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Paris Orly Flights from USA?

Paris Orly Flights from USA?

Old Jul 17, 20, 2:21 pm
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Paris Orly Flights from USA?

I am dual US-EU citizen and need to go to france for personal reasons (residence is in USA, cannot show an EU residence, only an EU passport), but none that would count as essential travel. Has anyone done this recently on an arriving flight from the US? What questions and paperwork were you asked? Also any issue travelling within the EU via airplane or train from France?
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Old Jul 17, 20, 4:21 pm
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With a EU passport, you should be able to come to France (I think). Also, and even if it is a detail, the thread title says "Paris Orly flights from USA" : there are no US flights at the moment in ORY. They are all in CDG.
You can check the conditions for France on this site
https://www.iatatravelcentre.com/int...1580226297.htm

Note that the quarantine mentioned is a voluntary one (no obligation).

You will need the "completed International Travel Certificate must be presented prior to boarding and to Immigration upon arrival or when transiting France. The certificate must be obtained before departure via the French consular offices abroad or online at https://www.interieur.gouv.fr." and the statement about lack of covid symptoms.

Last edited by Goldorak; Jul 17, 20 at 4:28 pm
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Old Jul 17, 20, 4:28 pm
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Originally Posted by AIflyer View Post
Also any issue travelling within the EU via airplane or train from France?
No issue at the moment with most member states, but some conditions (forms, etc) may apply and there are still a few restrictions in place.
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Old Jul 17, 20, 7:46 pm
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Yes ok I am looking at August flights when there will be USA to Orly flights. Ok so the 14 day quantine is voluntary - not mandatory like the UK.

It does state however that travel of EU citizens is only allowed if they are in transit to the country of their EU citizenship. I wonder how or if this is being enforced? Are onward flights checked at customs? It looks like there is a bigloophole that allows EU passport holders into the EU with little oversight.

"European Union citizens and citizens of Andorra, the United Kingdom, Iceland, Liechtenstein, Monaco, Norway, San Marino, Switzerland and the Vatican, with their main residence in France or travelling to the country in which they are a citizen or resident by transiting through France, as well as their partner and children"

Have any dual US EU passport holders done a quick hop across the pond recently? Any issues?
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Old Jul 17, 20, 8:45 pm
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Originally Posted by AIflyer View Post
Yes ok I am looking at August flights when there will be USA to Orly flights. Ok so the 14 day quantine is voluntary - not mandatory like the UK.

It does state however that travel of EU citizens is only allowed if they are in transit to the country of their EU citizenship. I wonder how or if this is being enforced? Are onward flights checked at customs? It looks like there is a bigloophole that allows EU passport holders into the EU with little oversight.

"European Union citizens and citizens of Andorra, the United Kingdom, Iceland, Liechtenstein, Monaco, Norway, San Marino, Switzerland and the Vatican, with their main residence in France or travelling to the country in which they are a citizen or resident by transiting through France, as well as their partner and children"

Have any dual US EU passport holders done a quick hop across the pond recently? Any issues?
Where did you see that (the bolded part), that's not what on the Timatic coronavirus site right now for France, it says that French nationals can enter. This is what Timatic says for France:
France
Published 03.07.2020
1. Passengers are not allowed to enter.
- This does not apply to:
- nationals of France, their spouses and children;
- nationals of Andorra, Monaco, San Marino, Switzerland, Vatican City (Holy See) and an EEA Member State, their spouses and children;
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Old Jul 18, 20, 2:52 am
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Originally Posted by AIflyer View Post
It does state however that travel of EU citizens is only allowed if they are in transit to the country of their EU citizenship. I wonder how or if this is being enforced? Are onward flights checked at customs? It looks like there is a bigloophole that allows EU passport holders into the EU with little oversight.

