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New Screening Measures and "Interviews" for Passengers on US Bound Flights

New Screening Measures and "Interviews" for Passengers on US Bound Flights

Old Oct 27, 17, 1:53 pm
  #76  
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Originally Posted by greggarious View Post
This is interesting to me.

As a US citizen, I'm allowed to return and not technically required to answer questions from CBP.

But this seems like a loophole: if you don't answer additional questions, you can't get on the plane.

I would assume this could face a legal challenge.
Lawsuits being successful against the government for the immediate actions of the airline and/or the airline’s contractor isn’t something I consider to be all that likely. This would be a more difficult challenge than even dealing with governmental no-fly blacklist hits depriving otherwise free US citizens of exercising a fundamental right to return to the country of citizenship.

The government has a history of even denying US citizens a US passport to return home absent some such citizens subjecting themselves to interrogation that may deprive them of their freedom by even placing them in jeopardy of being criminally prosecuted for their answers (honest or otherwise). And those are situations where hiding behind a corporate front doesn’t fly as well.

Last edited by GUWonder; Oct 27, 17 at 1:59 pm
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Old Oct 28, 17, 6:44 am
  #77  
 
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Originally Posted by GUWonder View Post
Lawsuits being successful against the government for the immediate actions of the airline and/or the airlineís contractor isnít something I consider to be all that likely. This would be a more difficult challenge than even dealing with governmental no-fly blacklist hits depriving otherwise free US citizens of exercising a fundamental right to return to the country of citizenship.

The government has a history of even denying US citizens a US passport to return home absent some such citizens subjecting themselves to interrogation that may deprive them of their freedom by even placing them in jeopardy of being criminally prosecuted for their answers (honest or otherwise). And those are situations where hiding behind a corporate front doesnít fly as well.
So I was wrong, and there are some responses that might result in worse than just an SSSS. I stand corrected.

I imagine some responses would also constitute crimes in the local jurisdiction, or evidence of crimes.
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Old Oct 28, 17, 7:06 am
  #78  
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Originally Posted by GaryD View Post
So I was wrong, and there are some responses that might result in worse than just an SSSS. I stand corrected.

I imagine some responses would also constitute crimes in the local jurisdiction, or evidence of crimes.
Unless the response to the airline employee/contractor is a criminal threat or the speech in itself is otherwise a crime or evidence of such, in most jurisdictions a non-answer and most responses wouldn’t constitute a crime or other such problem as far as I know. Of course some answers and other responses could result in being subject to arrest and prosecution for a crime.

There are plenty of places with flights to the US where a verbal statement in response to a question wouldn’t be a crime if the response were given in the US but would be a crime or evidence of possible criminal culpability in the non-US jurisdiction. Even in the EU, there are answers to some contractor questions that could be used to prosecute a person for an action or expression that wouldn’t be illegal in the US. But that kind of situation is very unlikely for most all passengers, even those who have violated a law (or supplied evidence of) in the non-US jurisdiction when dealing with some questions.
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Old Oct 28, 17, 9:56 am
  #79  
 
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I just have these images of famous people getting interviewed. You know... security reasons.

"What kind of name is 'Middleton?"
"Why did you decide to become a Duchess?"
"What is the money like?"
"How do you get along with your boss?"
"What sort of classes did you take to become a Duchess?"
"Were they difficult?"
"What was you most difficult class?"
"Why are you flying in business class?"
"How far is Buckingham Palace from the airport?"
"Who was your school headmaster?"
"What are the names of your children and pets? Who is looking after them right now?"

[writes SSSS on boarding card]
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Old Oct 28, 17, 11:36 am
  #80  
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Originally Posted by Mats View Post
I just have these images of famous people getting interviewed. You know... security reasons.

"What kind of name is 'Middleton?"
"Why did you decide to become a Duchess?"
"What is the money like?"
"How do you get along with your boss?"
"What sort of classes did you take to become a Duchess?"
"Were they difficult?"
"What was you most difficult class?"
"Why are you flying in business class?"
"How far is Buckingham Palace from the airport?"
"Who was your school headmaster?"
"What are the names of your children and pets? Who is looking after them right now?"

[writes SSSS on boarding card]
Having an armed security detail to the plane (and sometimes on board) and flying the flag carrier of your own familyís country as a representative of the country is effectively acting as a bypass for avoiding this nonsense. At least it is in Europe.
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Old Oct 28, 17, 12:53 pm
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Originally Posted by Mats View Post
I just have these images of famous people getting interviewed. You know... security reasons.

"What kind of name is 'Middleton?"
"Why did you decide to become a Duchess?"
"What is the money like?"
"How do you get along with your boss?"
"What sort of classes did you take to become a Duchess?"
"Were they difficult?"
"What was you most difficult class?"
"Why are you flying in business class?"
"How far is Buckingham Palace from the airport?"
"Who was your school headmaster?"
"What are the names of your children and pets? Who is looking after them right now?"

