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Originally Posted by gsoltso
(Post 30694519)
Except it wouldn't be 75k workers, it would more along the lines of 30k, maybe 40k if they really amp up the organization. The government would have the option to fire every single one of them, as long as they could prove the individual was participating as part of an organized walk out/slow down/stoppage. There are many people that would ignore such pleas/organization - much more than I think the people calling for a "strike/work stoppage" realize. There is ample precedent for the firing of those individuals that take part, and I do not get the sense that the sitting administration is in any mood to tolerate such an event very well. There are temporary options available to the Executive branch, and I am not so certain that a strike will bode well for the Union in a legal sense (if they are a part of the organizing and or striking).
If 30,000 TSA screeners walked off the job security screenings around the country would be severely impacted and I'm guessing more workers would follow. There is no way that this many employees could be replaced in a manner fast enough to not have a long lasting impact on commercial passenger aviation so I'm not sure any serious punitive action would be taken. But guessing what could happen and taking that step are two different things. |
Originally Posted by gsoltso
(Post 30694519)
Except it wouldn't be 75k workers, it would more along the lines of 30k, maybe 40k if they really amp up the organization. The government would have the option to fire every single one of them, as long as they could prove the individual was participating as part of an organized walk out/slow down/stoppage. There are many people that would ignore such pleas/organization - much more than I think the people calling for a "strike/work stoppage" realize. There is ample precedent for the firing of those individuals that take part, and I do not get the sense that the sitting administration is in any mood to tolerate such an event very well. There are temporary options available to the Executive branch, and I am not so certain that a strike will bode well for the Union in a legal sense (if they are a part of the organizing and or striking).
Originally Posted by Boggie Dog
(Post 30694577)
I'm not sure anyone here is calling for a work stoppage other than saying they could understand the reasoning for such action. I've tried seeing myself in the shoes of the impacted government employees and fully understand the difficulties many are facing.
If 30,000 TSA screeners walked off the job security screenings around the country would be severely impacted and I'm guessing more workers would follow. There is no way that this many employees could be replaced in a manner fast enough to not have a long lasting impact on commercial passenger aviation so I'm not sure any serious punitive action would be taken. But guessing what could happen and taking that step are two different things. |
Originally Posted by petaluma1
(Post 30694602)
The 75,000 number includes not only TSA but IRS, federal prison employees, anyone who is being forced to work without pay, which some sources are saying is as high as 400,000+.
Everything you need to know about the government shutdown How many federal employees have been affected?Of the about 800,000 employees in the nine Cabinet departments and various smaller agencies whose funding has lapsed, about 380,000 initially were furloughed without pay with the rest still working without pay. |
The difference in the numbers is between those at an affected agency who are "essential" and are thus being required to work without pay and those not deemed "essential" who are not working and, of course, not being paid either.
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Originally Posted by Boggie Dog
(Post 30694616)
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Originally Posted by Boggie Dog
(Post 30694577)
I'm not sure anyone here is calling for a work stoppage other than saying they could understand the reasoning for such action. I've tried seeing myself in the shoes of the impacted government employees and fully understand the difficulties many are facing.
