Go Back  FlyerTalk Forums > Miles&Points > Coronavirus and travel
Reload this Page >

Coronavirus and masks/face coverings [Consolidated thread]

Old Jun 24, 20, 6:06 am
FlyerTalk Forums Expert How-Tos and Guides
Last edit by: NewbieRunner
Moderator announcement - June 23, 2020:

Flyertalks moderators generally take a hands-off approach when it comes to judging the accuracy of members statements. While thats fine for travel debates, a pandemic is clearly a more serious issue.

A meta-analysis of 172 studies that looked at various interventions to prevent the transmission of COVID-19, SARS and MERS from an infected person to people close to them, published in The Lancet on June 1, found that mask wearing significantly reduces the risk of viral transmission.

Given the science, the forum moderators are disallowing any further posts that debate whether or not masks should be worn. Posts that do so will be deleted and members subject to discipline.

Please also note, we do not allow posting of conspiracy theories or racist terms used in place of Covid-19, coronavirus, etc.

- Coronavirus and Travel moderator team
Print Wikipost

Coronavirus and masks/face coverings [Consolidated thread]

Old Mar 4, 20, 10:06 pm
  #106  
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: YYC
Programs: BA bronze, Aeroplan peon
Posts: 4,641
Originally Posted by snaxmuppet
I don't expect all loos to have automatic doors but they could make them so they open outwards so you can just push with your shoulders to exit without having to touch the handle.
That's one thing that always catches me when I visit the UK - doors that swing in to open. In Canada all the doors on public buildings ( i.e. not homes) must swing open from the inside out. That's due to fire regulations, so if there is a fire you can push the doors open and keep going. It was changed after a fire in a theatre (I think) and people were crushed against doors that opened inward by the crowd behind. If they open outward people can escape easier.
snaxmuppet likes this.
Jagboi is offline  
Old Mar 4, 20, 11:39 pm
  #107  
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: GLA
Programs: BAEC: Silver. Nothing else as TopCashBack trumps all hotel programs
Posts: 801
Originally Posted by Will100
This whole thing is ridiculous.

If you are old and vulnerable flu is dodgy at any time.

Just travel, live your life and enjoy the sale fares and empty cabins.
Really? Lol.
Well, as should be very clear by now if you read the news. This isn't flu. It's not even an influenza virus.
It's orders of magnitude more dangerous than flu.
​​​​​1 in 5 require hospitalisation and 1 in 30 die.binfact it has the same mortality rate as Spanish Flu, which killed between 50 and 100 million people. So let's not trivialise this.
The situation is very grave and is only getting worse each day. I know this is entirely the wrong forum to hold this opinion but I think doing any unnecessary travel at this point is reckless. You are only help spread the virus to more people that will die because of it. I'm not doing any travel till this is over. One way or another.

Last edited by cupsandsaucers; Mar 4, 20 at 11:49 pm
cupsandsaucers is offline  
Old Mar 4, 20, 11:51 pm
  #108  
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 716
Originally Posted by cupsandsaucers
Really? Lol.
Well, as should be very clear by now if you read the news. This isn't flu. It's not even an influenza virus.
That's correct, it's more like the common cold.

Originally Posted by cupsandsaucers
It's orders of magnitude more dangerous than flu.
Probably not.

Originally Posted by cupsandsaucers
​​​​​1 in 5 require hospitalisation and 1 in 30 die.
Please don't sensationalise. It's very unlikely that either of your stated statistics are accurate in the way you are applying them.

Please learn the distinction between a case and an infected person. Many sources indicate that there are far more infected people than there are cases, because a large proportion of infected people either never have any symptoms or have such minor symptoms that they don't realise it's the same scary virus they read about on the Internet. These people are never counted and thus never become a "case".

Originally Posted by cupsandsaucers
​​​​​The situation is very grave and is only getting worse each day.
I agree, the fear and misinformation (to which you are contributing) are causing vast amounts of needless economic damage, which will lead to significant hardship for vulnerable members of society. I expect this to get much worse before it gets better.
bobbytables is offline  
Old Mar 5, 20, 12:29 am
  #109  
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: London
Programs: BA Gold
Posts: 567
Originally Posted by bobbytables
That's correct, it's more like the common cold.


