PIP: An outsider's take
 

Having just returned from Party In Paradise, it seems fitting to make my maiden posting. Since I hadn't participated in the bulletin board (I just tagged along with Cousin Craigsz to hang and Scuba dive), I went feeling a bit of a party crasher...yet I returned feeling a special guest. Not knowing any of you or your protocols, I had no particular expectations. Well, it was great fun from the moment I checked my liver in at the Red Carpet at LAX. I was so impressed about the great amount of work and creativity this took to pull off. Army invasions have less percision. Moreover, the generosity of so many of you was mind numbing. What struck me, however, was the total lack of glad-handing. The connections being made weren't business, but social, i.e., "Oh, I'll be in Brazil that week as well, let's get together for a drink."

Now, having returned and preparing for a financial audit that the State tells me will last 15 business days, I'm reflecting that the Gala was, in a sense, my Last Supper. Jesus should have eaten so well and been surrounded by so many fellow travelers. Thanks to all for everything.

Sky Masterson relays this message from Nathan who called after reading this posting and said:



"He did and He was." He also said that he and the guys at the track and casino understand that the writer's intentions are pure but the comparison is really not in good taste.Try Shakespeare for a more appropriate one.

I'm confused. The apostles were Communists?

Thanks RichG for getting the Communist slant. Seems to me that, unless my timeline is off, Jesus read Das Kapital more closely than Lenin or Mao.

As for Shakespeare, alas, he didn't say kill all the accountants. But I appreciate the suggestion and for my audit I should have considered Hamlet, "When sorrows come, they come not single spies, but in battalions." Or Macbeth, "Double, double toil and trouble...."

Macbeth sums up the PIP weekend for me, "That which hath made them drunk hath made me bold."

Had good Will foreseen Bulletin Boards he never would have said, "Give every man thy ear, but few thy voice." Hamlet

Jailer: Or you could tell the auditors "And deeper than did ever plummet sound, I'll drown my book." (Prospero)

And, somewhat obviously, from Hamlet (Horatio to Laertes?) "Neither a borrower nor a lender be."

Almost forgot... Shylock: "If you prick us, do we not bleed?" (remember to roll the "r" in "prick")


[This message has been edited by RichG (edited 11-10-1999).]

Nathan replies through Sky: "Stick with old Will and forget the others. They were and are all losers; look at the mess they left behind. The comparison remains in poor taste, even if politically correct in today's fallen world. PIP and the Last Supper? Jesus and Marx-Engel-Lenin-Mao? Just poor taste- and from an obviously very literate and intelligent fellow. But everyone's happy that everyone had such a happy time."

Nathan replies through Sky: "Stick with old Will and forget the others. They were and are all losers; look at the mess they left behind. The comparison remains in poor taste, even if politically correct in today's fallen world. PIP and the Last Supper? Jesus and Marx-Engel-Lenin-Mao? Just poor taste- and from an obviously very literate and intelligent fellow. But everyone's happy that everyone had such a happy time."



And your time line is way off. And Henry said (through Will) "kill all the lawyers," not accountants. And the apostles and Jesus were not Marxian: "Render unto Caesar....."

Sky: could you tell nate that he is being a tad sensitive. Understandable, given his newly found proximity to Him. But poor taste? Relative to every second posting in OMNI and In the News? Back to your harp, nate...

BTW, if then who was the PiP Judas????????

http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif

The bush, of course.

RichG: Polonius to Laertes, Hamlet, Act I, scene iii.

Personally I believe the bush, is an innocent bystander. Have to look elsewhere for Judas.

Perhaps Judas just can't read a calendar?

If alive today, surely Karl Marx would say, "Bulletin boards are the opiate of the masses." Would not Karl see an airplane as a microcosm of the class struggle? The bourgeois business-class traveler yearns to be a first-class capitalist, while at the same time exploiting the proletariat tourist in coach. "Arise, you have nothing to lose buy your lack of leg room."

