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-   -   Nigerian software engineer detained at JFK and given a test to prove he's an engineer (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate/1826412-nigerian-software-engineer-detained-jfk-given-test-prove-hes-engineer.html)

BSBD Mar 2, 2017 12:17 pm


Originally Posted by jkhuggins (Post 27980822)
Um, no.

Um, yes.

As I said, CBP could have handled it better - the approach was incompetent. I'm quite sure I made that clear.

My point, which you seem to have completely missed, was that there is no clear evidence that the "test" was given due to racial or nationality bias.

txflyer77 Mar 2, 2017 12:45 pm

I have a computer science degree and I'm a software engineer at a very high profile tech company. If you asked me to balance a binary search tree after a long-haul flight, I would fail.

rufflesinc Mar 2, 2017 2:06 pm


Originally Posted by jphripjah (Post 27979436)
In fairness to CBP here, there's an awful lot of visa fraud in Nigeria, including fraud specifically relating to people posing as professionals to get visas for short term work visits.

You'd think the US would 1) have computer records of its own visas and 2) be able to tell if it's own visas are fake.

People from undeveloped countries have higher overstay rates. They also happen to have darker skin.
No doubt the tan from working in the sun all day?

Loren Pechtel Mar 2, 2017 6:18 pm


Originally Posted by jkhuggins (Post 27980822)
Um, no.

Look, I teach computer science at a respected university. I actually understand the questions that were asked. I find it extraordinarily unlikely that the CBP officer actually understood the questions that he forced the detainee to answer, much less understood how to evaluate the answers. As the article states, it seems much more likely that the officer Googled "questions to ask a software engineer" and, when the answers provided by the detainee didn't match the webpage verbatim, declared the detainee had failed the test.

Even if you grant that the exam was legitimate (which it wasn't), how do you expect someone to perform on a technical exam when they've been awake for 24 hours on an airplane, then accused of lying to obtain their visa, then told to take an incredibly vague exam under the threat of deportation? Sheesh, my students have problems with these sorts of questions even when they're awake and have weeks to prepare for them.

If you're going to question someone's expertise, you'd better have expertise at least as great as the person you're questioning. CBP gets no pass on this one.

That makes a lot of sense. I've had an encounter with a teacher who didn't know the material and marked me wrong for not expressing things like the answer key when there were multiple valid ways of expressing the same concept.

Loren Pechtel Mar 2, 2017 6:25 pm


Originally Posted by txflyer77 (Post 27981552)
I have a computer science degree and I'm a software engineer at a very high profile tech company. If you asked me to balance a binary search tree after a long-haul flight, I would fail.

Balance a binary tree? I'd go to the bookcase second from the right, second? shelf and grab my copy of Knuth and look up how to do it. It's the sort of thing you use so rarely (I haven't used it since school) that it's not worth memorizing.

FliesWay2Much Mar 2, 2017 7:25 pm


Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel (Post 27982967)
Balance a binary tree? I'd go to the bookcase second from the right, second? shelf and grab my copy of Knuth and look up how to do it. It's the sort of thing you use so rarely (I haven't used it since school) that it's not worth memorizing.

I would be inclined to say something along the lines of: "You have no idea what you're asking me. Where exactly did you get your PhD and what was the title of your dissertation?"

txflyer77 Mar 2, 2017 8:04 pm


Originally Posted by FliesWay2Much (Post 27983205)
I would be inclined to say something along the lines of: "You have no idea what you're asking me. Where exactly did you get your PhD and what was the title of your dissertation?"

As a generally cranky US citizen, I imagine I'd end up saying something that would land me in the penalty box for a while. At least I know they'd have to let me in.

Loren Pechtel Mar 4, 2017 6:47 pm


Originally Posted by FliesWay2Much (Post 27983205)
I would be inclined to say something along the lines of: "You have no idea what you're asking me. Where exactly did you get your PhD and what was the title of your dissertation?"

Balancing a binary tree isn't Ph.D. level material. It's a perfectly reasonable thing for an older person to have encountered in school (although much less emphasis would be placed on that sort of thing these days, organized containers are now normally from the library or the database, not something you implement in your own code much.) The problem is that it is no longer something most programmers would use in the real world and thus is likely forgotten. Knuth sits on that shelf but I don't think it's been opened in 20 years.

mre5765 Mar 5, 2017 9:13 am

FTA:

"But when he handed his answers back after about 10 minutes of work, the official told him his answers were wrong."

Solving the BST problem in ten minutes is actually impressive. I couldn't do it that fast.

Assuming his answers were correct, mostly likely the CBP was doing a law enforcement trick: lie to the suspect to see if he cracks.


Originally Posted by GUWonder (Post 27979782)
I know full well what I meant and what I wrote better than anyone beside myself.

I love that line. Gonna appropriate it.


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