DUKEswoosh

Apologies if this has already been posted, I have not been able to find it on FT yet. Matthew over at "Lets Live and Fly" (a reliable travel blog) has a worrisome tale about how he was forced off EWR-IST last week for taking a photograph of his seat. Any thoughts on this one?

http://upgrd.com/matthew/thrown-off-...-pictures.html

Lurker1999

If the story is as sold and he only took one photo, stopped when requested and did not antagonize the FA the simple solution is to send his last MP statement to AA, complete the EXP challenge and never look back.

He will never get a decent reply as UA will simply bury this in a jumble of employee privacy and "overabundance of caution" instead of simply reassigning that FA to some department where she doesn't have to interact with any passengers ever again.

It makes me wonder what will happen one of these days when I happen to take a photo of my meal on the wrong UA flight.

MBS MillionMiler

Wow...

While there are two sides to every story, I can't help but think of the old addage about absolute power corrupts absolutely.

dinoscool3

It has been said that many PMUA FAs are uncertain about photography, I've never experienced it but it has happened a few times. This was very unacceptable though.

GoAmtrak

Paging MatthewLAX! This was very disturbing to read, along with the comments in the post vouching for you and attesting to how negative the crew was. Please let us know if you receive any follow-up from UA.

scottish_colin

This just reinforces my long held belief that it's never worth it to argue, explain yourself, etc. whilst on a flight. Just do whatever the flight crew asks you to, surreptitiously note names and details, and contact United after the fact.

FlyWorld

1. I am flabbergasted.

2. He says the aircraft had the "Continental BusinessFirst seat" and that it was "staffed by a legacy United crew." Can this be true? Are sUA crews flying 767's with CO BF hard product out of EWR?

3. I tend to side with the writer, here, for the most part, but he lost me when he chose to use the word "terrorist." Actually using that word, while engaged in a confrontation with the FA, on a flight leaving the NY area for a middle-eastern country is just plain stupid. He makes a big point about the fact that 9/11 happened more than 10 years ago but, fact is, like it or not, we've been in a perpetual state of war ever since then, and we still are. For all intensive purposes, in this context, 9/11 might as well have been yesterday. I think that's what ultimately got him into trouble.

4. I've found that sCO FAs, generally, are on a razor thin edge, looking for any opportunity to explode in rage against their customers. As an example, on a recent flight from MCO to SFO, I was loading my FAA-approved carry-on bag into the overhead bin, and I needed to push another piece of luggage over by about 1/4 inch to make room for mine. This process required me to spend, oh, about 3 seconds moving things around. An sCO FA on that flight walked up to me, then screamed at me and ordered me to immediately take my bag out and stop obstructing him from moving about the cabin. I was blocking him because I was loading my baggage, and the total delay was less than 2 seconds when he started screaming at and threatening me. I had no doubt from the tone and energy of the interaction that if I'd even done so much as breathe the wrong way, he'd have called DHS and had me pulled off the aircraft. With FAs like that, it's easy to see how this FA could have gone over the edge and lied to get the pax off the plane, no matter what the content or tone of the pax's response.

5. I wonder if the CoC contains this prohibition or if this is a rule that's not disclosed until after UA takes money for the ticket?

6. Taking a few photos of an aircraft is normal and common. The behavior of the FA was unusual from the get-go, not only that the FA cared, but also that the FA bothered to point to the "rule" in the magazine, and did it with two different pax. Curious to know what is the root cause of this interest in stopping casual photography. No doubt, this played some role in the story.

TakeTheATrain

I was just reading this a few minutes ago, and am absolutely shocked by the way the crew reacted. I cannot think of any apology that United could offer that would be acceptable after that kind of incident.

Another blogger from BoardingArea.com and said there was no loud or hostile comments, so it seems clear that the FA over-reacted and was power-tripping.

DUKEswoosh

I'd be curious to know if UA has a blanket policy about customers who use the word "terrorist" on-board as a commenter over at Matt's website has suggested. The TSA, for example, pulls no punches with this and even go as far as to advertise that these types of words are forbidden within the security screening point.

TakeTheATrain

I just looked through the contract of carriage and did not find anything banning photography. It looks like it's only in Hemispheres magazine.

FlyWorld

That seems unlikely to me, but we're probably dealing with a FA that has an extremely limited mental capacity, and in the FA's mind, the mere utterance of that word pushed him or her over the edge.

We cannot anticipate the state of mind of the various people we encounter while traveling, so it's beneficial not to speak words that that might cause an unstable person with limited mental bandwidth to implode.

Even if Matthew was entirely right, there's no benefit to provoking someone in this way.

edcho

What bothers me is that the "official" reason is that he was taking multiple pics and disobeyed the FA (which doesn't seem to be true). If he got thrown off for using the T-bomb then tell him! It makes the whole shady incident even shadier.

FlyWorld

I'm guessing that the pilot didn't think, know, or care about the details.

A pilot has a lot of work to do, and a lot of responsibility. He or she probably doesn't have the time or desire to study the situation carefully and prepare a detailed risk assessment of the situation. It's a lot easier to just get that person off the plane, and focus on doing the pre-flight work.

This sounds callous, and it is, but frankly, I don't want the pilots on my flights to be distracted thinking through a case like this. I want them end it and focus on their job which includes important calculations and safety checks with life and death implications.

So, when the FA told the captain there was a security concern, it was probably over.

FreFly

Are flight crews accountable to anybody? If a pilot decides to kick someone off the plane, does he have to prove a reasonable cause?

jbsay

Wow, just wow. I flew IST-EWR (and back) this week and took plenty of photos, both in the Y and BF cabins. UA cannot unilaterally modify its CoC (which makes no mention of any ban on photography) after a ticket is purchased and a contract is formed, no matter what Hemispheres magazine says. See Scutt v. LaSalle County Board, 97 Ill.App.3d 181, 423 N.E.2d 213 (3d Dist. 1981) (holding that enforceable contractual modification generally requires offer, acceptance, and consideration).

Matthew should sue UA in small claims court for the costs he incurred in making a separate reservation. If UA is smart, they will apologize profusely and offer him compensation for his inconvenience (on top of the rebooking costs).