"European Union citizens and citizens of Andorra, the United Kingdom, Iceland, Liechtenstein, Monaco, Norway, San Marino, Switzerland and the Vatican, with their main residence in France or travelling to the country in which they are a citizen or resident by transiting through France, as well as their partner and children"
I don't see that part that you have copied. Where does it comes from ? From IATA/Timatic for France (I have put in bold the parts that I think are relevant for OP):
https://www.iatatravelcentre.com/int...1580226297.htm

Published 03.07.2020
1. Passengers are not allowed to enter.
- This does not apply to:
- nationals of France, their spouses and children;
- nationals of Andorra, Monaco, San Marino, Switzerland, Vatican City (Holy See) and an EEA Member State, their spouses and children;
- British nationals, their spouses and children;
- passengers arriving from Andorra, Monaco, San Marino, Switzerland, United Kingdom, Vatican City (Holy See) or an EEA Member State;
- passengers arriving from Australia, Canada, Korea Rep., Georgia, Japan, Montenegro, Morocco, New-Zealand, Rwanda, Serbia, Thailand, Tunisia or Uruguay;
- passengers with a residence permit issued by France;
- passengers with a residence permit issued by Andorra, Monaco, San Marino, Switzerland, United Kingdom, Vatican City (Holy See) or an EEA Member State;
- merchant seamen;
- passengers traveling to study.
2. A completed International Travel Certificate must be presented prior to boarding and to Immigration upon arrival or when transiting France. The certificate must be obtained before departure via the French consular offices abroad or online at https://www.interieur.gouv.fr.
- This does not apply to:
- passengers arriving from Andorra, Monaco, San Marino, Switzerland, United Kingdom, Vatican City (Holy See) or an EEA Member State;
- passengers arriving from Australia, Canada, Korea Rep., Georgia, Japan, Montenegro, Morocco, New-Zealand, Rwanda, Serbia, Thailand, Tunisia or Uruguay.
3. Passengers arriving in France:
- are subject to quarantine or isolation; and
- must present a completed declaration on honor to state that they do not have symptoms of Coronavirus (COVID-19). The declaration must be dated with the name and signature of the passenger.
As said before, the quarantine is voluntary, and if done, can be done anywhere (home, hotel, etc).

Originally Posted by AIflyer View Post
Yes ok I am looking at August flights when there will be USA to Orly flights.
Do not count too much on US flights in ORY in august IMHO, but I think that's the least of your concerns. If you really need to come to France, you should book to CDG on a major airline and not on "secondary airlines" that will very likely postpone the resumption of their flights or will go under (I have in mind La Compagnie, Level, etc). AF ORY-JFK flight will not come back before 5 Oct as per the last planning sent. French Bee has just announced their launch of ORY-EWR for mid-august (daily A359) which I find totally crazy unless they want to throw tons of cash through the window. I don't believe a second that it will happen.
To sum up, book to CDG on a major airline. You may face cancellations but there will be plenty of options for rebooking (this will not be the case on secondary airlines).
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Old Jul 18, 20, 3:14 am
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Originally Posted by nk15 View Post
Where did you see that (the bolded part), that's not what on the Timatic coronavirus site right now for France, it says that French nationals can enter. This is what Timatic says for France:
France
Published 03.07.2020
1. Passengers are not allowed to enter.
- This does not apply to:
- nationals of France, their spouses and children;
- nationals of Andorra, Monaco, San Marino, Switzerland, Vatican City (Holy See) and an EEA Member State, their spouses and children;
You quote from Timatic confirms that all EU nationals (not only French) can enter.
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Old Jul 18, 20, 5:59 pm
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Originally Posted by Goldorak View Post


Do not count too much on US flights in ORY in august IMHO, but I think that's the least of your concerns. If you really need to come to France, you should book to CDG on a major airline and not on "secondary airlines" that will very likely postpone the resumption of their flights or will go under (I have in mind La Compagnie, Level, etc). AF ORY-JFK flight will not come back before 5 Oct as per the last planning sent. French Bee has just announced their launch of ORY-EWR for mid-august (daily A359) which I find totally crazy unless they want to throw tons of cash through the window. I don't believe a second that it will happen.
To sum up, book to CDG on a major airline. You may face cancellations but there will be plenty of options for rebooking (this will not be the case on secondary airlines).
Any reason for this? Why is ORY closed but not CDG? I already booked two flights with frenchbee for August and lost them both to cancellations.

I notice that TAP is now flying EWR-ORY from 1st August but with a stop over in Porto. Unfortunately even transiting in portugal requires a negative covid test before you arrive. Does this covid test also apply to people with an EU passport transiting in portugal?
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Old Jul 19, 20, 4:06 am
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Originally Posted by ISTJ View Post
Any reason for this?
tell me to which part of my post your question is referring to ?

