YuropFlyer

Their 0-Covid-Strategy (just as the one from NZ) has worked extremely well up to Delta.

I do believe the mRNA vaccinations are somewhat better than old-school vaccinations, though, and I certainly agree with others that it would be better to push mRNA much more. It's not "experimental" anymore, and those that claim so are clearly in the Dotard camp.

Now, with Omicron, it's my opinion they should shift towards "living with Covid", but that's entirely up to them.

With vaccines + available treatments against covid + the much less dangerous omicron (less doesn't mean zero) variant, the 0-covid-strategy imho has run it's course.

But till Omicron/Vaccines (ie, till fall 2021) it was clearly a superior strategy to the western approach (can't call that a strategy) "hey, let's do some half-arsed lockdowns that don't really work, but strangle the economy just enough, annoy everyone, and not lead anywhere, and still result in millions death"

So yeah, 2022 isn't 2020/2021 anymore, and I hope the PRC will eventually adapt. Guess they're having a good look onto other Asian countries like Singapore who now are "living with it" - super-high vaccination rate + omicron = looking good.

Loren Pechtel

There's no reason to expect long term side effects. This isn't the first time we've injected materials intended to make the body make targets for the immune system to go after--it's just in the past they were attenuated viruses. The mRNA and viral-vector Covid vaccines simply distill this to it's essence--making the body produce only the best target rather than whole viruses. Unlike attenuated-virus vaccines there's no risk of producing the actual disease.

It's a matter of face. China isn't going to meekly sit by and buy somebody else's vaccine, they're going to make their own. Never mind that we've never had a vaccine against a coronavirus before because killed-virus vaccines quickly become ineffective. They went ahead and did a killed-virus vaccine--and the real world data seems to show exactly what was expected, it worked well at first but doesn't do much against the variants.

Yup. While the R[sub]0[/sub] was low enough it worked very well. Throw down a ring fence around any infection and they contained it--inconvenient for those caught in the rings but better than the tens of millions that would die without.

The problem is their vaccine does almost nothing against Omicron. They have a population that's basically unprotected--and against that Omicron has about half the fatality rate of the original. Given the hospital crash that would be inevitable that could easily be ten million dead. They have painted themselves into a corner pretty badly at this point.

Key: Super high vaccination rate.

pruss2ny

i know this isn’t a thread about vaccines. I would just like to point out:
my “no history of long term side effects” vs. your “no reason to expect long term side effects” are not necessarily in opposition, just one of us is not pretending to know the unknown. To my knowledge we’ve never coded the body to actually PRODUCE cytotoxic entities so that our body could then mount a immuno-response to those very cells it was making. Its a fascinating strategy, logically it’s not without risk, and its conceivable that while Israel went 100% into mRNA, China opted not to for reasons other than face.

also, i would check your condemnation of the quickly deteriorating effectiveness of chinese vax...for a moment I thought you were describing the rapid loss of utility of the mRNA technology.

micgolub

Where can I find a list of valid flights from USA to China?
Either a direct flight or the ones that make "crew-change" stop?

I guess I keep looking in the wrong places?

Cotton Candy Lobster

None of the vaccines work particularly well to stop asymptomatic spread of Omicron, even with three doses. But all vaccines, Chinese or otherwise, appear to still be effective in preventing most severe illness, hospitalization and death. The notion China's vaccines are worse than the rest or totally ineffective was never true (78 percent efficacy was not THAT big a drop from 90-92, despite what US newspapers wanted us to think) but it's especially laughable now that Omicron has put everybody on a level playing field.

As far as Omicron spelling doom for zero-Covid, there have already been several local Omicron outbreaks, most notably in Tianjin, that were brought under control. Qingdao and Dongguan are seeing big swings right now, but they're also testing everyone. If case counts start moving into the 4 or 5 digits, that would be the time to declare zero-Covid dead.

I think people are projecting a lot of their previously held opinions on China onto its epidemic control policy and ignoring some important facts.

travelinmanS

I just heard from a colleague that China has added a new test requirement for an antigen test before being allowed to board the flight from the USA to China.

I guess that makes one blood test, 3 PCR tests and 1 antigen test in order to get into China.

They keep making it harder as the rest of the world is trying to make travel easier. Strange.

moondog

https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/...tions-83266824

Did he have to endure Q?

uanj

The article says three weeks Q at his residence.

narvik

https://www.ikkyinchina.com/china-tu...hina-from-usa/

narvik

"Burns arrived Friday with his wife Libby and a group of other U.S. diplomats and their families and will undergo three weeks of quarantine at his official residence as China requires...."

moondog

-Nonstop flights are only offered by Chinese airlines.
-You need to go to your gateway city 7 days before you fly.
-Most of us use UA 857 because Shanghai quarantine isn't so bad.
-If you have extra time to spare, you will save a lot of money by connecting in a third country, but you're looking at a 14-day transit, and be sure to confirm in advance with the PRC consulate in your third country.
-It has been reported in our Wx thread that Taiwan quarantine counts for the PRC, but you need a business visa to enter Taiwan.

YariGuy

I'm on the thread and didn't see anything on this... Also people coming in from TW are still required to quarantine as far as I know.

But I'm looking into this as I'm considering this route for this summer. Flights to the US are (relatively) easy, so it's the return into China that's giving me problems. Also from Taiwan you won't be required to to take a blood test as far as I know (I'm also working on confirming).

YariGuy

By the way the above is a list of hotels that accept +7 stays (the 7 days of self-monitoring after the 14-days of quarantine). I won't translate everything but in Jing'an the hotels listed are UrCove by Hyatt, Puli, Hanting (Zhongshan N. Rd. by train station), and the Portman Ritz Carlton.

Disclaimer: this is compiled by a TW association and I don't vouch whether it's correct or up-to-date.

gudugan

Well I'm interested. As I reported in Taiwan closed to all foreign visitors as of 19 Mar 2020 the gold card for Taiwan is possible again. Still not sure how I can get a China visa but it�s a step closer.

GloballyServiced

If you need an entry visa for China, just reach out to moondog and he will share Vincent’s contact info. Amongst other extremely accurate information.