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MORE FREE passes to Precheck - Managed Inclusion III

MORE FREE passes to Precheck - Managed Inclusion III

Old Jun 1, 15, 5:26 am
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Saving pre check from managed inclusion

This is a DL related issue, and I am aware there is a "definitive thread" Though since this is such an important issue for travelers I think it needs to be in its own thread.

H.R. 2127 was introduced at the end of April & is currently awaiting committee approval. The "Securing Expedited Screening Act" would finally outlaw managed inclusion by the TSA. As most people here have paid for pre check/global entry we went through the process & paid our fees. Now people just walk on in & clog the lines up making pre check pointless.

Everyone on here needs to contact their local representative to voice their opinion on why this bill matters.

The link below gives you the fact sheet on H.R. 2127

http://chsdemocrats.house.gov/sitedo...afactsheet.pdf
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Old Jun 1, 15, 6:27 am
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You are combining two different issues. TSA's goal is to keep flying safe. If this can be done with managed inclusion, there should be more managed inclusion. You want the lines to be clear, which is a separate issue. Forcing more people through more intrusive screening isn't something that should be done in order for you to have faster moving lines. Perhaps it's time for there to be frequent flyer pre-check lines, like there are for the regular screening. That could both solve the issue of being stuck behind the person shocked to find out water is a liquid and metal detectors detect metal and having to pay for additional unnecessary screening. Face it: Not a single incident can be traced to allowing managed inclusion, so it doesn't appear to be an issue.
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Old Jun 1, 15, 6:46 am
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Originally Posted by CJKatl View Post
You are combining two different issues. TSA's goal is to keep flying safe. If this can be done with managed inclusion, there should be more managed inclusion. You want the lines to be clear, which is a separate issue. Forcing more people through more intrusive screening isn't something that should be done in order for you to have faster moving lines. Perhaps it's time for there to be frequent flyer pre-check lines, like there are for the regular screening. That could both solve the issue of being stuck behind the person shocked to find out water is a liquid and metal detectors detect metal and having to pay for additional unnecessary screening. Face it: Not a single incident can be traced to allowing managed inclusion, so it doesn't appear to be an issue.
+1.

I actually think that most passengers should experience Pre-style screening. TSA/airports just needs to devote more lanes to that experience than they currently do, to accommodate the inclusion of more people.

And priority Pre-check lines would be nice, too.
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Old Jun 1, 15, 7:00 am
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Originally Posted by gooselee View Post
+1.



And priority Pre-check lines would be nice, too.
You cant have it both ways. Managed inclusion is going to funnel into pre check, and TSA will continue to add more passengers into managed inclusions to "justify the costs" of the lane. Priority pre check lines would just be pre check without managed inclusion, which is my point exactly. Also how do you determine who gets priority? Frequent flyer status would not work, and using people who already signed up for pre check/global entry just goes back to my point above.

What I do not understand is why do people who did NOT go through the hassle of signing up/consenting to all the background checks get the same service? How can they say that person A who got managed inclusion is of a low level threat without the additional background checks etc? Might as well make every lane pre check then because it defeats the purpose of background checks/interviews/finger print scanning/ etc

I have talked with TSA supervisors etc at multiple airports, and all want managed inclusion to go away.

The "cost justification" from DC of more people going through, and thus utilizing personnel is wrong in practice. Most airports that have managed inclusion I see anywhere from 3-5 extra employees working pre check to yell "dont take off your shoes, leave everything in your bag, etc"

You cant expect people who 9 times out of 10 are used to the normal way go to pre check 1 out of 10 times and know they can leave all this stuff on/in their bag.

The original point of pre check was moving people who are low threats & travel oftenish through quickly with as minimal a disruption as possible. Now getting clogged with people & especially kids who do not know what they are doing makes the program pointless.

Last edited by vincentharris; Jun 1, 15 at 7:07 am
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Old Jun 1, 15, 7:23 am
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Originally Posted by vincentharris View Post
You cant have it both ways. Managed inclusion is going to funnel into pre check, and TSA will continue to add more passengers into managed inclusions to "justify the costs" of the lane. Priority pre check lines would just be pre check without managed inclusion, which is my point exactly. Also how do you determine who gets priority? Frequent flyer status would not work, and using people who already signed up for pre check/global entry just goes back to my point above.

What I do not understand is why do people who did NOT go through the hassle of signing up/consenting to all the background checks get the same service? How can they say that person A who got managed inclusion is of a low level threat without the additional background checks etc? Might as well make every lane pre check then because it defeats the purpose of background checks/interviews/finger print scanning/ etc

I have talked with TSA supervisors etc at multiple airports, and all want managed inclusion to go away.

The "cost justification" from DC of more people going through, and thus utilizing personnel is wrong in practice. Most airports that have managed inclusion I see anywhere from 3-5 extra employees working pre check to yell "dont take off your shoes, leave everything in your bag, etc"

You cant expect people who 9 times out of 10 are used to the normal way go to pre check 1 out of 10 times and know they can leave all this stuff on/in their bag.

