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Citi AA churn - impact on Amex, BoA, Chase et.al. application strategy?

Citi AA churn - impact on Amex, BoA, Chase et.al. application strategy?

Old Dec 22, 19, 8:40 pm
  #136  
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Location: TPA
Programs: BA Gold; Hilton Diamond; Marriott Gold; IHG Platinum
Posts: 2,654
Originally Posted by jiaogulan View Post
Am I missing anything at Citi in terms of new card options? AA is done/on hold, I have the Premier so I can't do that or the other cards with TYP due to bonus restrictions, I just got Expedia.

Chase is long gone. BoA, Barclays, and Wells Fargo now are LOL/24-phobes.

AMEX is great but I am good there for a while.

I do not want to mess with US Bank and their weird credit bureau checks, plus they might easily be anti LOL/24 anyways.

I'll give CapOne a quick check I guess since they have transferable miles but I've never taken them seriously in the past due to checking all 3 bureaus and not having good cards. I have a feeling they'll be anti LOL/24.
I tried for a Cap One Venture a year ago, and was turned down:
- too many recent apps (didn't specifically say 24 months, that I can recall)
- no revolving credit activity (a fair cop -- I've not had any loans in several years)
- not enough income for expenses (silly; I'm retired, so my "income" is precisely what I need it to be)

For what it's worth I was 11/24, 6/12. I tried calling for reconsideration, but they don't seem to have a number for that per se.
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Old Jan 4, 20, 10:32 am
  #137  
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 787
Nothing revolutionary but got the Citi AT&T card yesterday. I'll take 10,000 TYP's for $1,000 I am going to spend anyways. Even after the AA debacle, Citi continues to be a silver lining.
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Old Jan 26, 20, 5:04 pm
  #138  
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: BDL, JFK
Posts: 658
After a very long run with Citi/AA now am trying to get under 5/24. So I'm planning a business card churn. Instant approval today for BOA Platinum Plus Business Card ($300 after 3k spend). If the popups stop will try Amex next.
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Old Jan 31, 20, 7:21 am
  #139  
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: NYC (LGA, JFK), CT
Programs: Delta Platinum, Marriott Platinum, Hilton Diamond, Hyatt Explorist
Posts: 3,613
I present this as an option: the Amex Delta Starter pack (for those without any of these cards and with three Amex credit card slots)

Delta Gold (70,000 mile sign up bonus)
Delta Platinum (100,000 mile sign up bonus)
Delta Reserve (100,000 mile sign up bonus, 20,000 mile MQM sign up bonus)

Apply now
Spend $10,000 on Delta Gold in 2020 (get sign up bonus, miles, plus $100 delta credit)
Spend $50,000 on Delta Platinum in 2020 (get sign up bonus, miles, plus 20,000 MQM)
Spend $60,000 on Delta Reserve in 2020 (get sign up bonus, miles plus 30,000 MQM)
Fly 5,000 miles on Delta in 2020 (one NYC to LAX transcon in coach will do) in 2020
Renew all three cards in 2021 for one extra year (to get remaining sign up bonuses and companion passes)

Get:
At least 390,000 Delta miles (this assumes no bonus category spend) - value of $4,290 at 1.1 cents per mile
$100 Delta Flight Credit - value of $100
Delta Platinum Status through January 2022 - N/A
One domestic coach companion ticket - value of $250
One domestic first class companion ticket - value of $500
Delta SkyClub and Centurion Lounge Access - value of $500
Total value: $5,640 (with no value ascribed to Platinum status, which many value in the thousands)

