TSA wants to get more intimate when doing passenger pat downs.
#556
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 38,320
https://docs.justia.com/cases/federa...0013/357297/70
I think this is it, and I have no subscriptions.
Congrats to the plaintiff and good luck. If I read this right and especially if he has any additional success, risk of screeners being sued individually might deter the sort of abuses that we hear about so often.
I think this is it, and I have no subscriptions.
Congrats to the plaintiff and good luck. If I read this right and especially if he has any additional success, risk of screeners being sued individually might deter the sort of abuses that we hear about so often.
#557
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,526
Amy Van Dyken-Rouen is being mistreated again:
This is her second report of mistreatment in a couple of weeks. I can't fathom why she continues to fly.
Further, many reports today of people being sexually assaulted because of medications/disabilities (female teen-age diabetic), film needing hand screening, paper IDs, and a whole range of other "crimes".
Hey @flylaxairport UR @tsa is beyond RUDE!! Waited over 10 min for a female assist, then she was as SLOW as she could. Almost missed flight
Further, many reports today of people being sexually assaulted because of medications/disabilities (female teen-age diabetic), film needing hand screening, paper IDs, and a whole range of other "crimes".
#558
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,425
The Judge really takes the TSA's arguments apart in this ruling, in many locations.
"Strains credulity", cites statutes that are "simply inapplicable" to the case, striking people in the groin is not "necessary, or even desirable, to protect national security", and, "At no point does [TSA] address these relatively straightforward allegations", "[TSA]'s oratorical calisthenics appear calculated to avoid simple questions with obvious answers".
Guess that's what you get with googlin' Francine in charge of the legal department.
"Strains credulity", cites statutes that are "simply inapplicable" to the case, striking people in the groin is not "necessary, or even desirable, to protect national security", and, "At no point does [TSA] address these relatively straightforward allegations", "[TSA]'s oratorical calisthenics appear calculated to avoid simple questions with obvious answers".
Guess that's what you get with googlin' Francine in charge of the legal department.
#559
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: DFW
Posts: 28,010
The Judge really takes the TSA's arguments apart in this ruling, in many locations.
"Strains credulity", cites statutes that are "simply inapplicable" to the case, striking people in the groin is not "necessary, or even desirable, to protect national security", and, "At no point does [TSA] address these relatively straightforward allegations", "[TSA]'s oratorical calisthenics appear calculated to avoid simple questions with obvious answers".
Guess that's what you get with googlin' Francine in charge of the legal department.
"Strains credulity", cites statutes that are "simply inapplicable" to the case, striking people in the groin is not "necessary, or even desirable, to protect national security", and, "At no point does [TSA] address these relatively straightforward allegations", "[TSA]'s oratorical calisthenics appear calculated to avoid simple questions with obvious answers".
Guess that's what you get with googlin' Francine in charge of the legal department.
#560
Moderator: Travel Safety/Security, Travel Tools, California, Los Angeles; FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: LAX
Programs: oneword Emerald
Posts: 20,475
Moderator's Note:
Recent posts discussing screening of transgender individuals were moved to the following thread:
TWA884
Travel Safety/Security co-moderator
TWA884
Travel Safety/Security co-moderator
#561
Join Date: Apr 2015
Programs: AA Gold, Enterprise PLT, Marriott Gold
Posts: 604
I will say to me it's ridiculous how much they feel you to see if they can find something. My friend's gf has an insulin pump so she has to get patted down, they ran their hands on her butt cheek a good 4-5 times, not a crevice or something that can kind of hide something, literally her butt cheek. I am not suggesting the TSA worker was getting her rocks off but it seemed ridiculously excessive... if it's not clear after a passover or two that there is nothing there, I do not see how you have a job.
#562
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: An NPR mind living in a Fox News world
Posts: 14,153
#563
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 12
Bivens claim approved -- proceeding to trial !
Hi Jon and all Flyertalk folks,
Defendant's motion to dismiss was DENIED -- I'm heading to trial (or dueling summary judgement claims). I read in-depth from Jon Corbett's and many other's cases, as well as the appeals, and structured my arguments accordingly, so I stand on the shoulders of many heroes who have taught me methods to achieve what I've succeeded at (so far). My first amended complaint was very specific, well-founded, and thoroughly researched (by me) beforehand.
Believe me, I know this isn't a done deal, but we may be witnessing new precedent in the making! Kinda cool, eh? This doesn't open the door for wild lawsuits against the TSA! This is a very, very specific and egregious case (gratuitous force forcefully striking me, inappropriately, during a pat-down), but it's important that someone stand up for our Constitutional rights.
Thanks for everyone's interest, and I'll let you know what happens next.
Capt. JL
Defendant's motion to dismiss was DENIED -- I'm heading to trial (or dueling summary judgement claims). I read in-depth from Jon Corbett's and many other's cases, as well as the appeals, and structured my arguments accordingly, so I stand on the shoulders of many heroes who have taught me methods to achieve what I've succeeded at (so far). My first amended complaint was very specific, well-founded, and thoroughly researched (by me) beforehand.
Believe me, I know this isn't a done deal, but we may be witnessing new precedent in the making! Kinda cool, eh? This doesn't open the door for wild lawsuits against the TSA! This is a very, very specific and egregious case (gratuitous force forcefully striking me, inappropriately, during a pat-down), but it's important that someone stand up for our Constitutional rights.
Thanks for everyone's interest, and I'll let you know what happens next.
Capt. JL
Capt.,
Jon Corbett here. As a non-attorney I can't give you legal advice... I'm just a lowly 3rd Year law student who has sued the TSA 5 times including petitions to appeal all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court for 3 of them. So the below is merely my observations based on my experiences and should not be construed as legal advice.
