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The TSA is looking for Bitcoin
The TSA is looking for Bitcoin
Here’s what I think happened from their perspective. Obviously, the TSA has been trained, although poorly, to look for Bitcoin. They are apparently now trying to catch money launderers in addition to terrorists, and large tubes of tooth paste. My hoodie is probably what caught their attention, and everything after that received extra attention. When they saw all the metal lapel pins in my bag they probably thought they hit the jackpot on a stockpile of Casascius coins. Whatever training they had it probably included that stock photo of brass tokens everyone uses. My evasiveness only quickened their blood lust, as they imagined a big bust, and possibly a promotion down the security track. It was an open faced lie when they said they “saw” Bitcoins in my bag. Always remember bureaucrats can legally lie to you, but lying to them, even by mistake is a serious crime they’ll use as leverage to coerce further cooperation. They didn’t inquire about my phone, or my laptop, or my USB drive, which makes me think their Bitcoin training wasn’t very good, or that these particular bureaucrats didn’t pay very close attention. But, if the TSA is going to be looking for Bitcoin, they can use that pretense to search any person, at any time, to any degree. It’s entirely possible that a traveler could be carrying thousands of Casascius coins which are not loaded, and worth little more their value in brass. It’s also possible that a traveler could be carrying one Casascius coin that has been loaded with hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of Bitcoin. What DO they think bitcoins look like? |
"Bill and his wife were sitting on a bench in the terminal waiting for me as I approached them. Then two men stepped between us, both wearing dress shirts, one orange and one blue. The orange shirt asked where I was traveling to. I replied “Earth.” This was not intended to be antagonistic. I usually reply that way when asked where I am from. It’s a product of my love for science fiction. He asked me to be more specific and I said, “The Northern part.” Admittedly snarky, but still not malicious. I didn’t know who these men were. I had already been cleared by security, and based on their attire and their forwardness I thought they might be other attendees of the conference on their way home. I was joking with them, like I do with most equals."
Why talk to them at all? :confused: "Go pound sand!" |
What a waste of everybody's time and resources. You're not gonna achieve your political goals in airport screening.
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I don't think this is a matter of looking for Bitcoin per se, but rather looking for financial smuggling and not understanding what they're doing. Definitely out of line, though.
It's just another example of why I say the real purpose of the TSA is bypassing the 4th in the war on drugs. |
Haha... If they insist they know what bitcoin looks like, we're screwed if we actually rely on them to recognize WEI.
Remember, these are highly trained professionals. |
Originally Posted by javabytes
(Post 22417961)
Haha... If they insist they know what bitcoin looks like, we're screwed if we actually rely on them to recognize WEI.
Remember, these are highly trained professionals. |
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now i know what i will do. I order a big bag of them golden chocolate coins i loved as a child just to .... with them :D
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Originally Posted by Loren Pechtel
(Post 22417600)
I don't think this is a matter of looking for Bitcoin per se, but rather looking for financial smuggling and not understanding what they're doing. Definitely out of line, though.
It's just another example of why I say the real purpose of the TSA is bypassing the 4th in the war on drugs. I thought the TSA comeback was more out of line than usual. This time they didn't even try to pretend that the agent stumbled on the 'bitcoins' during a normal screening process. They made it abundantly clear that they're performing both TSO and CBP duties and they are deliberately watching for large sums of money - currency, sequential checks and now 'bitcoins'. So much for Bierfeldt. :rolleyes: What next? Suspicious amount of jewelry or something that looks like a pouch of diamonds or several high end watches will be cause for suspicion too? Are they going to check prepaid debit card balances or watch for suspicious quantities of gift cards? |
Originally Posted by chollie
(Post 22464622)
(bolding mine)
I thought the TSA comeback was more out of line than usual. This time they didn't even try to pretend that the agent stumbled on the 'bitcoins' during a normal screening process. They made it abundantly clear that they're performing both TSO and CBP duties and they are deliberately watching for large sums of money - currency, sequential checks and now 'bitcoins'. So much for Bierfeldt. :rolleyes: What next? Suspicious amount of jewelry or something that looks like a pouch of diamonds or several high end watches will be cause for suspicion too? Are they going to check prepaid debit card balances or watch for suspicious quantities of gift cards? |
Originally Posted by flyerhog
(Post 22469086)
That's already the norm with customs procedure around the world. If you can't prove the source of high value items, they are automatically presumed to be of criminal origins. After all, there are other legal means to transfer cash without carrying a huge amount of high value items through customs.
