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-   Checkpoints and Borders Policy Debate (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate-687/)
-   -   Why PreCheck has failed to keep its promise (https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/checkpoints-borders-policy-debate/1585082-why-precheck-has-failed-keep-its-promise.html)

chollie Jun 21, 2017 4:05 pm

That could only happen at an airport that thinks ID is a vital component of security.

Which is only the whole US. (sigh)

Global321 Jun 21, 2017 7:26 pm


Originally Posted by TWA884 (Post 28471203)
Global Entry has nothing to do with the operating airline. The GE kiosks scan the passports, compare passengers' details with the flight manifests which all airlines must submit on flights arriving at the US from abroad and verify identities by fingerprints.

As has been extensively discussed in the TSA Pre✓® ONLY with Participating Airlines [merged threads], most airlines are welcome to participate in the PreCheck program. In order to do so, they must first have the technical capability to submit the requisite passenger information, i.e., KTN, to the TSA and receive a response which is then encoded in the boarding pass with a digital signature.

Yes and No (about the airlines)

All inbound airlines must submit their manifests to the USA. That is how they know your flight number.

If an airline has the capability to submit your inbound information, it stands to reason they have the capability to submit your outbound information. Maybe TSA needs to do some connecting on the backend to link Precheck and passport numbers, but it is infinitely doable... or TSA could make PC/GE a single program.) So all international airlines have the technical capability.

TWA884 Jun 21, 2017 8:40 pm


Originally Posted by Global321 (Post 28472008)
If an airline has the capability to submit your inbound information, it stands to reason they have the capability to submit your outbound information. Maybe TSA needs to do some connecting on the backend to link Precheck and passport numbers, but it is infinitely doable... or TSA could make PC/GE a single program.) So all international airlines have the technical capability.

The technical limitations, and especially the digital signature requirement, have been extensively discussed in the thread that I linked. Take a look at these two posts, 82 and 87.

FWIIW, GE is run by the CBP and PreCheck is run by the TSA; those are two separate agencies.

GUWonder Jun 22, 2017 2:03 am


Originally Posted by Global321 (Post 28472008)
Yes and No (about the airlines)

All inbound airlines must submit their manifests to the USA. That is how they know your flight number.

If an airline has the capability to submit your inbound information, it stands to reason they have the capability to submit your outbound information. Maybe TSA needs to do some connecting on the backend to link Precheck and passport numbers, but it is infinitely doable... or TSA could make PC/GE a single program.) So all international airlines have the technical capability.

Global Entry participation is independent of the airlines meeting US Govt requirements, for the passenger to be able to use GE. PreCheck participation is not independent of the airlines meeting US Govt requirements before passengers on the carrier can use PreCheck for the carrier's flights.

GE kiosks have been used by me even when the system failed to figure out which flights I had come in on.

Global321 Jun 22, 2017 6:47 am


Originally Posted by TWA884 (Post 28472167)
The technical limitations, and especially the digital signature requirement, have been extensively discussed in the thread that I linked. Take a look at these two posts, 82 and 87.

FWIIW, GE is run by the CBP and PreCheck is run by the TSA; those are two separate agencies.

Yes you are correct. But, if you can sign up for both at the same time, it means they are sharing some data already. Extend it and allow for pre-check on all airlines using your GE credentials.


Originally Posted by GUWonder (Post 28472842)
Global Entry participation is independent of the airlines meeting US Govt requirements, for the passenger to be able to use GE. PreCheck participation is not independent of the airlines meeting US Govt requirements before passengers on the carrier can use PreCheck for the carrier's flights.

GE kiosks have been used by me even when the system failed to figure out which flights I had come in on.

Yes, because they identify who you are. And that brings it back to my original point... tie PC to the individual, not the airline, at least when flying internationally. It would be as simple as presenting your passport to the PC dragon and connecting to the GE system and verifying you have signed up for PC. Some hardware, a column in the database and some code. The cost savings in terms of personnel would be huge.

If GE is good enough to let you into the country, surely it is good enough to let you through expedited security.

Taking it a step further, it is a very silly system when, on connecting flights, your need to go back through security a second time is not dependent on airline or risk, but rather airport layout.

GUWonder Jun 22, 2017 7:20 am


Originally Posted by Global321 (Post 28473440)
Yes you are correct. But, if you can sign up for both at the same time, it means they are sharing some data already. Extend it and allow for pre-check on all airlines using your GE credentials.



Yes, because they identify who you are. And that brings it back to my original point... tie PC to the individual, not the airline, at least when flying internationally. It would be as simple as presenting your passport to the PC dragon and connecting to the GE system and verifying you have signed up for PC. Some hardware, a column in the database and some code. The cost savings in terms of personnel would be huge.

If GE is good enough to let you into the country, surely it is good enough to let you through expedited security.

Taking it a step further, it is a very silly system when, on connecting flights, your need to go back through security a second time is not dependent on airline or risk, but rather airport layout.

The US/TSA deliberately chose not to grant all airlines serving the US with access to the means to designate boarding passes with PreCheck. The US/TSA decision over which airlines to allow to participate in PreCheck doesn't have any direct relationship with GE.

Keep in mind the TSA doesn't even want to always give GE members PreCheck even when just flying on TSA PreCheck participating carriers -- carriers the USG has approved for TSA PreCheck participation. So I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for a GE card to work wonders at the TSA TDC unless and until they go to a real-time, online, ID-based check at the TSA TDC.

petaluma1 Jun 24, 2017 6:11 am

PreCheck and Groupon
 
https://www.groupon.com/deals/propco-marketing-305

Might TSA be getting ever more desperate to enroll travelers?


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