If old Will is thy idol, why does Nathan Detroit pick a character from a Shakespeare knock off (aren't all plays pale imitations of the Maestro?) I humbly suggest he take on a Shakespearean persona, perhaps Falstaff.

The Soviets and N. Koreans rendered unto Caesar plenty, so I don't get the "Render onto Caesar" disclaimer. Jesus, and therefore the apostles, would have subscribed to the Judaic custom of gleaning the fields, each unti his or her needs. However, I concede that the same backward engineering that makes Jesus a communist (little "c") could also be used to turn Moses into a terrorist....Please, no tacky responses about the Egyptian Air disaster.

"Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's and unto God what is God's." Marxist Leninism says that the state is supreme; Judiasm and Christianity say that God is supreme. Not too hard to deduce the meaning in this context. Nate may be sensitive, given his present home but he also took the writings of his old tutor CSLewis to heart many, many years ago. And he has no idols (see old writing called 10 Commandments, still valid, if often overlooked or ignored).

As for Judas, he can't make the connection here - any moe than he can make the earlier connections.



At least the Shakespeare students and scholars are having a field day with this one. And everyone had a wonderful time draining HNL dry! Ja?



The bells of hell go ting a ling a ling for thee but not for me.

------------------
nathan detroit

1. Isn't this a much more rewarding thread than "seat theft"?

2. The Lion doth protest too much, methinks.

3. Having said that, thank you for the correction. I should have looked it up.

4. The phrase "fellow traveler" is bound to come up from time to time on a frequent flyer bulletin board. I think it's useful to try to prevent it from reverting to general use without regard to cold war connotations.

5. I don't think it's possible to refer to yourself in the third person indefinitely without eventually requiring the giant economy size Ex-Lax.

Sky, when the game breaks up, please pass this along to Mr. Detroit:

One Step, Two Step, Three Step, Four
Inquisition, Pogrom, Holy War and more

...And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; It tolls for thee.
--John Donne

OMNI
This thread has humbled me, and turned into an intellectual exercise for me. In case any one else is interested, following is the American Heritage Dictionary definition of "Fellow Traveler":
Per the website - Phrase Finder:

Students of cold-war history are invited to annotate!


[This message has been edited by Craig6z (edited 11-11-1999).]

RichG: Perhaps if and when Nathan makes a Lazarean return, he will be able to return to the first person. Meanwhile he must do as MacArthur always did and use the third.



And the Lion never protesteth too much (see Narnia, any volume, e.g. Witch Lion and Wardrobe, by CSLewis).



This really is better than whose seat is bigger (no pun intended). In fact, it is a good intellectual jousting and fun.

But now, methinks it may be time to say "Good night, Sweet Prince, parting is such sweet" and so forth. You are all nice folks and it's fun to joust with you from time to time in such a pleasant manner.



The bells still go ting a ling a ling but not for thee and me for we are all saints (see St. Paul for confirmation). And Thou of the Gloomy View, take heart, for you too are one of the aforementioned saints and will know it some day.

RichG: Perhaps if and when Nathan makes a Lazarean return, he will be able to return to the first person. Meanwhile he must do as MacArthur always did and use the third.



And the Lion never protesteth too much (see Narnia, any volume, e.g. Witch Lion and Wardrobe, by CSLewis).



This really is better than whose seat is bigger (no pun intended). In fact, it is a good intellectual jousting and fun.

But now, methinks it may be time to say "Good night, Sweet Prince, parting is such sweet" and so forth. You are all nice folks and it's fun to joust with you from time to time in such a pleasant manner.



The bells still go ting a ling a ling but not for thee and me for we are all saints (see St. Paul for confirmation). And Thou of the Gloomy View, take heart, for you too are one of the aforementioned saints and will know it some day.

I'm sorry....I forgot what this thread is about.

Sanity,

Perhaps you have not been paying attention, or did not get the reading list? Obviously, this thread concerns the paradigm shift from a pre-modern, ethico-religious based model of miles accumulation to the current laissez-faire, neo-Keyesian approach. Along the way, students explored how great thinkers and writers, such a Shakespeare, Donne, Marx, and Jesus interpreted frequent flyer programs in their own time and culture.
It is hoped that conclusions will be reached as to whether the dialectic pendulum swings towards United or Northwest hegemony.