Probably not.


Please don't sensationalise. It's very unlikely that either of your stated statistics are accurate in the way you are applying them.

Please learn the distinction between a case and an infected person. Many sources indicate that there are far more infected people than there are cases, because a large proportion of infected people either never have any symptoms or have such minor symptoms that they don't realise it's the same scary virus they read about on the Internet. These people are never counted and thus never become a "case".


I agree, the fear and misinformation (to which you are contributing) are causing vast amounts of needless economic damage, which will lead to significant hardship for vulnerable members of society. I expect this to get much worse before it gets better.
Whilsy many of the end is nigh stories in the press are unhelpful, so is the insistence that its all stuff and nonsense. Many of the reports I have read from fit, young people who have recovered do not sound like any cold I have had. I also think it is still too early to make conclusions regarding where we are headed.

Would I wear a mask? No
Has it changed my flying habits ? Yes
Will I keep flying? Yes, for now.
Would I entertain the idea of a TP run or sale fare for the sake of it? No.
lcyguy is offline  
Old Mar 5, 20, 12:34 am
  #110  
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: GLA
Programs: BAEC: Silver. Nothing else as TopCashBack trumps all hotel programs
Posts: 801
Originally Posted by bobbytables
That's correct, it's more like the common cold.


Probably not.


Please don't sensationalise. It's very unlikely that either of your stated statistics are accurate in the way you are applying them.

Please learn the distinction between a case and an infected person. Many sources indicate that there are far more infected people than there are cases, because a large proportion of infected people either never have any symptoms or have such minor symptoms that they don't realise it's the same scary virus they read about on the Internet. These people are never counted and thus never become a "case".


I agree, the fear and misinformation (to which you are contributing) are causing vast amounts of needless economic damage, which will lead to significant hardship for vulnerable members of society. I expect this to get much worse before it gets better.
I am absolutely not spreading misinformation thank you very much. I have merely repeated the facts the WHO have shared. Updated as of yesterday. Fatality rate of 3.4% which is, near as damn 1 in 30. FACT. This includes suspected "cases", as testing is very wide in some places now.
people who are trying to brush this off for the short term effect of their stock portfolio are the ones doing the real damage. This IS very serious.
Some of the myths you are peddling are busted in here - https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/03/yes-worse-than-flu-busting-coronavirus-myths-covid-19
ExplorerWannabe likes this.

Last edited by cupsandsaucers; Mar 5, 20 at 12:43 am
cupsandsaucers is offline  
Old Mar 5, 20, 12:38 am
  #111  
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 716
Originally Posted by cupsandsaucers
I am absolutely not spreading misinformation thank you very much. I have merely repeated the facts the WHO have shared. Updated as of yesterday. Fatality rate of 3.4% which is, near as damn 1 in 30. FACT. This includes suspected "cases", as testing is very wide in some places now.
people who are trying to brush this off for the short term effect of their stock portfolio are the ones doing the real damage. This IS very serious.
I see that the part of my post about the difference between cases and infected people has just flown right over your head...
bobbytables is offline  
Old Mar 5, 20, 12:47 am
  #112  
 
Join Date: Nov 2017
Location: GLA
Programs: BAEC: Silver. Nothing else as TopCashBack trumps all hotel programs
Posts: 801
Originally Posted by bobbytables
I see that the part of my post about the difference between cases and infected people has just flown right over your head...
The WHO address this in their latest update! The 3.4% mortality rate INCLUDES all considered carriers. They have crunched the numbers extensively. But I suppose you know better.

It's very clear to see where this is headed, at least short and medium term, you need only look at Korea and Italy.
California just declared a state of emergency. For goodness sake how long can you pretend that "all is well".
nancypants likes this.
cupsandsaucers is offline  
Old Mar 5, 20, 1:03 am
  #113  
 
Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 716
Originally Posted by cupsandsaucers
The WHO address this in their latest update! The 3.4% mortality rate INCLUDES all considered carriers. They have crunched the numbers extensively. But I suppose you know better.
The latest WHO situation report contains no information on mortality rate whatsoever. The 3.4% that you are quoting comes from a media briefing from the director-general, and the full quote is "Globally, about 3.4% of reported COVID-19 cases have died." Which brings us back to my point about the difference between an infected person and a reported case.