Cost
Delta Gold Fees ($100)
Delta Platinum Fees ($250 + $250)
Delta Reserve Fees ($550 + $550)
Opportunity Cost of $120,000 of spend at 2% ($2,400)
Total Cost: $4,100
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Old Jan 31, 20, 7:37 am
  #140  
mia
A FlyerTalk Posting Legend; Moderator: American Express, Capital One, Citi, Chase, Credit Card Programs, Diners Club, Signatures
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Miami, Mpls & London
Programs: AA & Marriott Perpetual Platinum; DL & HH Gold
Posts: 45,483
Originally Posted by Adelphos View Post
Delta SkyClub and Centurion Lounge Access - value of $500
....
Note that the lounge access is only valid when flying Delta, and no free guests.
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Old Feb 2, 20, 6:24 am
  #141  
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Programs: Continental Onepass, Hilton, Marriott, USAir and now UA
Posts: 5,739
Originally Posted by mia View Post
Note that the lounge access is only valid when flying Delta, and no free guests.
And that you have to spend $120K in a year using a credit card vendor that makes MSing (no Simon, no OfficeMax or Staples) far more difficult and costly to perform. (And if going the MS route, one needs to include that pesky conversion factor cost including purchase of VGC cost as well as conversion to cash equivalents.)

So, yes. If you are a very big spender, this is somewhat of an option. However, if I am spending that much (and a big spender to boot), wouldn't it be easier to just fly 4 segments on UA and spend $12K on plane tickets (I suspect 2 international RT F fares would do)?
Voila!, You're a Plat
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Old Feb 2, 20, 10:24 pm
  #142  
 
Join Date: Jan 2017
Posts: 787
Originally Posted by Adelphos View Post
I present this as an option: the Amex Delta Starter pack (for those without any of these cards and with three Amex credit card slots)

Delta Gold (70,000 mile sign up bonus)
Delta Platinum (100,000 mile sign up bonus)
Delta Reserve (100,000 mile sign up bonus, 20,000 mile MQM sign up bonus)

Apply now
Spend $10,000 on Delta Gold in 2020 (get sign up bonus, miles, plus $100 delta credit)
Spend $50,000 on Delta Platinum in 2020 (get sign up bonus, miles, plus 20,000 MQM)
Spend $60,000 on Delta Reserve in 2020 (get sign up bonus, miles plus 30,000 MQM)
Fly 5,000 miles on Delta in 2020 (one NYC to LAX transcon in coach will do) in 2020
Renew all three cards in 2021 for one extra year (to get remaining sign up bonuses and companion passes)

Get:
At least 390,000 Delta miles (this assumes no bonus category spend) - value of $4,290 at 1.1 cents per mile
$100 Delta Flight Credit - value of $100
Delta Platinum Status through January 2022 - N/A
One domestic coach companion ticket - value of $250
One domestic first class companion ticket - value of $500
Delta SkyClub and Centurion Lounge Access - value of $500
Total value: $5,640 (with no value ascribed to Platinum status, which many value in the thousands)

Cost
Delta Gold Fees ($100)
Delta Platinum Fees ($250 + $250)
Delta Reserve Fees ($550 + $550)
Opportunity Cost of $120,000 of spend at 2% ($2,400)
Total Cost: $4,100
I'm not a big spender in this way but I like your thought process and how you laid this out!
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Old Feb 3, 20, 1:46 pm
  #143  
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Posts: 86
Originally Posted by Adelphos View Post
I present this as an option: the Amex Delta Starter pack (for those without any of these cards and with three Amex credit card slots)

Delta Gold (70,000 mile sign up bonus)
Delta Platinum (100,000 mile sign up bonus)
Delta Reserve (100,000 mile sign up bonus, 20,000 mile MQM sign up bonus)

Apply now
Spend $10,000 on Delta Gold in 2020 (get sign up bonus, miles, plus $100 delta credit)
Spend $50,000 on Delta Platinum in 2020 (get sign up bonus, miles, plus 20,000 MQM)
Spend $60,000 on Delta Reserve in 2020 (get sign up bonus, miles plus 30,000 MQM)
Fly 5,000 miles on Delta in 2020 (one NYC to LAX transcon in coach will do) in 2020
Renew all three cards in 2021 for one extra year (to get remaining sign up bonuses and companion passes)