[writes SSSS on boarding card]


This could be fun imagining the scenario with various celebrities and political figures! Could make an SNL skit out of the concept.
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Old Oct 28, 17, 1:05 pm
  #82  
 
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"Your last name is Arendellian. Say something in Arendellese."
"Other than angry snowmen, who lives in your ice palace with you?"
"Do you like being an ice princess? What is most enjoyable for you?"
"What did you have to eat in the ice palace? What was the best food you had there?"
"Who was your headmaster in form 4?"
"How many people work for your company?"

(Notes that Elsa is chilly in responses to questions, using cryokinetic powers, wearing a spiky icicle dress but it is 32F. Clothing inappropriate for departure/destination - SSSS)
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Old Oct 28, 17, 5:44 pm
  #83  
 
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Originally Posted by iluv2fly View Post
I can let you know in about five hours.
How did it go? Any issues ?
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Old Oct 28, 17, 11:27 pm
  #84  
 
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Originally Posted by JDiver View Post
The procedures are similar to those American Airlines has been using at certain European (e.g. Amsterdam, London Heathrow) and Colombia, designed and carried out by both contract agents of ICTS (formed by ex-Israeli Shin Bet and El Al personnel).

The questions often seem personal and picayune, extending to details about your visit ("where and what did you eat?" "Describe your neighborhood", etc. These are likely as much to "read" your response as to ascertain verifying details. Failure to respond or upset, snappy remarks have earned "SSSS" boarding pass imprints on new boarding passes with AA; staff are empowered to do this.
Having flown from Israel many times, the system is nothing like the experiences listed here.

The few times I have flown UA from MUC over the years, the contracted security asking the inane questions could not even speak German. Considering the diversity of passengers transiting at FRA, CDG and other main European hubs to the US, I wonder how they will manage the language issue.

When I am questioned in American accent in English in my own country and am told that I am not permitted to reply in my own native language, yes, I do become more reserved and quiet. Sometimes I have to mentally translate in my head exactly what an American is asking, as the grammar and accent are difficult to understand.
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Old Oct 29, 17, 5:22 am
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How's "no ingliish" for an answer? How many XXX speakers are there at say, the CDG AA desk?

XXX = anything but English and the local language. Latvian, Finnish, Icelandic, Greek, Hungarian, Serbian, etc, etc - and these are just some select European ones.
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Old Oct 29, 17, 7:16 am
  #86  
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The laptop questions have cycled in and out for years. I had it a coons age ago out of a European Airport now forgotten.

Is this your laptop?
Who bought it, you or your company?
Have you had it repaired?
Etc.
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Old Oct 29, 17, 8:45 am
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I can hardly wait to see what happens on our return to the US here in about a month. We’ll returning home starting in Dubai flying DXB>CDG>ATL>SAT. That’s after 20 some days visiting Italy, Egypt, Jordan, Oman, and UAE. I assume if we get guestioned a lot it’ll be in CDG but not sure how that’ll work as we’re not checking in there just transiting/connecting from AF to DL.
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Old Oct 29, 17, 11:19 am
  #88  
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Originally Posted by IAHUArunner View Post
How did it go? Any issues ?
Well, I flew SIN-HKG that day on UA but there wasn't any additional questions/issues. Probably because it was inter-Asia. I would have thought that since it is a USA carrier that they would do something.

However, I then flew HKG-ORD. When I arrived at the gate for boarding, the UA agent asked me two questions while waiting in line:

Did you pack your bag?
Did anyone give you anything?

Having answered no, she then said that now a security agent needs to ask you some additional questions.

Security agent comes and asks:

Why are you going to ORD? (I live there)
How long were you in HKG? (Two hours)

No looking in bag or anything physical with me.

He then puts a purple security sticker on my passport and tells me not to remove it. Ironically, after he put it on, nobody asked to see it.

I felt so much safer!
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Old Oct 30, 17, 6:14 am
  #89  
 
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Originally Posted by greggarious View Post
This is interesting to me.

As a US citizen, I'm allowed to return and not technically required to answer questions from CBP.

But this seems like a loophole: if you don't answer additional questions, you can't get on the plane.

I would assume this could face a legal challenge.
You're correct, you don't have to answer questions from CBP. That's your call, and you have to weigh up your 'rights' against the additional search and delay.

Keep in mind however that if you're travelling from Paris, for example, the questions are not being asked by CBP. They're being asked by an employee either of the airline or a contracted security company. If you are seen to be excessively obstructionist, they will SSSS you, and delay you for ... oh probably until just after it's too late to board your plane. The SSSS search will happen, you can't get out of that.
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Old Oct 30, 17, 3:26 pm
  #90  
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Originally Posted by Craig View Post
You're correct, you don't have to answer questions from CBP. That's your call, and you have to weigh up your 'rights' against the additional search and delay.

Keep in mind however that if you're travelling from Paris, for example, the questions are not being asked by CBP. They're being asked by an employee either of the airline or a contracted security company. If you are seen to be excessively obstructionist, they will SSSS you, and delay you for ... oh probably until just after it's too late to board your plane. The SSSS search will happen, you can't get out of that.
The above sounds more akin to scare-mongering than akin to how things generally go.

CDG has CBP employees sometimes doing some of the questioning one way or another, but itís most commonly the airlines and their contractorsí employees doing this ridiculous stuff rather than government employees.
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