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TSA wants to get more intimate when doing passenger pat downs.

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TSA wants to get more intimate when doing passenger pat downs.

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Old Mar 20, 2017, 3:46 pm
  #196  
 
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Originally Posted by gsoltso
I can tell you, the "patdown" described in the article, is incorrect based upon every class I have taken and or taught for TSA. I can give no details, but this is either hokum, or the TSO was well outside the normal screening process.
Then there must be many screeners who go "well outside" the new procedure as I've read many reports of similar assaults on passengers.
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Old Mar 20, 2017, 4:17 pm
  #197  
 
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Originally Posted by WillCAD
That's like making the street address of the White House SSI. Every school child in this country, and most of the adults, know that the White House is located at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, Washington, DC. But if we made this common knowledge SSI, that would prevent The Terrorists from finding it, and the building would be safe forever!
LOL! Thank you for posting this because it reminds me that this did indeed happen. USSS and others wanted google to use overlays over the Capitol, the WH and the Naval Observatory when google maps went live. True story....
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Old Mar 21, 2017, 1:47 am
  #198  
 
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Originally Posted by DrunkCargo
Could it be argued that TSA is the deterrent so nobody would dare attempt to smuggle a "dangerous item" through security? This is proof screening works.
TSA has been 100% effective at preventing giraffes and elephants from boarding aircraft. I've heard lots of stories of emotional support animals (pigs, even!), but so far no one's gotten the aforementioned animals on-board.

Originally Posted by Boggie Dog
I think I would try shamming the screener, loud enough to get others attention. Making some enjoyable sounds while getting a grope down should do the trick.
I've done this, not quite THAT loud though. As the screener was putting his gloves on, I started flirting with him and saying, "I've been looking forward to this...all...night...long" as I wiggled my male bits in his direction. Fastest pat-down ever and he stayed miles away from man-land.
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Old Mar 21, 2017, 11:25 am
  #199  
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Originally Posted by petaluma1
From comments made @TSA and @AkTSA, something seems to be going on. Items that travelers have carried for months are being confiscated, foodstuffs are being confiscated - including candy at GSO - various other things that give one the idea that TSA is cracking down for some reason.
Red Team tests must be coming up. I wonder if they'll coincide with the spring work slowdown, er, TSA Pre recruitment effort. (I expect a similar fall effort, when TDCs start harassing folks with non-Real ID compliant ID, ahead of the actual deadline for accepting such IDs).

Somebody must have put out the word that if TSA doesn't score better than 5%, pax are really going to suffer.
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Old Mar 21, 2017, 12:15 pm
  #200  
 
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Originally Posted by chollie
Red Team tests must be coming up. I wonder if they'll coincide with the spring work slowdown, er, TSA Pre recruitment effort. (I expect a similar fall effort, when TDCs start harassing folks with non-Real ID compliant ID, ahead of the actual deadline for accepting such IDs).

Somebody must have put out the word that if TSA doesn't score better than 5%, pax are really going to suffer.
From what the DHS IG told a congressional committee, the tests have already begun and the public will be informed of the results.
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Old Mar 21, 2017, 12:20 pm
  #201  
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Originally Posted by petaluma1
From what the DHS IG told a congressional committee, the tests have already begun and the public will be informed of the results.
I'll believe it after it actually happens.
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Old Mar 21, 2017, 12:23 pm
  #202  
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You know, I wonder what the testing post-mortem is like.

In my workplace, if something goes badly wrong (ie, we 'fail'), there's a post-mortem and everyone ends up hearing what went wrong and what, specifically, has been done or will be done to prevent it from happening again.

Did TSA go back and inform the workforce about the reasons for their failures? For example, if half the failures were because TSOs didn't check out the bottom of pax feet, I would think that information would be passed on to the work force and pax would see a rise in TSO attention to the soles of their feet.

Were a significant number of Red Team failures attributable to contraband 'artfully concealed' in groins? And does that test reflect likely terrorist threats, based on our current intel?

After all, our latest threat seems to be from pax having access to their electronics in the plane cabin, not from what they are carrying in their crotches or bras.
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Old Mar 21, 2017, 12:39 pm
  #203  
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Originally Posted by chollie
You know, I wonder what the testing post-mortem is like.

In my workplace, if something goes badly wrong (ie, we 'fail'), there's a post-mortem and everyone ends up hearing what went wrong and what, specifically, has been done or will be done to prevent it from happening again.

Did TSA go back and inform the workforce about the reasons for their failures? For example, if half the failures were because TSOs didn't check out the bottom of pax feet, I would think that information would be passed on to the work force and pax would see a rise in TSO attention to the soles of their feet.

Were a significant number of Red Team failures attributable to contraband 'artfully concealed' in groins? And does that test reflect likely terrorist threats, based on our current intel?

