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How will TSA respond to FLL baggage claim shooting?

How will TSA respond to FLL baggage claim shooting?

Old Jan 7, 2017, 8:17 am
  #31  
 
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Out of curiosity, when did the FAA set rules for transporting firearms? I presume that such rules far pre-dated the TSA.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 8:37 am
  #32  
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Originally Posted by petaluma1
Out of curiosity, when did the FAA set rules for transporting firearms? I presume that such rules far pre-dated the TSA.
Don't know the exact date but has been the way it is now for many years.

I don't know if a security system could be devised that would mitigate each and every threat vector, especially without stripping the rights from everyone else.

Move the checkpoint back and that becomes the new attack point and so forth. Where does it end?

About two million people fly each day in the U.S. and this nut bag is only a blip on the whole scheme of things. Not saying that this attack wasn't horrible because it was but you don't go overboard to fix a problem that is unlikely to happen again. If we use that kind of logic then shouldn't demand that all airplanes be grounded since we know that there will be crashes in future years?
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 8:59 am
  #33  
 
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If this attack took place at Walmart, would there be a call to have security screenings at Walmart? Why is baggage claim at an airport a more sensitive area that requires security?

It's like a hotel or train station lobby. The same risks exist in any public space.

The fact that this public space was connected to an airport should somehow entitle it to be more secure?
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 9:04 am
  #34  
 
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Originally Posted by Boggie Dog
Don't know the exact date but has been the way it is now for many years.

I don't know if a security system could be devised that would mitigate each and every threat vector, especially without stripping the rights from everyone else.

Move the checkpoint back and that becomes the new attack point and so forth. Where does it end?

About two million people fly each day in the U.S. and this nut bag is only a blip on the whole scheme of things. Not saying that this attack wasn't horrible because it was but you don't go overboard to fix a problem that is unlikely to happen again. If we use that kind of logic then shouldn't demand that all airplanes be grounded since we know that there will be crashes in future years?
Originally Posted by HofstraJet
If this attack took place at Walmart, would there be a call to have security screenings at Walmart? Why is baggage claim at an airport a more sensitive area that requires security?

It's like a hotel or train station lobby. The same risks exist in any public space.

The fact that this public space was connected to an airport should somehow entitle it to be more secure?
Sadly, as most of us know, there are people who expect the governent to keep them safe from any eventuality. Those same people don't seem to have a clue that their home/car is a far more dangerous place than any airport (or Walmart).
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 9:25 am
  #35  
 
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Originally Posted by davie355
Maybe TSA will require all luggage containing firearms to be checked to the destination baggage office, where unclaimed and oversized bags are currently sent, so that some verification (not just ID, but e.g. whether the passenger is sober) can be performed before pickup.
This actually isn't a bad suggestion. If there was a way to easily require that no one be allowed to pick up a gun without a verification that they were, at that moment, sober and sane, I would support it. Of course, there isn't, but in this particular situation, there is, so why not apply it?
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 9:38 am
  #36  
 
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Originally Posted by You want to go where?
This actually isn't a bad suggestion. If there was a way to easily require that no one be allowed to pick up a gun without a verification that they were, at that moment, sober and sane, I would support it. Of course, there isn't, but in this particular situation, there is, so why not apply it?
How are you going to prove that someone is sane? Sober, yes, but sane - very difficult for even a professional to do. Certainly no one from TSA has the capability - unless, of course, they are a mind-reading BDO.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 9:40 am
  #37  
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Originally Posted by You want to go where?
This actually isn't a bad suggestion. If there was a way to easily require that no one be allowed to pick up a gun without a verification that they were, at that moment, sober and sane, I would support it. Of course, there isn't, but in this particular situation, there is, so why not apply it?
So this guy picks up his bag with checked weapon at the baggage office. How does that change what happens next? The person still has immediate access to the weapon.

Most airports I've been in has baggage offices co-located at baggage claim areas anyhow.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 9:55 am
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Originally Posted by petaluma1
How are you going to prove that someone is sane? Sober, yes, but sane - very difficult for even a professional to do. Certainly no one from TSA has the capability - unless, of course, they are a mind-reading BDO.
Obviously you cannot prove it. However, it is relatively easy to ascertain the reverse. As you have indicated, sobriety is easy. I'm not asking for perfection. However, I am sure that you have encountered people who you are able to ascertain are not of sound mind in 15-30 seconds. Don't let the perfect be the enemy of the good.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 10:31 am
  #39  
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Originally Posted by HofstraJet
If this attack took place at Walmart, would there be a call to have security screenings at Walmart? Why is baggage claim at an airport a more sensitive area that requires security?

It's like a hotel or train station lobby. The same risks exist in any public space.