If 30,000 TSA screeners walked off the job security screenings around the country would be severely impacted and I'm guessing more workers would follow. There is no way that this many employees could be replaced in a manner fast enough to not have a long lasting impact on commercial passenger aviation so I'm not sure any serious punitive action would be taken. But guessing what could happen and taking that step are two different things. A joint statement was issued yesterday by the unions for ATC, pilots, and FAs. It touches on more than just the TSA absences, as it takes a more systemic view (which is what we need to be doing IMHO), but thought I'd post it here for starters. https://www.afacwa.org/air_traffic_c...ue_to_shutdown Due to the shutdown, air traffic controllers, transportation security officers, safety inspectors, air marshals, federal law enforcement officers, FBI agents, and many other critical workers have been working without pay for over a month. Staffing in our air traffic control facilities is already at a 30-year low and controllers are only able to maintain the system’s efficiency and capacity by working overtime, including 10-hour days and 6-day workweeks at many of our nation’s busiest facilities. Due to the shutdown, the FAA has frozen hiring and shuttered its training academy, so there is no plan in effect to fill the FAA’s critical staffing need. Even if the FAA were hiring, it takes two to four years to become fully facility certified and achieve Certified Professional Controller (CPC) status. Almost 20% of CPCs are eligible to retire today. Safety inspectors and federal cyber security staff are not back on the job at pre-shutdown levels, and those not on furlough are working without pay. Last Saturday, TSA management announced that a growing number of officers cannot come to work due to the financial toll of the shutdown. In addition, we are not confident that system-wide analyses of safety reporting data, which is used to identify and implement corrective actions in order to reduce risks and prevent accidents is 100 percent operational due to reduced FAA resources. |
Unless the shutdown ends in the next 4 hours, the earliest a paycheck could arrive would be Monday
I would expect the 10% callout rate we saw last Sunday to be topped this weekend. |
Originally Posted by Boggie Dog
(Post 30694577)
I'm not sure anyone here is calling for a work stoppage other than saying they could understand the reasoning for such action. I've tried seeing myself in the shoes of the impacted government employees and fully understand the difficulties many are facing.
If 30,000 TSA screeners walked off the job security screenings around the country would be severely impacted and I'm guessing more workers would follow. There is no way that this many employees could be replaced in a manner fast enough to not have a long lasting impact on commercial passenger aviation so I'm not sure any serious punitive action would be taken. But guessing what could happen and taking that step are two different things. Short term solutions are available, and would be able to be implemented probably within 5 days, but the impact would be felt. Most likely it would be damaging to efficiency instead of completely shutting down operations. |
Originally Posted by jamesinclair
(Post 30694950)
Unless the shutdown ends in the next 4 hours, the earliest a paycheck could arrive would be Monday
I would expect the 10% callout rate we saw last Sunday to be topped this weekend. |
It doesn't matter if strikes are illegal. Someone has to sue and I'm not sure there is any will by any government agency to sue to require its people to work without pay. Same thing for down the road. The people who called in sick and were not will not be disciplined and everyone will get paid. None of this has to do with what happens over the next few days other than the end of a shutdown.
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Originally Posted by Often1
(Post 30695513)
It doesn't matter if strikes are illegal. Someone has to sue and I'm not sure there is any will by any government agency to sue to require its people to work without pay. Same thing for down the road. The people who called in sick and were not will not be disciplined and everyone will get paid. None of this has to do with what happens over the next few days other than the end of a shutdown.
We are in a severe flu season! :p |
CNN now reporting that TSA sceeners in Hawaii are starting to resign. Didn’t give any sense of the extent, though. |
Originally Posted by Boggie Dog
(Post 30695672)
Do you not believe that a major interruption to air travel wouldn't help end this situation. This may be one of those times where TSA screeners hold a pretty big stick.
We are in a severe flu season! :p The entire purpose of a strike, whether it is a formal strike, a sickout, or whatever is to bring pressure for a change. Shutting down the commercial aviation system will bring unbearable pressure relatively immediately. |
Originally Posted by J. Leslie
(Post 30695737)
CNN now reporting that TSA sceeners in Hawaii are starting to resign. Didn’t give any sense of the extent, though. Good grief. |
Originally Posted by Often1
(Post 30695749)
Of course I do. I said this the first day it was reported that Officers were calling in sick.
The entire purpose of a strike, whether it is a formal strike, a sickout, or whatever is to bring pressure for a change. Shutting down the commercial aviation system will bring unbearable pressure relatively immediately. I fully agree about the pressure on the system. There have been reports of elevated absenteeism for the last couple of weeks. While the cause could be attributed to seasonal illnesses like the flu it could be other things also. I doubt we'll ever know for sure. I can understand an increasing number of people calling out. |
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