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Electronic devices ban Europe to the US [merged threads]

Electronic devices ban Europe to the US [merged threads]

Old Jun 10, 17, 10:38 am
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Originally Posted by FL390 View Post
New article that addresses the batteries in the hold issues: http://thehill.com/policy/transporta...ght-laptop-ban



The last line is the most chilling. I think John Kelly will be responsible for more deaths on American soil than any terrorist attack since 9/11 if he institutes this.


This puff piece is currently on Drudge report highlighting how scary the threat is and how the TSA will save us: http://baltimore.cbslocal.com/2017/0...son-kicks-off/


I'm pretty sure a pencil can take down an airplane when attached to an explosive. Between in seat power and the lighting in the bathrooms there is no shortage of electrical sources on a plane.
And not to mention that the BEA is looking at an overheating iPhone as the proximate cause to the MS804 crash.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/faulty-phon...rs-say-1600963

I'm sure that the TSA will claim that it was an explosive, but that doesn't fit as the aircraft suffered from cascading failures, and not a sudden event.
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Old Jun 10, 17, 5:05 pm
  #1172  
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Originally Posted by fgirard View Post
And not to mention that the BEA is looking at an overheating iPhone as the proximate cause to the MS804 crash.

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/faulty-phon...rs-say-1600963

I'm sure that the TSA will claim that it was an explosive, but that doesn't fit as the aircraft suffered from cascading failures, and not a sudden event.
Some investigators claim trace explosives were found on some passengers. Of course according to TSA trace explosive testing that could be nothing more than hand lotion. Looks like the French investigators might be on the
right path.
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Old Jun 10, 17, 5:19 pm
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First victim of the uncertainty for me: Unavoidable international travel in J booked (three ppl), routed with an extra stop through Vancouver on AC metal for all North America travel (with possible land-side connection via Seattle in case of any policy changes). It would have been three United tickets otherwise.
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Old Jun 10, 17, 6:02 pm
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Originally Posted by Boggie Dog View Post
Some investigators claim trace explosives were found on some passengers. Of course according to TSA trace explosive testing that could be nothing more than hand lotion. Looks like the French investigators might be on the
right path.
Part of that has to do with the fact that the flight departed a French airport (CDG), and the aircraft manufacturer (Airbus) is based in France. Therefore it is imperative to determine the actual cause because if it was terrorism, then questions would be about the security process in CDG. Or, if it was determined to be a mechanical fault that caused the crash, there would be valid concerns from around the world about the safety of the A320 family.

Therefore, the BEA has a mandate to rule out mechanical (manufacturing and maintenance related) and terrorism. The same would apply if the aircraft was manufactured in the US or the aircraft departed from the US. But, then again, DHS would probably claim terrorism, even though it is a clear mechanical failure.
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Old Jun 11, 17, 1:25 pm
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Originally Posted by susiesan View Post
Anyone know how many airports in Europe have direct flights to the US? What's the count? if it is less than 71 then what other countries/areas could be involved?
AFAIK, it's less than 71; my quick checks of Google Flights show around 40-50 based on nonstops from WAS/NYC/CHI/ATL/PHL/CLT. Depends on how you define "Europe," though; some of the ME might count. I suppose there could also be some airlines Google Flights doesn't search.
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Old Jun 11, 17, 3:00 pm
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Is the ban on cameras regardless of size? Does something like Panasonic Lumix ZS100 (4.35 x 2.54 x 1.74 inch) have to be checked in?
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Old Jun 11, 17, 6:15 pm
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Originally Posted by TObject View Post
Is the ban on cameras regardless of size? Does something like Panasonic Lumix ZS100 (4.35 x 2.54 x 1.74 inch) have to be checked in?
I think if they do put in a ban, you can't assume anything bigger than a smart phone getting through.

Not just the footprint of the device but the thickness of it.

So not only point and shoot cameras but things like battery packs and portable hard drives. I have one that is a smaller footprint than my iPhone 6S Plus. But it's about 3 times as thick. I take one to store my DSLR RAW files.
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Old Jun 11, 17, 6:47 pm
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This demo needs to be shown to all the idiots backing this ban at DHS. Chris Boden of The Geek Group based in Grand Rapids, Michigan shows a local news crew what can happen when a happens when a 3S LiPo battery is ruptured. They asked him about the dangers if LiIon and LiPo batteries after the JetBlue flight diverted there earlier in the week. While they used a nail in a board to rupture the battery the same could happen to a phone or tablet that gets smashed in a seat when the seat back is moved into or out of the reclining position.


and the news story which it aired in:

http://www.wzzm13.com/news/local/met...pids/444572223

Note I've been watching Chris's almost daily blog for many years and at times he can be a bit over the top, very un-PC, and swear like a sailor at times if you decide to watch any of his other blog videos.
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Old Jun 11, 17, 7:38 pm
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Originally Posted by exerda View Post
AFAIK, it's less than 71; my quick checks of Google Flights show around 40-50 based on nonstops from WAS/NYC/CHI/ATL/PHL/CLT. Depends on how you define "Europe," though; some of the ME might count. I suppose there could also be some airlines Google Flights doesn't search.
Don't forget the Orlando-area airports. I know there are a few airlines that only run excursion-y services there, so it's possible that you've got a few secondary airports that would "pop" on this. MIA/FLL might also generate one or two others, but I'm pretty sure that either Orlando International or Orlando Sanford are more likely to kick out your odd pairings. LAS would be the other...from what I can tell, Thomas Cook flies STN-MCO and STN-LAS but nothing out of STN to the "main" airports.