Originally Posted by cupsandsaucers
It's very clear to see where this is headed, at least short and medium term, you need only look at Korea and Italy.
California just declared a state of emergency. For goodness sake how long can you pretend that "all is well".
Please don't use quotation marks for words that you imagined that I said. I firmly believe coronavirus will spread throughout the globe, much as other viruses do every year, and I also believe it will kill a lot of vulnerable people - and a much smaller number of people who weren't considered vulnerable - also as other viruses do every year.

With it being a novel infection, I hope that the measures being taken will slow its spread sufficiently for public health infrastructure to keep up. I also hope that the implementation due to political expediency of unproven and potentially harmful measures that are not recommended by public health experts can be kept to a minimum.

Finally, I believe that the sensationalism and the resulting panic are causing more harm than the virus, and I expect this to get worse. Korea and Italy have got 0.01% and 0.004% of their respective populations as confirmed cases right now, but a much larger percentage of their population engaging in self-harm in the form of panic, driven by sensational news media and online commenters such as yourself.

I'm not encouraging people to ignore the situation, just to try to maintain some balance and be aware of the harmful effect of hysterical words spread widely.
BA235 likes this.
bobbytables is offline  
Old Mar 5, 20, 1:08 am
  #114  
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Vale of Glamorgan
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 2,655
Originally Posted by cupsandsaucers
Updated as of yesterday. Fatality rate of 3.4% which is, near as damn 1 in 30. FACT.
That is the percentage of deaths amongst those who have been identified as having the virus. Many cases will not have been identified, and many of those will recover without even realising they have the virus.

Furthermore, the death rate is not random: those dying tend to be the elderly and infirm. Young and/or heathy people almost all recover, and (as of yesterday) there have been no reported deaths amongst the under-10s.

Of course we should be careful, and not getting the virus is better than getting it, but let's not over-sensationalise the situation.
BA235 and bobbytables like this.
Misco60 is offline  
Old Mar 5, 20, 2:11 am
  #115  
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: KOI
Programs: BA
Posts: 305
Originally Posted by Jagboi
That's one thing that always catches me when I visit the UK - doors that swing in to open. In Canada all the doors on public buildings ( i.e. not homes) must swing open from the inside out. That's due to fire regulations, so if there is a fire you can push the doors open and keep going. It was changed after a fire in a theatre (I think) and people were crushed against doors that opened inward by the crowd behind. If they open outward people can escape easier.
In the UK, fire regulations require non residential buildings with an occupancy factor of over 60 to have doors opening outwards. Residential and low occupancy (i.e. corner shops) public buildings can have doors opening inwards. Doors that swing inwards to open must have a fusible link that will fail under the pressure of pushing outwards to allow the weight of people pushing against them to get out. In all cases, doors are not allowed to open onto a highway (road OR public pavement), so in larger buildings, fire exit doors will be recessed into an alcove so that the swinging door will not smack a passing person or car or run of a burning building only to be flatten by a passing bus.

The interesting thing is, the main door that you enter the building may not be classed as an emergency escape (although in most cases they are), and they can open inwards only. In such cases, look for the green running man sign above the door, if there is non, that door should NOT be used as an emergency escape and there usually will be one (or more) close by, such as to the sides.
alvinlwh is offline  
Old Mar 5, 20, 2:27 am
  #116  
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: KOI
Programs: BA
Posts: 305
Originally Posted by Misco60
That is the percentage of deaths amongst those who have been identified as having the virus. Many cases will not have been identified, and many of those will recover without even realising they have the virus.

Furthermore, the death rate is not random: those dying tend to be the elderly and infirm. Young and/or heathy people almost all recover, and (as of yesterday) there have been no reported deaths amongst the under-10s.

