47 CO Pax Imprisoned Overnight on Stinky E145 @ Rochester, MN

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Aug 9, 2009, 4:46 pm

#91

sbm12

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Quote:

Originally Posted by TWA Fan 1

There was the infamous "Valentine's Day Massacre" in which all of B6's JFK departures were held on the tarmac, some as long as 6 hours.

And neither this nor the AA incident have anything to do with "ostensible authority" since in both cases they were mainline flights that were in question. They do raise the point that the government cares more about the carriers than the citizens since they refuse to legislate reasonable care of pax, but that is not entirely what is being discussed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Beckles

I don't believe it's necessary to have TSA screening staff at an airport for arrivals.

Correct. The whole TSA excuse is BS. I also find it interesting that XJet is claiming that the airport refused to allow the pax in the gate areas, but I suppose that is feasible.

Aug 9, 2009, 4:53 pm

#92

Beckles

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Quote:

Originally Posted by sbm12

The whole TSA excuse is BS. I also find it interesting that XJet is claiming that the airport refused to allow the pax in the gate areas, but I suppose that is feasible.

Signature Flight Support is open 24/7 according to their website, once the crew realized they were overnighting they could have offloaded the plane there if the terminal was not available.

Aug 9, 2009, 4:59 pm

#93

soitgoes

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Regardless of who precisely is responsible for this debacle, it is unacceptable.

It's one thing to be on the tarmac--but to be at the *gate* overnight and to be refused terminal access is absurd.

Aug 9, 2009, 5:08 pm

#94

MikeMpls

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Quote:

Originally Posted by TWA Fan 1

Absolutely, but that's chump change, not the kind of settlement that's likely to change the basic structure of things.

In this case, I think $1,000 is unlikely because the disruption wasn't as severe, but let's say CO/XJ shell out $1k per passenger, that's still only $47k....

So if they're smart they'll try to buy them off for $1K each & leave the attorneys out in the cold.

Aug 9, 2009, 5:08 pm

#95

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Quote:

Originally Posted by soitgoes

Regardless of who precisely is responsible for this debacle, it is unacceptable.

It's one thing to be on the tarmac--but to be at the *gate* overnight and to be refused terminal access is absurd.

Agreed, in most of these cases, the a/c have stayed on the tarmac with the expectation of getting a take-off clearance, the window for which is often very narrow.

In this case, though, it seems that the intention was to remain in RST overnight.

Obviously, we have no way of knowing exactly what factors determined that passengers were not let out, and could have been a combination of factors, including the fact the CO/XJ do not have regular operations there, the fact that the airport closes overnight and was unwilling to stay open for the night, and, of course, the fact that XJ was simply too cheap to do the right thing, namely pay for the necessary facilities to take care of its customers for the night.

Aug 9, 2009, 5:09 pm

#96

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Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeMpls

So if they're smart they'll try to buy them off for $1K each & leave the attorneys out in the cold.

I think they're going to offer considerably less. The fact that the class is only comprised of a total of 47 is very much in CO/XJ's favor, since the potential payoff for a big-time attorney would be be too small to engage full-on litigation.

Aug 9, 2009, 5:10 pm

#97

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There is obviously a piece of this puzzle that is missing. As was stated earlier by others CO has a stated policy that passengers be allowed access to the terminal in ground delays greater than 3 hours. In addition as a CO employee on here said - the crew would not have wanted to be stranded for 5+ hours either - which I totally beleive to be true. Obviously someone at that airport was preventing the passengers from deplaning. Since CO does not operate to that airport it had to be the airport authority or tower or TSA - somebody LOCALLY was preventing the deplaning - that is the key to this I believe.

Aug 9, 2009, 5:16 pm

#98

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Quote:

Originally Posted by cotch

Very likely indeed, although, again, it's not clear how many of CO's rules apply to XJ-operated flights.

Aug 9, 2009, 5:25 pm

#99

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You're confusing an arrival with a departure. The 6:47 a.m. departure was from MSP, apparently a diversion of MSP-EWR to drop off the relief crew. This is what I can piece together from FlightAware:

Code:

Arrival @ RSTof plane w/ 47 pax:

BTA2816 E45X Houston Bush Int'ctl (KIAH) Fri 09:37PM CDT Sat 12:21AM CDT

Arrival of another Express Jet E145 @ RST (w/the relief crew?):

BTA2997 E45X Minneapolis/St Paul Intl (KMSP) Sat 06:47AM CDT Sat 07:07AM CDT

The resumption of IAH-MSP was scheduled for 8:10 a.m. this morning but I haven't found the actual flight in FlightAware:

09-Aug-2009 E45X/L Rochester Intl (KRST) Minneapolis/St Paul Intl (KMSP) 08:10AM CDT 08:36AM CDT Scheduled

Departure of Express Jet E145 for Newark:

BTA2997 E45X Newark Liberty Intl (KEWR) Sat 10:21AM CDT Sat 10:26AM EDT Sat 11:32AM EDT

Quote:

Originally Posted by WBurcham

Something no one has mentioned here.... CO does not have flights to Rochester MN.

That flight arrived at 12:20am & left at 6:45am so ~ 6 1/2 hours on the ground.

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/B...224Z/KIAH/KMSP

Though I originally guessed that no one would have been at the airport at that time, an NW A320 arrived, according to FlightAware at 11:56PM CDT. I cannot see how the entire airport was emptied of ground crew & TSA staff 24 minutes after a 148 seat plane arrived.

Arrivals:
BTA2997 E45X Minneapolis/St Paul Intl (KMSP) Sat 06:47AM CDT Sat 07:07AM CDT
FDX2493 B722 Memphis Intl (KMEM) Sat 04:50AM CDT Sat 06:07AM CDT
USC607 C208 Dupage (KDPA) Sat 03:06AM CDT Sat 04:35AM CDT
BTA2816 E45X Houston Bush Int'ctl (KIAH) Fri 09:37PM CDT Sat 12:21AM CDT
NWA120A A320 Minneapolis/St Paul Intl (KMSP) Fri 11:40PM CDT Fri 11:56PM CDT
N490AM BE40 Davenport Muni (KDVN) Fri 10:23PM CDT Fri 10:51PM CDT
N81AX LJ25 John C Tune (KJWN) Fri 09:16PM CDT Fri 10:40PM CDT
MES3635 CRJ9 Minneapolis/St Paul Intl (KMSP) Fri 09:57PM CDT Fri 10:14PM CDT

Departures:

08-Aug-2009 E45X/L Rochester Intl (KRST) Newark Liberty Intl (KEWR) 10:21AM CDT 11:32AM EDT 0:10
08-Aug-2009 E45X/L Minneapolis/St Paul Intl (KMSP) Rochester Intl (KRST) 06:47AM CDT 07:07AM CDT 0:19

Aug 9, 2009, 5:31 pm

#100

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Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeMpls

You're confusing an arrival with a departure. The 6:47 a.m. departure was from MSP, apparently a diversion of MSP-EWR to drop off the relief crew.

Still, WBurcham's point still applies, namely that there were most likely still people left in the RST terminal 28 minutes after the departure of the NW flight.

Aug 9, 2009, 5:41 pm

#101

MikeMpls

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Quote:

Originally Posted by TWA Fan 1

Still, WBurcham's point still applies, namely that there were most likely still people left in the RST terminal 28 minutes after the departure of the NW flight.

Not necessarily. Have you been to RST? There isn't much there: one room, a few gates. If the XJ crew delayed at all, the place would be deserted very quickly. XJ was probably talking to their dispatch center while everyone else was clearing out of RST.

Aug 9, 2009, 5:51 pm

#102

MikeMpls

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continental.com flight status shows the final leg of this flight:

DEPARTS
City: Rochester, MN (RST)
Gate:
Check-in Terminal:
Scheduled Time: 12:55 a.m.
Scheduled Date: Sat., Aug. 8, 2009
Actual Time: 8:28 a.m.
Actual Date: Sat., Aug. 8, 2009

ARRIVES
City: Minneapolis/St. Paul, MN (MSP)
Gate: E9
Terminal: Concourse E
Scheduled Time: 11:54 p.m.
Scheduled Date: Fri., Aug. 7, 2009
Actual Time: 9:15 a.m.
Actual Date: Sat., Aug. 8, 2009

Aug 9, 2009, 6:37 pm

#103

sbm12

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Quote:

Originally Posted by MikeMpls

You're confusing an arrival with a departure. The 6:47 a.m. departure was from MSP, apparently a diversion of MSP-EWR to drop off the relief crew. This is what I can piece together from FlightAware:

That's how I read it as well. The fact that XJet couldn't come up with a way to rouse someone out of bed and get the pax off the plane while waiting for that relief crew to arrive is absurd.

Technically were the crew being paid the whole time since they never opened the door to end the flight?