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anacapamalibu Jan 23, 2012 11:28 pm

78,000 cars in Beijing 1978
4.8 million in 2010

One giant parking lot.

mnredfox Jan 24, 2012 4:53 pm


Originally Posted by anacapamalibu (Post 17875272)
78,000 cars in Beijing 1978
4.8 million in 2010

One giant parking lot.

Highways sure feel like one, just one with all the cars on with bad stuff coming out the tailpipes that is.

junipermike Jan 26, 2012 6:26 pm

Beijing odd/even license plates
 
My understanding is that driving is still somewhat restricted in Beijing based on whether you have an odd or even license plate.

A supplier I have in BJ told me, however, that he has two cars, one even, one odd, to get around the restriction. So much for trying to control pollution and traffic congestion.

trueblu Jan 26, 2012 8:01 pm


Originally Posted by junipermike (Post 17894492)
My understanding is that driving is still somewhat restricted in Beijing based on whether you have an odd or even license plate.

A supplier I have in BJ told me, however, that he has two cars, one even, one odd, to get around the restriction. So much for trying to control pollution and traffic congestion.

It's days of the week...so on any one (work) day, only about 20% of cars are off the road. A true even/odd system would take 50% of cars off the road, but it would be utterly brutal -- which may be what is actually needed!

tb

moondog Jan 26, 2012 8:28 pm


Originally Posted by junipermike (Post 17894492)
My understanding is that driving is still somewhat restricted in Beijing based on whether you have an odd or even license plate.

A supplier I have in BJ told me, however, that he has two cars, one even, one odd, to get around the restriction. So much for trying to control pollution and traffic congestion.

TMK, the restriction you cite has pretty much been abandoned, in part because of the workaround you mentioned.

The "license plate lottery" is the government's latest defense against the car problem. Every month, 1 in ~12 applicants are given the opportunity to fetch license plates. Naturally, those with 关系 have figured out ways to beat the system, but it has been reasonably effective. That having been said, the Shanghai approach (expensive license plates) is clearly a better solution to the problem at hand.

Worry not; I remain confident that BJ will be a nice place some day; it's basically 30 years behind Tokyo (i.e. give it a chance to catch up), and the guys running the show are not morons.

mnredfox Jan 27, 2012 5:51 pm


Originally Posted by trueblu (Post 17894930)
It's days of the week...so on any one (work) day, only about 20% of cars are off the road. A true even/odd system would take 50% of cars off the road, but it would be utterly brutal -- which may be what is actually needed!

tb

Yes, you are only restricted 1-2 days per week.

jiejie Jan 28, 2012 5:58 am


Originally Posted by moondog (Post 17895031)
Worry not; I remain confident that BJ will be a nice place some day; it's basically 30 years behind Tokyo (i.e. give it a chance to catch up), and the guys running the show are not morons.

You are more optimistic than I. I think BJ will not become a nice place to live again, until it's de-populated by about 1/3 of the present level. That may have to happen at some point anyway, due to outstripping of water supplies, which unlike traffic and pollution, is not talked about here (or much anywhere else publicly), but is probably an even more serious issue.

tauphi Jan 28, 2012 1:45 pm


Originally Posted by jiejie (Post 17902833)
You are more optimistic than I. I think BJ will not become a nice place to live again, until it's de-populated by about 1/3 of the present level. That may have to happen at some point anyway, due to outstripping of water supplies, which unlike traffic and pollution, is not talked about here (or much anywhere else publicly), but is probably an even more serious issue.

By then I'm sure they'll be rich enough to afford desalinated water. If not then they'll have to drink recycled water :p

anacapamalibu Jan 28, 2012 2:34 pm


Originally Posted by jiejie (Post 17902833)
You are more optimistic than I. I think BJ will not become a nice place to live again, until it's de-populated by about 1/3 of the present level. That may have to happen at some point anyway, due to outstripping of water supplies, which unlike traffic and pollution, is not talked about here (or much anywhere else publicly), but is probably an even more serious issue.

China Daily January 5th 2012

WATER SHORTAGE IN BEIJING SEVERE

moondog Jan 28, 2012 7:35 pm


Originally Posted by jiejie (Post 17902833)
You are more optimistic than I. I think BJ will not become a nice place to live again, until it's de-populated by about 1/3 of the present level. That may have to happen at some point anyway, due to outstripping of water supplies, which unlike traffic and pollution, is not talked about here (or much anywhere else publicly), but is probably an even more serious issue.

It's all about the upcoming urban sprawl. While this won't solve the water problem, it is bound to spread people out.

mosburger Jan 29, 2012 2:30 am


Originally Posted by moondog (Post 17874138)
While tough emissions laws/incentives may well have worked wonders in Los Angeles, I'm not convinced that similar laws would solve Beijing's problems.

Especially as local authorities are forging industry emission figures to protect state owned companies and private tycoons with good guangxi.

I know of a few cases where there is very convincing proof of a certain kind that emission figures recorded by local laboratories where later changed to keep them within allowed levels.

anacapamalibu Jan 29, 2012 7:44 am


Originally Posted by mosburger (Post 17907571)
Especially as local authorities are forging industry emission figures to protect state owned companies and private tycoons with good guangxi.

I know of a few cases where there is very convincing proof of a certain kind that emission figures recorded by local laboratories where later changed to keep them within allowed levels.

That's not suprising.
No big fine or jail if caught falsifying emissions reports.


http://china-wire.org/?p=17278

HawaiiO May 2, 2012 12:11 am

Is pollution bad today in PEK?
I was looking at the AQI index and it was 160+...

Anyone knows of a webcam for PEK?
The only webcam i could find showed a grey landscape scene in the afternoon so I'm not exactly sure it was accurate.

Edit:
hmm, looking through the US Embassy AQI, it seems that some days are pretty good, as in sub-50.
But, May 1 was 300+ at noon!
That is just ridiculous.

Shimon May 2, 2012 12:45 am

Beijing needs a better subway.

Shimon May 2, 2012 12:51 am


Originally Posted by anacapamalibu (Post 17874357)
Quick Fix@:-)

Even-Odd Plates

worked for 08 Olympics
  • two thirds of Beijing's 3.29 million cars were off the road
  • shorter travel times
  • less pollution

Better solution. Even number plates in the morning. Odd number plates in the afternoon. Few hours of both. Switched daily. It will stop people from doing their daily commute with cars.


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