But this was TSA, not Customs; in fact, as far as I can tell, it was a domestic flight in the USA so Customs issues have no relevance. TSA is tasked with enforcing security processes, not with customs or more general law enforcement such as searching for goods of "criminal origin." |
Originally Posted by Ayn R Key
(Post 22416823)
The TSA is looking for Bitcoin
So, they are looking for the tokens some people use to carry bitcoins, thinking those ARE the bitcoins. What DO they think bitcoins look like? End of picture.:D:D:D |
Reading this thread I had a sudden thought. Do you think that the failure of Mt. Gox was actually caused by a governmental agency for the purposes of destabilizing the Bitcoin market to end a "threat" to currency control?
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Originally Posted by sbrower
(Post 22472684)
Reading this thread I had a sudden thought. Do you think that the failure of Mt. Gox was actually caused by a governmental agency for the purposes of destabilizing the Bitcoin market to end a "threat" to currency control?
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Originally Posted by RadioGirl
(Post 22471180)
Sure.
But this was TSA, not Customs; in fact, as far as I can tell, it was a domestic flight in the USA so Customs issues have no relevance. TSA is tasked with enforcing security processes, not with customs or more general law enforcement such as searching for goods of "criminal origin." TSA seems to think it's the FBI and CBP rolled into one, with absolutely no limits to its scope or powers of search. I've always thought that this is because the head of the agency is a former FBI manager who seems to regard the Constitution as a pesky piece of paper that he's able to joyously ignore at TSA, all in the name of "safety". This whole money thing has always steamed me. I think if I were rich enough, I'd love to travel around with a wad of cash - say, $11,000 - just to piss off the rank and file TSOs who are always on the lookout for that big drug money catch. Maybe we should all start putting wads of kids' play money in our carry-ons, and bags of talcum powder or non-dairy creamer powder. If everybody carried it, eventually they'd stop noticing it, just like stainless steel pens and 14" titanium knitting needles. Or the 36" steel locking cable I carry for my laptop. |
Originally Posted by flyerhog
(Post 22473620)
Or the Magic the Gathering Online Bitcoin Exchange is simply incompetent to handle business transactions. Occam's razor, my friend.
2. Mt. Gox said that not only did they lose the Bitcoins, but they ALSO lost all the money in their bank accounts. Online banking isn't yet Magic the Gathering. 3. When you take a 50 year view of ACTUAL disclosures, "governmental action" may be the more likely explanation. Isn't it necessary to agree on the "most likely" cause in order to perform a valid analysis? |
Originally Posted by sbrower
(Post 22475750)
1. I am a lawyer. While I believe in the principle of Occam's razor, I see way too many exceptions.
Mike |
Originally Posted by WillCAD
(Post 22475690)
This whole money thing has always steamed me. I think if I were rich enough, I'd love to travel around with a wad of cash - say, $11,000 - just to piss off the rank and file TSOs who are always on the lookout for that big drug money catch.
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Originally Posted by FredAnderssen
(Post 22485145)
And you can travel with far less -- just a few thousand dollars -- and still be harassed and possibly have the cash confiscated.
Every single non-money piece of paper would have the following: "Only an idiot would not know that I can travel domestically with however much cash I pleased. So, why are you reading this?" |
Originally Posted by sbrower
(Post 22472684)
Reading this thread I had a sudden thought. Do you think that the failure of Mt. Gox was actually caused by a governmental agency for the purposes of destabilizing the Bitcoin market to end a "threat" to currency control?
If you want to monitor the market, why not co-opt (at least some) "supplier(s)" to the market and (at least some of the) market exchanges? If you want to monitor the market, why not disrupt those who undermine your ability to monitor the market? This wouldn't be the first time a government has taken such an approach to wage one or more of its non-winnable "wars". Regardless of who created the product/"currency". |
Originally Posted by InkUnderNails
(Post 22485947)
If I were to try this little experiment, I would have a stack of bill sized paper topped by a single large bill, maybe a $100 but more likely a well used $50. The stack would be securely wrapped in shrink wrap and taped.
Every single non-money piece of paper would have the following: "Only an idiot would not know that I can travel domestically with however much cash I pleased. So, why are you reading this?" How about a poker chip from a large Las Vegas casino? Aren't there ones that are worth 100 grand? One would think the TSA would be looking for those, too. |
Originally Posted by FredAnderssen
(Post 22488344)
That's a great idea. It's always fun to mess with the idiots of the TSA.
How about a poker chip from a large Las Vegas casino? Aren't there ones that are worth 100 grand? One would think the TSA would be looking for those, too. Somehow, I think a LOT of TSOs would be really, really eager to confiscate that box. http://www.oldtimecandy.com/assets/i...grand_36ct.jpg |
Originally Posted by WillCAD
(Post 22489184)
How about a box of these? :cool:
Somehow, I think a LOT of TSOs would be really, really eager to confiscate that box. Now that's my idea of money laundering! |
Originally Posted by FredAnderssen
(Post 22490153)
:D
Now that's my idea of money laundering! |
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