Originally Posted by ISTJ View Post
Why is ORY closed but not CDG?
ORY was closed during all the France lockdown and for some weeks after unlocking. Reason was with so low traffic it was making no sense to keep 2 airports open and all operations were in CDG. ORY has reopen end of June, with a much smaller traffic than usual. For instance there is no AF domestic flights at the moment in ORY, except to Corsica. Even CDG is operating with limited terminal open : only 2A-2C / 2F and 2E-K are open. You have the same situation in all multi-terminal airports in Europe

Originally Posted by ISTJ View Post
I notice that TAP is now flying EWR-ORY from 1st August but with a stop over in Porto.
They don't fly EWR-ORY, they fly EWR-OPO with a connection OPO-ORY. Like IB, BA or LH who would propose you to fly Paris to NY via their MAD, LHR or FRA, respectively.

Originally Posted by ISTJ View Post
Unfortunately even transiting in portugal requires a negative covid test before you arrive. Does this covid test also apply to people with an EU passport transiting in portugal?
Not a specialist of that, but I would say that the need for such a test depends more on where you are coming from rather than the passport you have in your pocket.
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Old Jul 19, 20, 10:37 am
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When arriving in France u are required to sign an "International Travel Certificate To Mainland France from a Third Country" declaration which is on the France Interior Ministry Government website. The requirements to enter France from outside the EU are very clear:

This certificate must be presented to transportation companies, before boarding, by passengers travelling to mainland France. It must also be presented to border control authorities.
To be filled in by the traveller:
I, the undersigned,
Ms/Mr:
Born on:
Nationality:
Residing:
Certify that my travel motivations are matching one of the following (check the box):

[ ] French nationals, accompanied by their spouse and children;

[ ] European Union nationals and nationals from Andorra, United Kingdom, Iceland, Liechtenstein, Monaco, Norway, San Marino, Switzerland, and the Holy See, having their primary residence in France or transiting through France to reach their country of origin or where they have their primary residence, accompanied by their spouse and children;

[ ] Third country nationals, who are holders of a French or European residence permit or valid long-stay visa, having their primary residence in France or transiting through France to reach their residence in a country of the European Union or assimilated;

[ ] Third country nationals, transiting less than 24 hours in an international area to reach their country of origin and who are holders of a travel document to this country;

[ ] Diplomatic mission staff, or international organisations staff working in headquarters or offices located in France, accompanied by their spouse and children;

[ ] Healthcare workers supporting the fight against Covid-19;

[ ] Flight and cargo crews, or travelling as a passenger to their departure base;

[ ] Foreign nationals ensuring the international carriage of goods;

[ ] Goods carriers including seamen.
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Old Jul 20, 20, 11:45 am
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Originally Posted by AIflyer View Post
When arriving in France u are required to sign an "International Travel Certificate To Mainland France from a Third Country" declaration which is on the France Interior Ministry Government website. The requirements to enter France from outside the EU are very clear:

This certificate must be presented to transportation companies, before boarding, by passengers travelling to mainland France. It must also be presented to border control authorities.
To be filled in by the traveller:
I, the undersigned,
Ms/Mr:
Born on:
Nationality:
Residing:
Certify that my travel motivations are matching one of the following (check the box):

[ ] French nationals, accompanied by their spouse and children;

[ ] European Union nationals and nationals from Andorra, United Kingdom, Iceland, Liechtenstein, Monaco, Norway, San Marino, Switzerland, and the Holy See, having their primary residence in France or transiting through France to reach their country of origin or where they have their primary residence, accompanied by their spouse and children;

[ ] Third country nationals, who are holders of a French or European residence permit or valid long-stay visa, having their primary residence in France or transiting through France to reach their residence in a country of the European Union or assimilated;

[ ] Third country nationals, transiting less than 24 hours in an international area to reach their country of origin and who are holders of a travel document to this country;

[ ] Diplomatic mission staff, or international organisations staff working in headquarters or offices located in France, accompanied by their spouse and children;

[ ] Healthcare workers supporting the fight against Covid-19;

[ ] Flight and cargo crews, or travelling as a passenger to their departure base;

[ ] Foreign nationals ensuring the international carriage of goods;

[ ] Goods carriers including seamen.
The source of the form above, the "Attestation", is from this French government site:

https://www.interieur.gouv.fr/Actual...t-et-de-voyage

This form has stayed the same since the 20 of May 2020. The page above has a PDF, docx and flat text version in both French and English.

