Jiangsu

Hi all, I have a question about the chip/pin on credit cards and other debit cards. Why chip makes a credit card safer? Both cards with chips or without chips required pin number when make a purchase, so why simply embed a chip on the card makes it safe?

Now, many credit cards have chip embedded, and I called my banks and required them to replace my existing cards with chip/pin embedded, I did this because it looks safe.

Why the new designed credit cards with chip are safer than other cards without safer?

mia

Chip and PIN is a more secure way for ... consumers to use their credit and debit cards. It combines two effective security features. The first is a microchip on cards that stores card data more securely than a magnetic stripe and is therefore much harder to counterfeit (clone) or skim.

http://www.cardwatch.org.uk/faqs.asp...e=Chip_And_Pin

MrClean

more specifically, I suppose it would be much less difficult to clone a magnetic strip containing 1's and 0's as opposed to a piece of hardware circuitry (chip). Cloning the magnetic strip needs only a cheap scanner and a card with a strip to copy it to. I can't even imagine what it would take to duplicate a chip ... or to even reprogram an existing chip.

rusty0412

Well, the chip is simply a passive RFID... If you send it the correct signal, you will be able to read the information from the signal sent back... The signal would get processed to read 1s and 0s just as a magnetic strip... This is basic electrical engineering.... I could see it using some type of encryption. However, because the chip is only powered by electromagnetic signals, the encryption is weak. A determined person could duplicate your chip. I'd could see that it is a little bit safer than credit cards, but it is not necessarily because 'its harder to duplicate a chip'.... you don't need to... you just need the signal from the chip...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio-f...identification

MrClean

hmmm, I dont see how the chip electronic info by itself would be useable. I would think you'd have to get the info into a card with a chip somehow. unless your talking about online fraud using only the cc number and sec code, in which case it would, of course, be easier to just read it off the card by sight.

mia

Jiangsu is asking about the type of chip used in Chip & PIN payment cards which are common in Europe and coming now to Canada. These are not RFID chips. The smartcard must be physically inserted in the reader, and the card draws power from it.

rusty0412

Sorry, I thought it was the recent credit cards that feature "expresspay" in the US

Jiangsu

I am now living in Boston and Rodhen Island, and travel back to PVG very often, I got an account from Wells Fargo, and HSBC Premier, but the HSBC Premier commerical shows the debit cards with chip embedded, but mine does not, so I called them asking for replacement.

RBC and TD issue cards with chips embedded, but customers have to require.

mia

I assume you are referring to this card, issued by HSBC in Canada:

http://www.hsbc.ca/1/2/en/personal/c...rds/chip/debit

You will not see such cards on the HSBC USA site, or any other USA bank site.

Extensive discussion here:

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/other...-chip-pin.html

Jiangsu

Thanks for the very useful info, but I am not referring to the Canadian HSBC cards. I am openning a China HSBC Premier card, so I will get a HSBC Premier client card without chip embedded. When I travel to US next time, I can request a US HSBC Premier MasterCard, that's what the customer manager told me in Shanghai.

I see HSBC quite a world bank. Good for people who travel around.

I am closing my Canadian bank accounts and only leave my Amex Card open. The good thing with HSBC Premier is, my home bank account will support my credit history in any other country. ^ I don't even need to building a new credit in the new country before I can get my first credit card. Any good thing is, there's no service charge for foreign currency purchase made on my card, and the foreign exchange rate is good too. Plus, very convinient to tranfer funds into different country.

Sanosuke

Already here in Canada. Visa has issued them to users like myself.

Sanosuke!

Sanosuke

Chip + PIN cards aren't RFID dependent.

Please look at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chip_and_PIN

Sanosuke!

boxedlunch

Looks like the chip + pin aren't so safe + secure after all. Check out this youtube video to see how some college researchers broke the code...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JPAX32lgkrw

mia

Mentioned in primary thread...

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/other...-chip-pin.html

scubadiver

The scary part about crackable chip+pin or RFID is "non-repudiation." Your card was used, your pin was used. It must have been you. Or pay big $$ to a shyster to prove it wasn't you.

If making counterfiting hard would stop counterfiting, then there would be no counterfit money. What happens if you accept counterfit money? You're screwed. Now, what happens is someone counterfits you passport or credit-card?