Get:
At least 390,000 Delta miles (this assumes no bonus category spend) - value of $4,290 at 1.1 cents per mile
$100 Delta Flight Credit - value of $100
Delta Platinum Status through January 2022 - N/A
One domestic coach companion ticket - value of $250
One domestic first class companion ticket - value of $500
Delta SkyClub and Centurion Lounge Access - value of $500
Total value: $5,640 (with no value ascribed to Platinum status, which many value in the thousands)

Cost
Delta Gold Fees ($100)
Delta Platinum Fees ($250 + $250)
Delta Reserve Fees ($550 + $550)
Opportunity Cost of $120,000 of spend at 2% ($2,400)
Total Cost: $4,100

I think you're grossly undervaluing the opportunity cost by just assuming 2% at numbers that large. If someone is signing up for 3 Delta cards, I'd assume that they're in this game deep enough that they would sign up for several other cards in the same year. With an extra 110k of organic or manufactured spend, you could potentially get tens of thousands of dollars of value from SUBs. Plus, paying the AF to receive the extra miles at renewal is mediocre value at best (I wouldn't pay $99 for 10k skymiles). We could debate the value of status, but I'd argue it's not anywhere close to the opportunity cost of several SUBs.

If we're recommending 3 cards, I'd say get the personal gold, business gold, and business platinum, ending up with 220k miles for 7k spend and $250 in AFs.

Get:
At least 227,000 Delta Miles (this assumes no bonus category spend) - value of $2,497 at 1.1 cents per mile

Cost:
Delta Platinum Fees ($250)

Much better value for your time and money than trying to maximize every benefit by spending an extra $110,000 on Delta cards, IMO.
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Old Feb 4, 20, 10:08 am
  #144  
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 208
Originally Posted by Adelphos View Post
I present this as an option: the Amex Delta Starter pack (for those without any of these cards and with three Amex credit card slots)

Delta Gold (70,000 mile sign up bonus)
Delta Platinum (100,000 mile sign up bonus)
Delta Reserve (100,000 mile sign up bonus, 20,000 mile MQM sign up bonus)

Apply now
Spend $10,000 on Delta Gold in 2020 (get sign up bonus, miles, plus $100 delta credit)
Spend $50,000 on Delta Platinum in 2020 (get sign up bonus, miles, plus 20,000 MQM)
Spend $60,000 on Delta Reserve in 2020 (get sign up bonus, miles plus 30,000 MQM)
Fly 5,000 miles on Delta in 2020 (one NYC to LAX transcon in coach will do) in 2020
Renew all three cards in 2021 for one extra year (to get remaining sign up bonuses and companion passes)

Get:
At least 390,000 Delta miles (this assumes no bonus category spend) - value of $4,290 at 1.1 cents per mile
$100 Delta Flight Credit - value of $100
Delta Platinum Status through January 2022 - N/A
One domestic coach companion ticket - value of $250
One domestic first class companion ticket - value of $500
Delta SkyClub and Centurion Lounge Access - value of $500
Total value: $5,640 (with no value ascribed to Platinum status, which many value in the thousands)

Cost
Delta Gold Fees ($100)
Delta Platinum Fees ($250 + $250)
Delta Reserve Fees ($550 + $550)
Opportunity Cost of $120,000 of spend at 2% ($2,400)
Total Cost: $4,100
Opportunity Cost is not a real or true cost. The concept is just a business analysis tool for comparison purposes. The real cost would only be $1,700 (plus any fees if you do MS).
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Old Feb 18, 20, 8:57 am
  #145  
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: BDL, JFK
Posts: 658
Originally Posted by flyer4512 View Post
Most people doing the AA churn will not be able to get any new Amex cards so the link with no language or upgrades ( Ascend Aspire ) may be the only option

