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Electronic devices ban Europe to the US [merged threads]

Electronic devices ban Europe to the US [merged threads]

Old May 12, 17, 11:36 am
  #346  
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Originally Posted by sbrower View Post
Genuine question to those who have these restrictions.

1. When you go to dinner you don't leave your laptop in your hotel room?
2. When you go to the gym, you carry your laptop from station to station?
3. When you go to the pool you have the laptop on the deck near your hands?
4. If you are single you take your laptop with you to other people's rooms if you have a meaningful encounter, which means you had the laptop with you in the bar when you met the person?
The key part to my statement was "when in transit," presumably because there is a higher risk of loss/theft when our laptops are all packed up and we are in public/crowded spaces. There are other specific guidelines around what we have to do in instances where we can/should be separated from our equipment.

1. Must be powered off (HDD is encrypted) and stored in the in-room safe.
2. Same as #1 .
3. Same as #1 .
4. Same as #1 . But I'm not single so I wouldn't know.

The policy is actually quite reasonable, sensible, and well-intentioned. Checking a bag with a laptop in it for an int'l flight is essentially putting your equipment in the hands of an unknown person/persons for an extended period of time where it will be easy to access and also out of your sight. If someone steals the laptop from my hotel room, I'll know within a few hours at most. If someone steals it from a checked bag (or if the bag is just lost), I won't even know what city it was last in and it could be nearly a full day before I know it's gone.

Originally Posted by whitearrow View Post
Why all laptops and not just large ones (how much explosive could you possibly fit in a thin and light laptop and still have it turn on, much less an e-ink Kindle or an iPad)? Will this ban include noise-cancelling earbuds? What about "electronics" that have no battery, like hard drives, flash drives, a Roku, etc? What about my 1 inch long Fitbit or my one inch squre iPod nano? What about my watch, for that matter? (Does anyone have a watch without some kind of battery in it?) How small do the items have to get before this is just insanely stupid?

Why just international flights or flights from Europe? Won't the terrorists just switch their plans to domestic flights?
Was just about to post both of these points. I wonder how much other items like NC headphones will be impacted. Can't wait for my next 8 hour flight fiddling with the crappy headsets the airline provides.

And we already have people in this thread and my office talking about just taking different routings back into the US. It's stupid.

Originally Posted by notquiteaff View Post
The easiest and cheapest would presumably be to destroy (erase?) the hard disk (they have backups in the cloud, right?) and then check the laptops.
I suppose that's an option, but again, a lot of wasted effort for a solution to a problem that only exists because of pure stupidity. There's also the lost productivity of anything we could be doing on the flight itself.

I suppose at least satellite wifi congestion won't be as bad anymore...
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Old May 12, 17, 11:39 am
  #347  
 
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Originally Posted by chollie View Post
So we've proved we can survive it. What the long term impact is, only time will tell. I think it's particularly alarming that there have been reports that TSA is even talking about prohibiting medical devices like CPAPs and breast pumps.
I'm hoping this nonsense goes away before I go to Europe in 3 months. I really don't want to get hassled over my insulin pump and supplies.

This all seems like a waste of time since people can carry on whatever they want on domestic flights. It's not like a terrorist wouldn't just build a bomb here and get on a plane.
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Old May 12, 17, 11:39 am
  #348  
 
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Exclamation Does the laptop ban apply to all inbound international flights to the US then?

Please can you confirm this was taken at CVG and get in touch about this picture? You can reach me via email marisa[at]flightchic.com. I'm an aviation industry journalist following developments on this electronics ban and its implications to flight safety, security and passenger well-being. The Delta sign shown does not say European flights. That means it would apply to ALL flights inbound to the US. Today is May 12, which means the ban takes immediate effect. This contradicts all news we've had so far. I need to confirm this is all accurate, please.

Thanks for your help

Marisa

Originally Posted by SFO 1K View Post
Seen today in CVG

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Old May 12, 17, 11:45 am
  #349  
 
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I fly from the UK to the US once or twice a month, this is going to be a nightmare! Flying on Sunday fingers crossed no ban before then!
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Old May 12, 17, 11:49 am
  #350  
 
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Originally Posted by saltydog75 View Post
Well said, whitearrow. The sensible approach is to focus on who's flying, not what they're carrying with them. 99.99% of travelers can be easily identified as not a threat. All we need to do is come up with some sort of combined EU/US vetting system akin to Global Entry to identify those trusted travelers. Let them take all of their electronics on board. Anyone who we can't be sure about, let them check their electronics, ship them, not travel, etc. Or, maybe there's some sort of more intensive screening process. Everyone who's known and trusted go over there. Everyone else, come over here and go through this intensive screening process. No big deal. It's ridiculous to impose a one size fits all policy when we can fairly easily separate passengers into discrete groups and apply sensible rules to each group.

I hope that's the outcome here. If the EU refuses to play by these rules, maybe it'll force the US to negotiate down to some sort of trusted traveler system that will both keep everyone secure while keeping air travel reasonably pleasant and productive.
This in practice would mean discriminating against and restricting the travel of brown muslims (or people with such a background).

That is not something anyone should support.
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Old May 12, 17, 11:51 am
  #351  
 
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Originally Posted by spd476 View Post
I'm hoping this nonsense goes away before I go to Europe in 3 months. I really don't want to get hassled over my insulin pump and supplies.