After all, our latest threat seems to be from pax having access to their electronics in the plane cabin, not from what they are carrying in their crotches or bras.
When the 97% failure rate was revealed, I remember posting that I predicted that We, the People, would pay dearly for the TSA's transgressions. I hate being right. I suspect that the new sexual assaults were instituted as a morale-booster for the workforce to direct the problem at us rather than the TSA's incompetence. And, really, other than an actual strip search and/or body cavity search, there really isn't much else that the TSA can do to make their employees feel better about themselves. They've just about reached the limits of harassment.
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Old Mar 21, 2017, 1:20 pm
  #204  
 
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Originally Posted by Boggie Dog
I'll believe it after it actually happens.
Apparently, it's now required by law that the IG release the results of testing to the general public.
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Old Mar 21, 2017, 2:14 pm
  #205  
 
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Originally Posted by petaluma1
From what the DHS IG told a congressional committee, the tests have already begun and the public will be informed of the results.
the tests are over, the follow up phase and the reporting phase are under way.
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Old Mar 21, 2017, 2:23 pm
  #206  
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Originally Posted by petaluma1
Apparently, it's now required by law that the IG release the results of testing to the general public.
After being sanitized to what degree? The devil is in the details.

I would want to know how any failures occurred. What kind of test item was used and missed. What screening technology was used that failed. I think TSA should be required to show that their excessive pat downs mitigate the screening failures.
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Old Mar 21, 2017, 3:39 pm
  #207  
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Originally Posted by Boggie Dog
After being sanitized to what degree? The devil is in the details.

I would want to know how any failures occurred. What kind of test item was used and missed. What screening technology was used that failed. I think TSA should be required to show that their excessive pat downs mitigate the screening failures.
Except they likely don't. The biggest insult of TSA is that very little that they do actually enhances security. Arguably, much of it hurts actual security, and it can be argued that TSA has led to the deaths of thousands of Americans who have driven to a destination instead of flying due purely to the TSA security theater. And, most of what really does enhance security is pretty obvious (x-ray screening of baggage, WTMD, intelligence gathering, old fashioned police/detective work, etc.), and done in many countries already, without the histrionics and ridiculous invasiveness of TSA.
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Old Mar 21, 2017, 4:27 pm
  #208  
 
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Originally Posted by TheBOSman
Except they likely don't. The biggest insult of TSA is that very little that they do actually enhances security.
THIS! I don't have the highest security clearances by any stretch of the imagination, but I've never had to leave my bottle of water, take off my shoes, get groped to enter a federal building or military installation. I've never had the security guards / US Marshalls / AF MPs ever yell, bark, or otherwise be anything less than polite. I truly do believe the current (and past) TSA fiasco makes us LESS safe. The TSA's original mission was to reassure the flying public. I'd feel much more reassured with them gone from the airports.

9/11 won't happen again due to the armored cockpit doors *AND* passengers who aren't willing to take crap. In fact, passengers react to changing circumstances faster than TSA ever could, take a look at UA93. Before the WTC towers even collapsed, passengers became aware of what was going on *AND* changed their procedures to deal with this new threat. TSA simply can't react that quickly, no matter how hard they'd try. Their structure doesn't support it. There's no way for Washington DC to talk directly to the pax <deleted> immediately.

Just leave a WTMD and x-ray machine behind and let the pax self-police the thing, with a Page a LEO button nearby. You better believe pax aren't going to let anything slip by. Crowdsourcing has been used for quite a few other things today. No reason it couldn't work here. For that matter, you could outsource the x-ray machines to people on Amazon's Mechanical Turk, where you could have 10 different people look at a bag x-ray in under 10 seconds for $1 or less and let them Page the LEO.

Last edited by TWA884; Mar 22, 2017 at 3:49 pm Reason: Term not used in this forum; please refer to list in sticky thread.
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Old Mar 21, 2017, 5:00 pm
  #209  
 
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incontinence or sanitary protection. What will happen to elders wearing disposable diapers or females requiring bulky sanitary protection. Will they be subjected to MORE intimate exams to be sure of what is being concealed. This is not a joke. Many travelers with obvious and non obvious disabilities resulting in bathroom "issues" wear readily available products to prevent embarassing accidents. Does TSA have a new procedure for these travellers?

Last edited by sheegoes; Mar 21, 2017 at 5:06 pm
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Old Mar 21, 2017, 5:18 pm
  #210  
 
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Originally Posted by sheegoes
incontinence or sanitary protection. What will happen to elders wearing disposable diapers or females requiring bulky sanitary protection. Will they be subjected to MORE intimate exams to be sure of what is being concealed. This is not a joke. Many travelers with obvious and non obvious disabilities resulting in bathroom "issues" wear readily available products to prevent embarassing accidents. Does TSA have a new procedure for these travellers?
This is a question I have asked several times. Do they make these people remove these products to be tested? If not, then prodding is useless unless, as FliesWay2Much suggested, these patdowns are really for the purpose of trying to find explosive residue and not "dangerous items". As an added benefit, however, such products keep prodding fingers at bay - therefore, I would suggest that people wear them.
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