Of course we should be careful, and not getting the virus is better than getting it, but let's not over-sensationalise the situation.
The China doctor who discovered the virus and died seems pretty young at 33. A coworker of his died at 57, still not quite old. Although their deaths could be due to a bullet to the head.

Having came off a 14 days home quarantine order, I can tell you that it was not fun, cabin fever being the main issue. That could be the main issue here instead of the fear of getting the virus. Yesterday, UK reported that it expects 1 out of 5 workers to be off work for the quarantine, and the impact on the economy will be huge.
nancypants likes this.
alvinlwh is offline  
Old Mar 5, 20, 3:02 am
  #117  
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: NT Australia
Programs: QF WP
Posts: 4,008
Originally Posted by alvinlwh
The China doctor who discovered the virus and died seems pretty young at 33. A coworker of his died at 57, still not quite old. Although their deaths could be due to a bullet to the head.

Having came off a 14 days home quarantine order, I can tell you that it was not fun, cabin fever being the main issue. That could be the main issue here instead of the fear of getting the virus. Yesterday, UK reported that it expects 1 out of 5 workers to be off work for the quarantine, and the impact on the economy will be huge.
I had this argument with a coworker the other day. Something like 60% of Chinese doctors smoke so theres a greater than even chance that bloke was a smoker, which puts him in a higher risk category. He could have also had a pre existing condition we didnt know about (Im a similar age and am classified as a risk group for coronavirus due to a pre existing heart condition). Im still not worried for me (medically)
nancypants is offline  
Old Mar 5, 20, 3:03 am
  #118  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Plymouth, UK
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 1,159
For people in the high risk groups (old, diabetes, history of lung issues) this is a very scary situation and it makes me very angry to hear people say we are sensationalising or panicking over CORVID-19. It is not the same as flu or a cold. We have had the flu vaccine and although it is nowhere near 100% preventative it does provide a degree of protection against the predicted strains this winter and as such it is likely to considerably reduce the symptoms if we do get it to the point where it is not going to be a threat to life. CORVID-19 is very different. Yes, it is mild for most people and that fact is very much going against any suggestion that it is serious but for a small group of others it most certainly is. Make no mistake... if my wife gets CORVID-19 there is a real risk the symptoms may threaten her life and that is not sensationalising it... that is the cold, hard facts.

The real scary thing though is that her safety does not so much depend us and our own hygiene habits but much more on those of others. It is the people that we meet, and their hygiene habits, that will determine to a larger extent how exposed she is. If they wash hands regularly and reduce the chance of them spreading the virus then we are likely to be more safe than if we just mix with a bunch of random people with very mixed hygiene habits... such as when travelling. That is why we must not travel right now. At an airport there is no way to avoid coming into close contact with people that are travelling from all parts of the world. We can try to reduce our exposure through social distancing but that is impossible in the course of air travel.

So I say to everyone... please take all the precautions you can. You might be fit and young so it is not necessarily for your sake but for the sake of those at much greater risk. If you can elect not to travel then don't. Social distancing is a big help, following the guidance on hand washing and face touching and try to restrict any chance you have not only of catching it but also of spreading it if you have.
fransknorge likes this.
snaxmuppet is offline  
Old Mar 5, 20, 3:07 am
  #119  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Plymouth, UK
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 1,159
Originally Posted by alvinlwh
In the UK, fire regulations require non residential buildings with an occupancy factor of over 60 to have doors opening outwards. Residential and low occupancy (i.e. corner shops) public buildings can have doors opening inwards.
Almost all of the toilet doors I have used in supermarkets and department stores open inwards towards the toilet so that I have to touch the handle with my recently washed hands to get out. I am in the habit now of carrying clean, un-used tissues in my pocket to use on my way out so I don't have to touch anything with clean hands.
snaxmuppet is offline  
Old Mar 5, 20, 3:13 am
  #120  
 
Join Date: Oct 2015
Location: Vale of Glamorgan
Programs: BAEC Gold
Posts: 2,655
I have just witnessed a conversation at TXL in which a passenger was insisting upon a free transfer to a later flight because someone was coughing in the check-in queue...
Misco60 is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread