DL/AF/KL/NW four-way Atlantic venture - where does this leave CO?
 

Financial Times is reporting that AF/KL and DL along with NW expect to receive antitrust immunity this month from US Gov't to form a four-way transatlantic joint venture. The joint venture would share profits, revenue, joint sales plans, networks, capacity, etc.

This is a "light" version of a merger - with merger of the equity ownership of the four airlines with a unified product, but separate flying operations.

The competition to this four-way venture is BA, AA, LH, UA, and CO. With the four all part of SkyTeam where does this leave CO - also part of SkyTeam - if this group views CO as competition?

Maybe CO should be seeking out a new alliance? *A?

There is a discussion on this topic over in the DL forum. This is a different topic than the merger topics - since the DL/NW full merger has failed but a light merger (a la AF/KL) is going to take place.

As discussed before - CO is really the odd one in SkyTeam. With this new competitive force - SkyTeam offers nothing to CO other than FF plan benefits. CO is in SkyTeam because Wings Alliance failed and really no place else to go.

They applied for this a long time ago. The competitive advantage will be in the expanded code sharing, I think. If CO would sell more flights with their partner codes they'd probably not have too many issues with this. But the insistence on not showing onward flights from partner hubs makes CO seem less able to provide coverage than they really are.

Or CO will go out of business because everyone else has a better alliance. But I don't think that will happen.

Maybe it is me, but are you confusing the discussion at the end of the FT article (link) with the TATL JV that is going into effect? The last few paragraphs are a tack-on, discussing going with an AF/KL-type option in the NW-DL merger, but this doesn't seem to impact the JV, which will happen regardless of whether NW and DL undertake any sort of merger.

Like others, I think it sort of leaves CO as the 5th wheel in ST, but this isn't anything new. Whether CO leaves ST or not will likely be up to CO, as I don't really see any more incentive for ST to push them out tomorrow than they had yesterday. And, if one thinks that the other ST airlines want to push CO out because of competition fears, I'm not sure it follows that the *A or OW carriers would roll out the welcome mat, for the same reason.

With this new venture, I just do not see AF and KL wanting to sell tickets on connecting CO flights. Their website and systems will push connections at DL and NW hubs. They will only want to market their flights out of EWR and IAH as orginating flights for connections at AF/KL hubs.

The purpose of an alliance is that alliance partners sell tickets on the other partner's flights. The venture is significant in that a complete DL/NW merger has now been officially ruled out. But I could see DL and NW merge their FF programs and even their websites, sometime in the future. Yes, the venture is for Atlantic flights at this time, but it could expand.

CO OnePass was the combining of Eastern's and CO's FF programs - but there was no merger.

I thought an alliance was just a marketing gimmick? I think it still is.

An Alliance usually implies Code Shares - but CO does not code share with many people - just barely with DL and NW domestically, and Virgin internationally. What else?

DL for example codes shares with KE, AF etc on major international routes and of course NW and KL do - they provide website booking for each other.

EVA (BR) operates some of their flights to/from TPE (LAX, SFO, SEA) as a CO codeshare.

I disagree. An alliance is a marketing gimmick, with the main benefit for the traveller being seamless check-in across partner flights. Most codeshare agreements are built bilaterally outside of alliances, though most carriers have a preference for code shares within their alliance.

UA and LH already have such a revenue sharing venture in place.

I guess that puts CO in the same category as US is in the *A.

I hope you're not suggesting anything there... (US - blech!)

CO will continue to be my preferred airline from SAN!
 

Except when i have to take USAirways to the Freddies in Phoenix, and to Las Vegas for a meeting followed by Alaska Air to Vancourer and United San Francisco for other meetings.
That will help to top off my United miles account, but I would rather fly CO, anytime, which I am able to do for my South American adventures several times a year, and NY and Yul for more recreation.
I don't understand why United is so inept on recording the miles from United and USAir, so they always want the bording passes. This January I flew TAM within Brazil and only the Departure flight was recorded, then I found I didn't get United miles for the United flights to SFO, last Fall. This gets to be a real pain in the butt.
CO is spot on with the miles being recorded for some time.

:D

I meant that CO is the odd man out in SkyTeam like US is the odd man out in *A. But the CO and US products are different.

In the CO/SkyTeam case - CO is the better product than the other SkyTeam airlines, where as in the US/*A - US is the worst of the product in *A.

Just that both CO and US are not in the select group for that teaming arrangement.

Having had the misfortune of flying on Spanair, I am not certain that US is the worst product in *A.