Edit: Using Wikipedia's pages, I get the following airports that seem to have service to MCO or LAS but none of the "usual suspects" elsewhere in the US:
-London Stanstead
-Cologne/Bonn
-Belfast International (I was pretty sure I remembered this as a very odd VS pair)

-Glasgow only has seasonal service to JFK/PHL in addition to MCO, so might not have popped on a search.

Adding BOS to the mix, there are a few airports in the Canary Islands (Ponta Delgaga, Terceira) to speak of as well. My best guess, therefore, is that a broader search might shake out a few more...so perhaps bump it to somewhere in the 50-60 range depending on how you define "Europe" (e.g. how does one count airpots in Turkey and Russia? I know that AS had, at one point, service to Vladivostok). Iceland is also a fun edge case (I'm reminded of the eternal fights over whether a "North American" event could be held there since half of the island was on the North American continent).

Last edited by GrayAnderson; Jun 11, 17 at 8:01 pm
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Old Jun 11, 17, 8:53 pm
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Originally Posted by LtKernelPanic View Post
This demo needs to be shown to all the idiots backing this ban at DHS. Chris Boden of The Geek Group based in Grand Rapids, Michigan shows a local news crew what can happen when a happens when a 3S LiPo battery is ruptured. They asked him about the dangers if LiIon and LiPo batteries after the JetBlue flight diverted there earlier in the week. While they used a nail in a board to rupture the battery the same could happen to a phone or tablet that gets smashed in a seat when the seat back is moved into or out of the reclining position.
Came home from LHR yesterday. The Delta/Virgin check-in area had signs up on the dangers of lithium batteries more prominently than I remember seeing in other airports and at other times and had FAs on a couple of the legs repeatedly discourage people from putting laptops/tablets in seat back pockets. It made me wonder if there was a new safety initiative going on behind the scenes or if it was just a coincidence.
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Old Jun 11, 17, 9:53 pm
  #1181  
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Originally Posted by LtKernelPanic View Post
This demo needs to be shown to all the idiots backing this ban at DHS. Chris Boden of The Geek Group based in Grand Rapids, Michigan shows a local news crew what can happen when a happens when a 3S LiPo battery is ruptured. They asked him about the dangers if LiIon and LiPo batteries after the JetBlue flight diverted there earlier in the week. While they used a nail in a board to rupture the battery the same could happen to a phone or tablet that gets smashed in a seat when the seat back is moved into or out of the reclining position.

Captain's Blog 5 31 2017 LiPo Fire for a news spot - YouTube

and the news story which it aired in:

http://www.wzzm13.com/news/local/met...pids/444572223

Note I've been watching Chris's almost daily blog for many years and at times he can be a bit over the top, very un-PC, and swear like a sailor at times if you decide to watch any of his other blog videos.
That's LiPo, not Li-Ion. LiPo is much more prone to nasty stuff. And a proper charger knows to quit charging when it's charged.
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Old Jun 11, 17, 10:30 pm
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Correct. LiPos are much nastier but a lot of devices are using them instead of Li-Ion batteries. I know Apple's MacBook, MacBook Air, and MacBook Pro line all use lithium-polymer batteries and I suspect other manufacturers who make light weight/ultra portables also use them since they can be molded around internal components.
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Old Jun 12, 17, 6:48 am
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Israel Successfully Hacked ISIS Computers; Trump Leaked It to the Russians per NYT

http://www.haaretz.com/us-news/1.795260

Israeli cyber unit managed to penetrate Islamic State bombmakers' cell in Syria; intel led to laptop flight ban

According to the report, the information was so good that it allowed the United States to learn that the terror cell was working on explosives that could fool airport security by passing as a laptop battery.

According to the report, the information helped support a ban since March on carrying electronics such as laptops on incoming flights from number of predominantly Muslim countries to the United States and Britain.

Last edited by essxjay; Jun 12, 17 at 8:58 am Reason: readability; edit thread title
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Old Jun 15, 17, 8:37 pm
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Looks like the Europeans are pushing back hard. They are not playing ball with TSA.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/europes...rch-1497469519
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Old Jun 15, 17, 9:19 pm
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Originally Posted by susiesan View Post
Looks like the Europeans are pushing back hard. They are not playing ball with TSA.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/europes...rch-1497469519

Paywall.
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