally Posted by wastedwords (Post 20453727)
Whether or not the inquiry is on your report, they can still see the accounts you have currently, their credit limits, and the date each account was created. I don't see why the "hard pulls" are so important.

I'm a programmer, so it just makes sense to me that they'd be able to chomp on that data and figure it out for themselves.

I wonder if some credit algorithms are already advanced enough to ignore the inquiries physically listed on the report and instead infer the actual number of inquiries based on your accounts and account age.
This would miss one critical use case: unsuccessful applications for credit. One potential "bad" sign is multiple applications for credit in a short period of time (for real, rather than FT's AORs!) As these don't lead to accounts, looking just at accounts doesn't give the needed info,


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