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-   -   Unionpay : Still relevant ? (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/china/2158169-unionpay-still-relevant.html)

Majuki Apr 20, 2024 12:24 am


Originally Posted by gudugan (Post 36173899)
This card is useless for all purposes and if I had a checking account requirement I would just drop it.

Why do you feel that the card useless for all purposes? Would you use another credit card for non-Alipay/WeChat Pay purchases? The original reason I got this card was to avoid DCC in Mainland China. The Alipay Tour Pass wasn't a thing at the time I got the card, and a couple of pre-2020 field tests worked well. Without access to a local bank account, I'm unsure that I'd want to pay the fee that the Alipay Tour Pass now charges, but I'd also question Visa/MC acceptance. Is DCC still as much of an issue as it was 10+ years ago? I've only had one Visa transaction in Mainland China (with all other card transactions being UnionPay or Amex), so I don't have many recent data points.

moondog Apr 20, 2024 12:43 am


Originally Posted by Majuki (Post 36174331)
Why do you feel that the card useless for all purposes? Would you use another credit card for non-Alipay/WeChat Pay purchases? The original reason I got this card was to avoid DCC in Mainland China. The Alipay Tour Pass wasn't a thing at the time I got the card, and a couple of pre-2020 field tests worked well. Without access to a local bank account, I'm unsure that I'd want to pay the fee that the Alipay Tour Pass now charges, but I'd also question Visa/MC acceptance. Is DCC still as much of an issue as it was 10+ years ago? I've only had one Visa transaction in Mainland China (with all other card transactions being UnionPay or Amex), so I don't have many recent data points.

In post 13, I was trying to brainstorm cases in which a UnionPay card might be an option while non-UP Visa/MC/Amex would not.


Criteria:
-POS machine that only accepts UnionPay cards
-purchase amount is greater than 1000 (I'm arbitrarily assuming neither ourselves nor venues have patience to do more than 5 Wx/Ap scans)
But, most merchants in other categories where you're likely to spend more than Y1000 accept non-UP Visa/MC/Amex, and DCC isn't so common anymore e.g.
1. Ctrip (I feel bad for using a single company instead of the category here, but if I just said "travel agencies", we'd run into some exceptions)
2. Chained hotels
3. Airlines
4. Restaurants where the average pp spend is >~250 (these are probably the highest risk for DCC, but it's still not prevalent in the whole)
5. Stores in class-A shopping malls

The short of it is, unless you're into 50k KTV outings or dining at expensive restaurants that rarely see foreigners (these do exist, to be sure), I don't think you'll have any regrets if you leave your ICBC UnionPay card at home.

mlin32 Apr 20, 2024 4:46 am

But if my MC levies a FX surcharge for all transactions not in Euro, wouldn't it make sense to use a Unionpay card linked to a RMB bank account ?

FYI : the banking system in Europe is not free, like that in the US. We pay for the luxury of having a bank account, and pay for having a credit (delayed debit) card, if the bank is kind enough to issue us one. So hefty FX fees are normal.

gudugan Apr 20, 2024 2:09 pm


Originally Posted by Majuki (Post 36174331)
Why do you feel that the card useless for all purposes? Would you use another credit card for non-Alipay/WeChat Pay purchases? The original reason I got this card was to avoid DCC in Mainland China. The Alipay Tour Pass wasn't a thing at the time I got the card, and a couple of pre-2020 field tests worked well. Without access to a local bank account, I'm unsure that I'd want to pay the fee that the Alipay Tour Pass now charges, but I'd also question Visa/MC acceptance. Is DCC still as much of an issue as it was 10+ years ago? I've only had one Visa transaction in Mainland China (with all other card transactions being UnionPay or Amex), so I don't have many recent data points.

My last trip to China I just paid for everything with Alipay and don't want to bother asking for a POS. I didn't end up using this card at all and will probably leave it at home next time.
The ICBC US UnionPay is treated as a foreign card: https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/35226838-post370.html

You don't need to use Tour Pass anymore as you can directly link foreign cards to Alipay (but there's a 3% transaction fee for purchases over Y200. This will also get charged with the UnionPay card)
The card is denominated in USD anyway and I'd rather earn 1 UR from CSR than 1% cashback.


Originally Posted by moondog (Post 36174354)
1. Ctrip (I feel bad for using a single company instead of the category here, but if I just said "travel agencies", we'd run into some exceptions)

Ctrip does charge a 3% fee for using a foreign credit card but it codes as travel so you can make it back. Sometimes this is cheaper (including the fee) than Trip.com for plane tickets.


Originally Posted by mlin32 (Post 36174653)
But if my MC levies a FX surcharge for all transactions not in Euro, wouldn't it make sense to use a Unionpay card linked to a RMB bank account ?

FYI : the banking system in Europe is not free, like that in the US. We pay for the luxury of having a bank account, and pay for having a credit (delayed debit) card, if the bank is kind enough to issue us one. So hefty FX fees are normal.

I found this page: https://www.bankofchina.com/de/de/pb..._21740193.html
and the application form is here: https://pic.bankofchina.com/bocappd/...8711297162.pdf

I didn't see any fees though. How much does it cost / do you need a minimum balance in a linked account?
I'd get it if the amount you pay in FX fees in China per year is more than the annual fee...

mlin32 Apr 20, 2024 3:36 pm


Originally Posted by gudugan (Post 36175575)
I found this page: https://www.bankofchina.com/de/de/pb..._21740193.html
and the application form is here: https://pic.bankofchina.com/bocappd/...8711297162.pdf

I didn't see any fees though. How much does it cost / do you need a minimum balance in a linked account?
I'd get it if the amount you pay in FX fees in China per year is more than the annual fee...

The monthly fee is only 4 EUR for the bank account. From a pure current financial standpoint, it wouldn't pay off since I visit the mainland perhaps twice a year (maximum), and don't have any spare money to make big ticket purchases.

In comparison, I pay 12,95 EUR/month for my current account, which includes a Mastercard credit card that allows me to make a fixed number of ATM withdrawals for free. No rewards, no points. And purchases not in Euro get hit with a FX fee.

Granted, was just curious whether opening a RMB account would be interesting, since I do have RMB in cash laying around as a reserve. And would de-risk from Mastercard as the sole payment provider.

gudugan Apr 20, 2024 4:15 pm


Originally Posted by mlin32 (Post 36175718)
Granted, was just curious whether opening a RMB account would be interesting, since I do have RMB in cash laying around as a reserve. And would de-risk from Mastercard as the sole payment provider.

Well in the spirit of FT, assuming it’s not a large expense, encourage you to try and report back!

My HSBC misadventures are an amusing DP at least


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