The original point of pre check was moving people who are low threats & travel oftenish through quickly with as minimal a disruption as possible. Now getting clogged with people & especially kids who do not know what they are doing makes the program pointless.
You misunderstand. I don't think PreCheck-style screening should be some super-elite lane that only a very few people get to use. I think that type of screening should be the norm (agreeing with the part in your post that I bolded), and the more intrusive body scanner/unpack your life screening should be the exception.

However, in order to move more people through PreCheck screening, TSA and airport authorities need to provide more lanes for that type of screening.
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Old Jun 1, 15, 7:28 am
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Originally Posted by vincentharris View Post
What I do not understand is why do people who did NOT go through the hassle of signing up/consenting to all the background checks get the same service?
They're not guaranteed to get it. This is like saying you shouldn't get F as an upgrade because other people paid for F (assuming complimentary UGs are part of the FFP).

How can they say that person A who got managed inclusion is of a low level threat without the additional background checks etc?
For the last 10+ years, pretty much everyone at a US TSA checkpoint has been a low threat level.
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Old Jun 1, 15, 7:33 am
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Originally Posted by bennos View Post
They're not guaranteed to get it. This is like saying you shouldn't get F as an upgrade because other people paid for F (assuming complimentary UGs are part of the FFP).

Right but my point is what background checks did they do verify managed inclusion?


For the last 10+ years, pretty much everyone at a US TSA checkpoint has been a low threat level.
Huh? TSA has 1000's of stories of arrests etc

Also if everyone paid for F why would I be upset not getting an upgrade? I dont understand that.
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Old Jun 1, 15, 7:34 am
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Originally Posted by gooselee View Post
You misunderstand. I don't think PreCheck-style screening should be some super-elite lane that only a very few people get to use. I think that type of screening should be the norm (agreeing with the part in your post that I bolded), and the more intrusive body scanner/unpack your life screening should be the exception.

However, in order to move more people through PreCheck screening, TSA and airport authorities need to provide more lanes for that type of screening.
I agree they need more lanes for pre check, and eventually return to the system of pre check as the norm. The problem is managed inclusion is not doing this right, they are adding a crazy amount of extra people to the same one pre check line. There are only so many people you can funnel through one line per hour, and they are well exceeding that now.
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Old Jun 1, 15, 7:44 am
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It also seems unfair to those who have paid for PreCheck or GE.

WPCBPCOBGE = what precheck, buy precheck or buy global entry.
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Old Jun 1, 15, 7:49 am
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Originally Posted by vincentharris View Post
I agree they need more lanes for pre check, and eventually return to the system of pre check as the norm. The problem is managed inclusion is not doing this right, they are adding a crazy amount of extra people to the same one pre check line. There are only so many people you can funnel through one line per hour, and they are well exceeding that now.
Right - we're identifying the same problem, but with different solutions.

My understanding of what you're saying is that line congestion should be solved by reducing the number of people sent through PreCheck.

I'm saying that line congestion should be solved by expanding the number of PreCheck lines available, in order to accomodate that increased number of people.
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Old Jun 1, 15, 7:56 am
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The TSA sees precheck as a revenue generator now... the 'managed inclusion' is like the try-before-you-buy thing to get some other pax to think, gee this is much better and sign up. As more people fork over the cash, the managed inclusion will decrease just like upgrades went down with FCM.
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Old Jun 1, 15, 8:00 am
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Originally Posted by gooselee View Post
Right - we're identifying the same problem, but with different solutions.

My understanding of what you're saying is that line congestion should be solved by reducing the number of people sent through PreCheck.

I'm saying that line congestion should be solved by expanding the number of PreCheck lines available, in order to accomodate that increased number of people.
Either way I could care less the route we take to get there as long as we get there

A reduction in the traffic jam needs to happen via less people or more lanes available.
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Old Jun 1, 15, 9:13 am
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Also, travelling with a stroller should disqualify you from TSA Pre. I can't remember the last time people going through with one of those things (and all the other stuff that is brought along) did not cause a backup in the line.
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Old Jun 1, 15, 9:15 am
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I am moving this over to the Trusted Travelers forum which is the appropriate home for this discussion.

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Old Jun 1, 15, 10:21 am
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Originally Posted by Ben and Jerry View Post
Also, travelling with a stroller should disqualify you from TSA Pre. I can't remember the last time people going through with one of those things (and all the other stuff that is brought along) did not cause a backup in the line.
I noticed on our trip a few weeks ago that our twin toddlers got PreCheck on their boarding passes both ways, I assume because their parents both had it due to GE. ^

The four of us getting through the line, with strollers and carseats, is no slower than many other folks I've seen in PreCheck (not saying we're the fastest, but we're far from the slowest).
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