I've read your complaint and I expect your complaint to be dismissed for a variety of reasons. I encourage you to seek counsel if you'd like to proceed, because you may have a case, but it is very much not an easy one to make, and, respectfully, you're not making it. Please don't get me wrong: I believe your story and I very much hope you prevail. It's just not, in my legally unqualified opinion, happening based on your current filings.
Good luck,
--Jon
Jon Corbett here. As a non-attorney I can't give you legal advice... I'm just a lowly 3rd Year law student who has sued the TSA 5 times including petitions to appeal all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court for 3 of them. So the below is merely my observations based on my experiences and should not be construed as legal advice.
I've read your complaint and I expect your complaint to be dismissed for a variety of reasons. I encourage you to seek counsel if you'd like to proceed, because you may have a case, but it is very much not an easy one to make, and, respectfully, you're not making it. Please don't get me wrong: I believe your story and I very much hope you prevail. It's just not, in my legally unqualified opinion, happening based on your current filings.
Good luck,
--Jon
#564
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,526
Hi Jon and all Flyertalk folks,
Defendant's motion to dismiss was DENIED -- I'm heading to trial (or dueling summary judgement claims). I read in-depth from Jon Corbett's and many other's cases, as well as the appeals, and structured my arguments accordingly, so I stand on the shoulders of many heroes who have taught me methods to achieve what I've succeeded at (so far). My first amended complaint was very specific, well-founded, and thoroughly researched (by me) beforehand.
Believe me, I know this isn't a done deal, but we may be witnessing new precedent in the making! Kinda cool, eh? This doesn't open the door for wild lawsuits against the TSA! This is a very, very specific and egregious case (gratuitous force forcefully striking me, inappropriately, during a pat-down), but it's important that someone stand up for our Constitutional rights.
Thanks for everyone's interest, and I'll let you know what happens next.
Capt. JL
Defendant's motion to dismiss was DENIED -- I'm heading to trial (or dueling summary judgement claims). I read in-depth from Jon Corbett's and many other's cases, as well as the appeals, and structured my arguments accordingly, so I stand on the shoulders of many heroes who have taught me methods to achieve what I've succeeded at (so far). My first amended complaint was very specific, well-founded, and thoroughly researched (by me) beforehand.
Believe me, I know this isn't a done deal, but we may be witnessing new precedent in the making! Kinda cool, eh? This doesn't open the door for wild lawsuits against the TSA! This is a very, very specific and egregious case (gratuitous force forcefully striking me, inappropriately, during a pat-down), but it's important that someone stand up for our Constitutional rights.
Thanks for everyone's interest, and I'll let you know what happens next.
Capt. JL
#565
FlyerTalk Evangelist
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: DFW
Posts: 28,010
Hi Jon and all Flyertalk folks,
Defendant's motion to dismiss was DENIED -- I'm heading to trial (or dueling summary judgement claims). I read in-depth from Jon Corbett's and many other's cases, as well as the appeals, and structured my arguments accordingly, so I stand on the shoulders of many heroes who have taught me methods to achieve what I've succeeded at (so far). My first amended complaint was very specific, well-founded, and thoroughly researched (by me) beforehand.
Believe me, I know this isn't a done deal, but we may be witnessing new precedent in the making! Kinda cool, eh? This doesn't open the door for wild lawsuits against the TSA! This is a very, very specific and egregious case (gratuitous force forcefully striking me, inappropriately, during a pat-down), but it's important that someone stand up for our Constitutional rights.
Thanks for everyone's interest, and I'll let you know what happens next.
Capt. JL
Defendant's motion to dismiss was DENIED -- I'm heading to trial (or dueling summary judgement claims). I read in-depth from Jon Corbett's and many other's cases, as well as the appeals, and structured my arguments accordingly, so I stand on the shoulders of many heroes who have taught me methods to achieve what I've succeeded at (so far). My first amended complaint was very specific, well-founded, and thoroughly researched (by me) beforehand.
Believe me, I know this isn't a done deal, but we may be witnessing new precedent in the making! Kinda cool, eh? This doesn't open the door for wild lawsuits against the TSA! This is a very, very specific and egregious case (gratuitous force forcefully striking me, inappropriately, during a pat-down), but it's important that someone stand up for our Constitutional rights.
Thanks for everyone's interest, and I'll let you know what happens next.
Capt. JL
Good luck!
#566
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 12
News media picking up the story ...
Thanks for the good luck! (Again, this is a very specific situation, and I'm not being cavalier in my assumptions, at all.)
Here's a link from a law blog in the Washington Post:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...kpoint-search/
Here's a link from a law blog in the Washington Post:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...kpoint-search/
#567
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,425
Thanks for the good luck! (Again, this is a very specific situation, and I'm not being cavalier in my assumptions, at all.)
Here's a link from a law blog in the Washington Post:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...kpoint-search/
Here's a link from a law blog in the Washington Post:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...kpoint-search/
Used to be free, alas, now locked behind a pay wall after you view a limited number of articles.
#568
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,526
Btw, that link is to the Volokh Conspiracy site at the washington post. A great site for legal issues of the day, featuring articles written by practicing lawyers/law professors for other lawyers.
Used to be free, alas, now locked behind a pay wall after you view a limited number of articles.
Used to be free, alas, now locked behind a pay wall after you view a limited number of articles.
#569
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 3,526
Thanks for the good luck! (Again, this is a very specific situation, and I'm not being cavalier in my assumptions, at all.)
Here's a link from a law blog in the Washington Post:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...kpoint-search/
Here's a link from a law blog in the Washington Post:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/...kpoint-search/
that contact with Plaintiffs genitals, if any at all, was incidental and occurred through the course of a typical security pat-down.
#570
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 2,425
Could be interesting.