The fact that this public space was connected to an airport should somehow entitle it to be more secure?
I agree. This has nothing to do with TSA or aviation security. The guy could just as easily have come from outside the airport. If we change the law to ban all firearms at the airport, that still won't prevent someone from showing up in baggage claim with a firearm.

We simply can not reasonably protect against all possibilities.

Frankly, I consider the risk of a firearm incident to be MUCH higher at shopping malls than airport baggage claim areas.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 10:33 am
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The extra step of going into the baggage office seems like it would be easy enough. It would reduce the chance of having the wrong person take the bag with the gun, allows an ID check and also would put "a last set of eyes" on the passenger. You could also impose a 30 minute or 60 minute waiting period to pick the gun up. You could require a skycap to take the bag and load it into a vehicle. A fee could be charged to pay for the extra steps. The wait alone might uncover someone that is unstable or deter someone with criminal intent. Loopholes would remain for sure.

Still no solution for this person doing the exact same thing, but in Alaska and never even flyng: walk into baggage claim at ANC with a gun in a duffel bag, go to the restroom and load it, and then walk out and start shooting.

I do notice a lot of lightly used and totally unsecure restrooms scattered around baggage claim areas. Maybe that can be looked at.

Has it been announced how and when this person obtained the handgun? And was his mental health status in the databases used to screen purchases?
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 10:40 am
  #41  
 
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Originally Posted by GUWonder
I'm curious if this shooter had gotten PreCheck on his boarding passes for his ANC-MSP-FLL trip? It's not like it would have been his first time.
I don't recall reading if he was still active military, but if he is and had a military ID or DoD CAC, the answer is probably 'yes.'
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 11:06 am
  #42  
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Originally Posted by Justin026
The extra step of going into the baggage office seems like it would be easy enough. It would reduce the chance of having the wrong person take the bag with the gun, allows an ID check and also would put "a last set of eyes" on the passenger. You could also impose a 30 minute or 60 minute waiting period to pick the gun up. You could require a skycap to take the bag and load it into a vehicle. A fee could be charged to pay for the extra steps. The wait alone might uncover someone that is unstable or deter someone with criminal intent. Loopholes would remain for sure.

Still no solution for this person doing the exact same thing, but in Alaska and never even flyng: walk into baggage claim at ANC with a gun in a duffel bag, go to the restroom and load it, and then walk out and start shooting.

I do notice a lot of lightly used and totally unsecure restrooms scattered around baggage claim areas. Maybe that can be looked at.

Has it been announced how and when this person obtained the handgun? And was his mental health status in the databases used to screen purchases?
Nope. I am totally against your suggestions, particularly the idea of additional fees.

It's complete overkill that will only impose greater burdens and inconvenience on innocent people while doing nothing to actually stop nutters looking to wreak havoc. The most it will do is temporarily inconvenience a nutter.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 11:19 am
  #43  
 
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Originally Posted by Justin026
The extra step of going into the baggage office seems like it would be easy enough. It would reduce the chance of having the wrong person take the bag with the gun, allows an ID check and also would put "a last set of eyes" on the passenger. You could also impose a 30 minute or 60 minute waiting period to pick the gun up. You could require a skycap to take the bag and load it into a vehicle. A fee could be charged to pay for the extra steps. The wait alone might uncover someone that is unstable or deter someone with criminal intent. Loopholes would remain for sure.

Still no solution for this person doing the exact same thing, but in Alaska and never even flyng: walk into baggage claim at ANC with a gun in a duffel bag, go to the restroom and load it, and then walk out and start shooting.

I do notice a lot of lightly used and totally unsecure restrooms scattered around baggage claim areas. Maybe that can be looked at.

Has it been announced how and when this person obtained the handgun? And was his mental health status in the databases used to screen purchases?
The passenger who correctly and legally checks a weapon has a key to the locked box that contains the gun. No one else has the key to open the box so it's very unlikely that a stranger could take the bag and have access to the gun in a timely manner.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 11:20 am
  #44  
 
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Originally Posted by chollie
Nope. I am totally against your suggestions, particularly the idea of additional fees.

It's complete overkill that will only impose greater burdens and inconvenience on innocent people while doing nothing to actually stop nutters looking to wreak havoc. The most it will do is temporarily inconvenience a nutter.
Amen.
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Old Jan 7, 2017, 11:36 am
  #45  
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For those advocating burdensome requirements for arriving pax with checked firearms, keep in mind that unless TSA completely dropped the ball, like all other pax checking firearms, this guy got special attention in Alaska when he checked in. He had to declare his firearm and provide TSA with access to the bag before he actually surrendered it to the airlines.

He didn't set off any alarms there, and we are talking a part of the country where folks with firearms is not a rare and unusual sight.
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