As we are painfully aware, in modern times there is no longer a concern to who gets upgraded first, a Saint or Premier Executive. Thus, special emphasis has been devoted to the imperative: "Can a command economy in a totalitarian State more effectively distribute miles for the benefit of the masses?" And if so, will the masses simply go to Disney World? Parallel to that discussion: "Will the divide between business and tourist class go the way of the Berlin Wall?"

Sanity, I hope that you found this concise summation useful. If you require more, RichG can provide the formal Cliff Notes.

Oh.

Jailer,

I think maybe we should all have another martini and call you in the morning. http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/wink.gif Isn't that what they taught us in Hawaii?

Happy Audit!!! http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/smile.gif

It all started with a (literally) irreverent remark that Nathan Detroit found in bad taste... wonder what he thought of "History of the World, Part I"

[changing the subject back again]

"But doth suffer a sea change, into something rich and strange. Sea nymphs hourly ring his knell; Hark, now I hear them, ding-dong bell."

RichG: What Nathan said was "not in good taste;" he did not say "bad taste." Just to keep the record clear - if that is now possible.



Ding dong - dig aling a ling is about where this has gone so how about "Good night, Sweet Prince" now?

OK, I see that they're back misusing that Shakespearian line again.

nathan detroit, peer across the table there at your game (is it being held in the heavenly version of the Mermaid, perchance?) and see if 'tis Will sitting on the other side (as he often did, I'm told).

If so, he can probably remind you that it was not Henry whom he had say that famous line "The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers" (although it is, of course, in Henry VI, Part II). Instead it was a low anarchist, knave and rebel, Dick the Butcher, who is clearly and avowedly out to destroy society. And how (according to the good Will) ought he best to start in achieving that goal, but to do away with that which makes a society civilized. (As the King later exclaims, "Oh graceless men! They know not what they do.")

Arguably the only good idea Dick's "leader" had was to make it a felony to drink weak beer, and to direct that all citizens would get four quarts of beer for the price of one. [However, he then says he'll do away with money, too, so we're not sure exactly how that's going to work.]

Speaking of beer . . .

[This message has been edited by Counsellor (edited 11-13-1999).]

Extremely interesting assertion here by the long since departed ND (may he rest in peace)regarding his comments and the misquoting of them by others- particularly in view of the way I was personally chastised by the former ND himself, in body and soul, for presumably calling a UA employee a "liar"! Indeed I never did!

I rest my case!

That's a matter of opinion.

Ah, dear Counsellor, Nathan stands corrected.

It has been neigh on to 50 years since he refreshed himself with the good Henrys IV and VI and should have done so before leaping into the fray; with V he is more current.



As to the rested case, it stands on what is written and not in the stars. But let us not begin that trollery again. To haleck (2 ls perhaps?) or not to haleck, that is the question

Agreed. May we all go in peace!

In conclusion, now that the Dogs of War have flew, me thinks:

Oh, what a tangled web we weave
When we post on the F.T. com-mun-i-ty.

Our revels now are ended.
These, our actors, as I foretold you
Were all spirits, and are vanished into air, into thin air.

This thread is out of control!
And my nerves are in need of mend
So I have the best line to shut it down
THE END!!!

CMDR CATCOP, 1999

sense thes thred es enteleckual, arturo themk nun of yu butt jaler es entilligint enuff to postie hear. yu awl pretind, butt yu show yur lack of class, whech es the essence of intelligence.

reprised, revived, resuscitated, and resurrected

Interesting read, Jailer! Thanks for forwarding. -It's nice to see some of the "veteran's" posts, and to see Jailer when he was one of the news kids in cell block #9.

A PIP would be nice to attend someday. Will have to see when and where I can finally join in a PIP or a CUN or what have you.

-KP