Since the other cards have AF's I think the best route is NAF 75K then upgrade to Ascend for 150K then upgrade to aspire for another 150K..................assuming you can get the offers

Here are links to both upgrades. I Have no need for an upgrade now as we have a lot of points and gold status but it does say I can get the upgrade on my NAF HH Amex

https://online.americanexpress.com/d...details#/cshop

https://online.americanexpress.com/d...details#/cshop
After being in pop-up hell for 6 months was approved today for Hilton Business card (125k, $100 statement credit) despite Amex and Citi churn history so don't give up on Amex.
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Old Feb 18, 20, 2:08 pm
  #146  
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 6,123
Originally Posted by Robl View Post
After being in pop-up hell for 6 months was approved today for Hilton Business card (125k, $100 statement credit) despite Amex and Citi churn history so don't give up on Amex.

If you spend $$$ on AMEX cards you probably won't have an issue getting the Amex bonus for card you never held.

During the AA days I'm guessing most people were putting most if not all of their spend towards the AA SUB
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Old Feb 18, 20, 10:58 pm
  #147  
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 1,851
Originally Posted by walterj View Post
I am always looking for amex links without lifetime language and chase links that are pre-approved.
The AA churn left me a little out of the loop (or lazy, or something). I've seen several references to NLL Amex links, and Chase pre-approved/bypass 5/24 links. Where are people finding those? DOC? Reddit? Other threads here on FT?
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Old Feb 19, 20, 3:57 pm
  #148  
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: DCA/RIC
Programs: HH LTD, AA LTG
Posts: 992
Originally Posted by RobertHanson View Post
:AFAIK, this game is pretty much over, unless you are just starting out at 0/24. From time to time there may be a new AMEX card, or you may get a targeted offer that clearly says "no restrictions" on when you had it last, etc. But unless Citi prints some new mailers and starts sending them out, it's pretty much game, set, match, over for most of us. The only thing I'm still doing (after we each use the final mailer we have) is HH points from grocery spend, which after MS fees comes out around 40% of the rack rate to just pay for the rooms. I'm lucky there, as I still have grocery stores where I can buy GCs, and others where I can turn them into MOs, and it seems most people don't even have that anymore. Oh, and we both have 2 IHG cards, so that's a combined 2 free nights a year.

It was fun while it lasted though, wasn't it?
Did you and the Mrs.get caught up in the latest AA acct shutdown?
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Old Feb 21, 20, 4:21 am
  #149  
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 208
@bobert24
1) NLL Amex links are targeted referral links that are sent from time to time. People share them on doctorofcredit. I just saw there are new NLL targeted for Amex business plat reported by middleagemiles. My DW got her third gold card that way.

2) If you are lucky, log in your chase account and check offers Just for You., these offers bypass 5/24, I guess if interest rate is fixed. I have never had the luck. I only get offered checking bonus. I wonder if I open a checking acct, if I will get better offers.
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Last edited by walterj; Feb 29, 20 at 8:12 am
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Old Feb 22, 20, 7:11 pm
  #150  
Original Poster
 
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 1,269
Originally Posted by walterj View Post
@bobert24

2) If you are lucky, log in your chase account and check offers Just for You., these offers bypass 5/24, I guess if interest rate is fixed. I have never had the luck. I only get offered checking bonus. I wonder if I open a checking acct, if I will get better offers. Also, doc had a use at your own risk link for chase about 4 months ago.
I don't think so. I've had a checking account with Chase for over 20 years, and with one exception, I've never been targeted for a card offer. The one exception was a couple of months back before the AA shutdown. I didn't jump on it immediately (I don't even recall why I waited, but I was plotting my credit card strategy), and it disappeared after a few days, never to return. I assumed if Chase wanted me to have the card they would have let the offer stand for some time, but when I went back to it less than one week later, it was gone. So if you do get a random offer that way, jump on it quickly. But every time I see a reference to new "selected for you" offers on DOC or wherever, I check but am never targeted.
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