I plan similar travel soon as well--flying from the US via DFW to CDG as a dual national on AA. As an FYI for whoever may read this, there is a bit of a catch-22 with the AA web portal. It requires declaration of nationality along with passport details. I discovered that if I enter my French passport, the AA site automatically assumes I need an ESTA form for the return leg. As a US citizen, I do not have that. So to make the web portal happy, I entered the US passport details and assume I will need to show my French one at the counter prior to receiving a boarding card. I hope that helps someone.
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Old Jul 20, 20, 12:38 pm
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Originally Posted by DrOFlyGeek View Post
The source of the form above, the "Attestation", is from this French government site:

https://www.interieur.gouv.fr/Actual...t-et-de-voyage

This form has stayed the same since the 20 of May 2020. The page above has a PDF, docx and flat text version in both French and English.

I plan similar travel soon as well--flying from the US via DFW to CDG as a dual national on AA. As an FYI for whoever may read this, there is a bit of a catch-22 with the AA web portal. It requires declaration of nationality along with passport details. I discovered that if I enter my French passport, the AA site automatically assumes I need an ESTA form for the return leg. As a US citizen, I do not have that. So to make the web portal happy, I entered the US passport details and assume I will need to show my French one at the counter prior to receiving a boarding card. I hope that helps someone.
ESTA is not needed to fly from the US, only needed to the US.
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Old Jul 20, 20, 11:56 pm
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Originally Posted by DrOFlyGeek View Post
I plan similar travel soon as well--flying from the US via DFW to CDG as a dual national on AA. As an FYI for whoever may read this, there is a bit of a catch-22 with the AA web portal. It requires declaration of nationality along with passport details. I discovered that if I enter my French passport, the AA site automatically assumes I need an ESTA form for the return leg. As a US citizen, I do not have that. So to make the web portal happy, I entered the US passport details and assume I will need to show my French one at the counter prior to receiving a boarding card. I hope that helps someone.
Yes so it raises an interesting question about dual passport holders and how to properly exit the USA. Normally you are required to always enter and exit the USA on your US passport however in this situation showing a US passport at check-in and boarding the plane and entering it into the airline booking system will not allow you to take the flight. You will have to travel on and exit the US on the foreign passport.

While there is no official US exit passport check performed by customs or DHS to my knowledge, my understanding is that the airlines do send the passenger manifests to the government (DHS?) and it may potentially raise a red flag somewhere that a pax who never entered the US on a foreign passport has now left or is attempting to leave the country.

Anyone have experience with exiting the US on your non US passport? Any issues?

Last edited by AIflyer; Jul 21, 20 at 12:05 am
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Old Aug 3, 20, 1:24 am
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Originally Posted by Goldorak View Post
Do not count too much on US flights in ORY in august IMHO, but I think that's the least of your concerns. If you really need to come to France, you should book to CDG on a major airline and not on "secondary airlines" that will very likely postpone the resumption of their flights or will go under (I have in mind La Compagnie, Level, etc). AF ORY-JFK flight will not come back before 5 Oct as per the last planning sent. French Bee has just announced their launch of ORY-EWR for mid-august (daily A359) which I find totally crazy unless they want to throw tons of cash through the window. I don't believe a second that it will happen.
To sum up, book to CDG on a major airline. You may face cancellations but there will be plenty of options for rebooking (this will not be the case on secondary airlines).
Originally Posted by ISTJ View Post
Any reason for this? Why is ORY closed but not CDG? I already booked two flights with frenchbee for August and lost them both to cancellations.
As expected, French Bee is postponing ORY-EWR launch to 4 Sept. And I am pretty sure this will be again postponed later.
https://www.routesonline.com/news/38...h-to-sep-2020/
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Old Aug 14, 20, 2:40 pm
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Originally Posted by Goldorak View Post
As expected, French Bee is postponing ORY-EWR launch to 4 Sept. And I am pretty sure this will be again postponed later.
https://www.routesonline.com/news/38...h-to-sep-2020/
And now postponed again to early October
https://www.routesonline.com/news/38...arly-oct-2020/

this is really ridiculous.I donít understand why they donít pull the plug now until next summer. This flight/airline is targeting leisure customers and you donít launch such a route in October, even without the Covid context. Add the Covid to this...​​​​​​​
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