This all seems like a waste of time since people can carry on whatever they want on domestic flights. It's not like a terrorist wouldn't just build a bomb here and get on a plane.
Dollars to donuts that TSA is waiting to see how this goes before introducing it on US domestic flights as well as flights leaving the US.
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Old May 12, 17, 11:53 am
  #352  
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Originally Posted by saltydog75 View Post
Well said, whitearrow. The sensible approach is to focus on who's flying, not what they're carrying with them. 99.99% of travelers can be easily identified as not a threat. All we need to do is come up with some sort of combined EU/US vetting system akin to Global Entry to identify those trusted travelers. Let them take all of their electronics on board. Anyone who we can't be sure about, let them check their electronics, ship them, not travel, etc. Or, maybe there's some sort of more intensive screening process. Everyone who's known and trusted go over there. Everyone else, come over here and go through this intensive screening process. No big deal. It's ridiculous to impose a one size fits all policy when we can fairly easily separate passengers into discrete groups and apply sensible rules to each group.

I hope that's the outcome here. If the EU refuses to play by these rules, maybe it'll force the US to negotiate down to some sort of trusted traveler system that will both keep everyone secure while keeping air travel reasonably pleasant and productive.
That is a failed approach -- the failed underwear bomber, the failed shoe bomber, other terrorists/terrorist wannabes and even some 9/11 terrorists -- have been cleared to fly despite being subjected to the voodoo "security" of profiling. And we have had people who cleared background checks -- even enough to be the national security advisor of the President of the US -- and yet failed to follow "the rules".
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Old May 12, 17, 11:53 am
  #353  
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Originally Posted by gooselee View Post
I suppose that's an option, but again, a lot of wasted effort for a solution to a problem that only exists because of pure stupidity. There's also the lost productivity of anything we could be doing on the flight itself.
Yeah. I wasn't thinking of destroying/erasing the disk as a permanent solution, only for those of your folks who currently are overseas and need a quick solution. Seems like a cheaper/better/easier alternative to rebooking or rerouting. Laptops die for other reasons, so people ought to be prepared for that situation.
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Old May 12, 17, 11:55 am
  #354  
 
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Originally Posted by saltydog75 View Post
Well said, whitearrow. The sensible approach is to focus on who's flying, not what they're carrying with them. 99.99% of travelers can be easily identified as not a threat. All we need to do is come up with some sort of combined EU/US vetting system akin to Global Entry to identify those trusted travelers. Let them take all of their electronics on board. Anyone who we can't be sure about, let them check their electronics, ship them, not travel, etc. Or, maybe there's some sort of more intensive screening process. Everyone who's known and trusted go over there. Everyone else, come over here and go through this intensive screening process.
That would be ideal. And for the folks who are going to have to check their electronics because they aren't trusted travelers:

1. Allow the passengers to use a hard-sided case like a Pelican case for their checked electronics, and allow a REAL lock to be put on that case after the contents have undergone the necessary preflight inspections (this is the procedure we currently follow for checked firearms on US domestic flights). No wussy TSA-Approved locks that anyone and their brother can open!

2. Modify to the CoC so that loss or damage of high-value items that now must be placed in checked baggage is fully covered.

People would be a lot less upset by this new policy if they knew light-fingered baggage handlers wouldn't be able to open their case and steal their goods, their electronics would be packaged in a truly protective case, and they would be fairly compensated in the event of any loss or damage.

If the EU refuses to play by these rules, maybe it'll force the US to negotiate down to some sort of trusted traveler system that will both keep everyone secure while keeping air travel reasonably pleasant and productive.
I'm certainly rooting for that outcome!
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Old May 12, 17, 11:56 am
  #355  
 
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Right now, the middle-eastern carriers with the ban provide gate-checking and overall a decent service to handle the banned laptop. Overall it added 10 extra minutes each before and after I landed to handle the laptop thing.

But I'm not sure if every budget airline from Europe will offer this service. They might actually force you to just check the bag and charge you for the checked bag. Plus, how will this be handled on transfers specially on seperate tickets. Will they force you to go through immigration and get your bag checked. Or you just miss the flight if you arrive on a seperate ticket with laptop in the carryon.
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Old May 12, 17, 11:56 am
  #356  
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I wonder what actions Israel is taking. They're the poster child for successful, if often onerous, security. Are they getting on board with this? I haven't heard anything yet.
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Old May 12, 17, 12:10 pm
  #357  
 
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I frequently travel totally empty-handed, so how do I check a laptop/tablet?

I frequently travel totally empty-handed. As in I would literally walk into the airport with just a laptop or tablet in my hand. No carry-on bag, no backpack, no checked bag, no man purse. (mostly because I can ship everything I need on my trip via FedEx Priority Overnight for free, which my company pays for, up to 45 pounds)

So... if I do that now on international flights that do not allow laptops and tablets, how will I check the tablet or laptop? Almost all the 20 flights that I've taken during the last 11 months have been 10 to 14 hours long...
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Old May 12, 17, 12:13 pm
  #358  
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http://mashable.com/2017/05/12/delta...nning-laptops/

"A Delta spokesman said the sign was put up in error at the Cincinnati International Airport and has since been removed. He said a Delta employee posted the sign after "information was communicated in error.""
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Old May 12, 17, 12:13 pm
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Take a bag
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Old May 12, 17, 12:19 pm
  #360  
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Originally Posted by FlightChic View Post
Please can you confirm this was taken at CVG and get in touch about this picture? You can reach me via email marisa[at]flightchic.com. I'm an aviation industry journalist following developments on this electronics ban and its implications to flight safety, security and passenger well-being. The Delta sign shown does not say European flights. That means it would apply to ALL flights inbound to the US. Today is May 12, which means the ban takes immediate effect. This contradicts all news we've had so far. I need to confirm this is all accurate, please.

Thanks for your help

Marisa
The article currently on your website seems to attribute the photo to a twitter poster, with the photo then being found here on FT.

Might be worth clarifying that the photo actually belongs to SFO 1K, if that's the case (I assume he/she was posting a photo they originally took).

OTOH, looks like this thread is now being noticed by other media outlets as a result of that picture.
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